Advice on school making child change school - bit of advice needed and a bit of a rant also. Sorry!

[lr2224]

I am interested in getting some advice/opinions from people.

As I mentioned before, my nephew is going through testing to see if he has a special need. He had an appointment with an EP yesterday and had one with a SALT the week before. They are currently compiling their reports but said they expect it is ADD with 'other complications' as they put it. They mentioned dyslexia and aspergers as well.

He has been having awful trouble at school since he started there in September. Since they found out he is being tested for things, they have tried to adapt slightly but probably not in the best way possible for what it is expected that he is struggling with.

On some levels the school have been helpful. The SENCO has said that she will try and give him the help that is recomended by the doctors before the LA make their assessment (he has had private assessments up to now and apparently the LA will not accept these findings but will want to test him again and come to their own conclusions), providing they can do it within their budget. On the other hand they have said some worrying things. In a conversation earlier the SENCO said to my sister, "We will have to see where the best place is for xxx to be taught, considering his problems", i.e. the school may want to send him to a 'special' school (sorry hate the word special as it isn't the correct word to use but don't know what else to call it). So now we are worried about this. I assume that she means that he is having behaviour problems therefore they want to send him to a school with other children with behavioral problems. That makes us really angry as we think that it would be the worst thing for him.

As far as we are concerned we don't see how it would help. He is in year 7 and every year since reception he has had an IEP. Each year the same points were on this and the school failed to do anything about it. At the time my sister didn't have a clue about what to do about this but she did ask them on several occassions to get him tested to see if they was a problem, something that they never bothered to do. So until he went to secondary school in September and things started to get really bad and my sister found out a bit more and took the matter in to her own hands, nothing had been done to help him. I think that this is why he is having the behavioral problems as basically he doesn't function in the same way as most other children and has never been given the help or support he needs to help him deal with it and be able to cope with being in school. So how on earth after the LA have failed him for so long, can the school turn round and hint at sending him to another school that would be better equipped to deal with him?!

Anyway, this comment has really upset us. Has anyone else had a similar experience? How easy would they find it to make him leave the school and send him to one with other children who have behavioral problems?

Although he isn't coping at school at the moment and is constantly in trouble, he is doing well academically. I can't see that lasting without help as we have been told that he can't process long pieces of text or instrucions being read out to him and also that after about 20 minutes his concentration totally dissapears. I assume that he has done well now as his other strengths are compensating for his weaknesses.

Whilst I'm on the topic, he is being put into set two for english but the teacher basically said that she can't see how long he will last there if he won't make the effort tto do his work and help himself! Clearly he can't help his problems so that really annoys me as well. He always starts of well in the lessons and then goes down hill which indicates what the doctors have said about his concentration. He can't help the way he acts and isn't enjoying any of this! It annoys me as someone needs to help him so he can meet his full potential, not just say that if he doesn't conform on his own then he'll be moved down to a lower academic group!

Anyway...I am sorry to rant on. This has really got to all of us and upset me. Partly I just needed to vent a bit and partly i want advice on them making him go to a different school.

Thanks.

Your nephew's story could serve as a warning to others because your nephew has been badly let down by a system that is supposed to help him. Your sister has been kept in the dark as well over the years.

IEPs are not worth the paper they are written on if there is no actual back up in terms of additional support; support that should have been sought by his school years ago. Did no-one actually at that time suggest to your sister to apply for a Statement on his behalf?. Seems as well that his junior school did not bother applying for a Statement either. Which is very sad.

If your nephew does have AS, a pupil referral unit or behavioural unit is certainly not the place for him to attend.

If they are looking at a special school then he could only access such a place via a document called a Statement. Your sister can make an application on his behalf. its never too late.

Many LEAs are under no obligation to accept any private based reports; they do prefer their own. If your nephew is not already under the care of a developmental paed this is the person that should be seeing him, her GP can refer your nephew to such a person.

IPSEA are very good at the minefield that is the Statementing process and I suggest she looks at their website and contacts them asap - www.ipsea.org.uk. She may also want to contact SOS:SEN as they are helpful as well.

Firstly, thank you for your response.

No, no one suggested to my sister that she get him statmented or look into the fact there may be a problem. She has asked them to look at getting him some sort of help as she knew there was a problem but they never did anything and the things he did were never particularly bad. It was all related to getting up out his chair at inappropriate times, not putting his hand up, being rude occasionaly but not overly rude. Towards the end of primary school he was involved in some bickering in the playground but that was it, nothing more. A lot of people just said the whole 'boys will be boys' thing and so I think my sister partly believed it. She was so exhausted with dealing with him and his brother at home where the problems are also present.

