Special needs in mainstream - starting reception

[PuffHorner]

DS is about having his reception induction sessions and a home visit. He recently has been given an EHCP and the mainstream school were reluctant to take him. The school has been named on his EHCP, but I do think they are going to keep trying to suggest that he is not right for mainstream.

Over the summer we’ve worked on his independence - he can toilet, dress and undress. He’s reading simple books, loves numbers. Behaviour is easy. He has a speech delay and can’t answer simple questions. But he tends to listen and understand.

I really want him in mainstream. However, the home visit felt very intense with lots of intrusive questions - about our family history, whether we’d had traumatic events in our life recently - while they did assessments on DS. Can he recognise his name, can he draw his face etc.

I don’t know if I’m being over sensitive, but I’m very, very nervous about his start to school - and that school, other parents think he shouldn’t be there. If people try to engage in conversation with him, he won’t respond, but he will do things, concentrate on activities etc.
I’m just wondering if anyone has experienced similar - and if they’ve felt a mainstream school has unfairly tried to ‘push out’ their SEN child? Schools are supposed to be inclusive (or so I thought) - but I’m not getting a sense of that so far…

Sadly, some schools aren’t as supportive as others. And, yes, some do try to manage out DC. However, schools objecting to being named when consulted isn’t necessarily about the individual child of their needs, but about politics and funding.

A special school can only be named against your wishes if placing in mainstream is incompatible with the efficient education of others, and there’s no reasonable steps that could be taken to avoid the incompatibility.

The best thing you can do is ensure the EHCP is watertight. No woolly and vague wording such as “access to”, “would benefit from”, “opportunities for”, “regular”, “e,g.”, such as”.

@OvertakenByLego

Thank you again, you replied to me before with helpful advice.

That was the schools line with me - to have the right support in place for him, which I do understand and agree with.
However, my feeling is that his needs are not that extreme - and from my teaching experience some time ago - I’ve had children with more significant needs - but I never taught with the thought process of we can’t cater for them, or to look for reasons to not accommodate them.
To me it feels like reputation and SATS results are all encompassing. When I spoke to the SEND lead, I think her turning point for taking him was that I