He still isn't doing anything particularly bad. I think when a lot of people here the words ADD or ADHD they think off children being really nasty or being very very badly behaved. All of his getting into trouble involves him not staying seated in class, (something which is a real issue now he is at secondary school), not being able to stay focussed so not getting his work done and now he has started answering back to the teachers, which has come from him always getting in trouble for getting out of his seat and not getting his work done! He also struggles to understand verbal instructions, particularly when they are long, verbal instructions.

I just don't see how sending him to a behavioral unit will help at all. It really makes me angry that they are considering that as it is like they are giving up on him before they have even tried to help him.

He is one of the most loving, caring boys I know. It breaks my heart that when asked by the EP what he would like to change at school he said he would just like someone to help him more with his work. He's as sick of all of this as the rest of us!

The GP gave my sister the initial referral and then she has used her BUPA cover from there so he is seeing a paedtrician already and has also seen the SALT and EP. Once the report is prepared with recommendations it will help a bit but the SALT has been speaking to the school and she says that she is really concerned because they just don't seem to be taking on board what she is saying.

I believe that the school have now started the process with the LA to get him statmented but how long does it take? Next term is going to be horrible. We are so relieved that there's the two week break now until Christmas as the past few weeks have been so stressful and if there was any more of the term left i think he would have been excluded.

I know of a couple of children who have either ADD or ADHD and they cannot follow long and or complex instructions either. Both are not "bad" children but both certainly need extra support in class. One of these boys is now statemented; that has helped with regards to his school life.

I would agree that sending this child to a PRU will do him no favours whatsoever and could also make his problems worse.

I note that school have done the application, your sister should ensure that she has all copies of correspondence that the school have made re the application, she will know its been done then. Some schools can and do sit on such applications, this is partly why the parents should make applications rather than the school. Also parents have the right of appeal if the LEA say no.

Statementing as a process can take six months to complete (the first tricky bit is to get the LEA to agree to statutory assessment). You are looking at 26 weeks from start to finish and it may even go to Tribunal.

Your sister should also speak in the meantime to someone like IPSEA or SOS;SEN as they have much experience and can advise her. IPSEA's website also has information on exclusions with or without a statement. .

If a statement can be obtained the school will need to follow it - its a legally binding document unlike other plans.

Thank you for the advice.

I have a feeling this is going to be a very long process! I have been told that the county they live in is renowned for disputing the fact that children need a statement and to expect it to go to tribunal...well actually I have been told to expect it to be going to tribunal and then for them to agree to the statement at the 11th hour. I guess at least we know what to expect.

i will advice my sister to make sure she gets copies of the applications/any other documentation. Unfortunatly with Christmas I expect things will be delayed further. I will look on the IPSEA website as well.

Thank you. It's all so stressful and difficult to deal with as I'm sure anyone posting on these boards will have experienced. It's so difficult to know what to do for the best and meanwhile its the child who is suffering most and getting anxious about it. It's awful really.

Hi lr.

Well, the school have been truly useless. OK, the government tells the LEAs (illegally) to reduce the number of statements issued. And the LEAs set (illegal) limits on the number of statements they give and (illegally) tell the schools not to statement if they can avoid it. (Can you tell I think you need legal advice? ) But even so, the choice is not as black and white as to cope under IEP or go elsewhere. Many many children cope in mainstream with sufficient support, though of course they often need a statement to get the support they need. And if the SENCO thinks those are the only two options that says to me it's a pretty rubbish school. Nominally, the Head reports to the board of governors and there should be a governor on the board who is specifically responsible for SEN, so your sister could try talking to them - they are unlikely to change anything the Head has decided on, but if no decision has been taken they may be some help. Your other option of course is to try another mainstream school - what is clear from various threads on this board is that although all sorts of things are possible in mainstream schools, they only work with the buy-in of teaching staff and their attitude varies widely from school to school. Another ms school down the road could be more helpful.

Having said that - though it sounds as if mainstream would be the best place for him, don't discount specialist provision till you've got the results of his assessment, and contacted the relevant support groups to see what other children with similar issues have benefited from. For instance, he may concentrate much better in a very structured and calm environment, which no amount of support could provide in a busy noisy school. Special schools, or ms schools with special units, are very varied and you often don't know they exist on your doorstop till you start looking. The LEA should provide you with a list of all the specialist provision in the area if you ask them; if nothing else it gives you an idea of what the proposed alternatives mean.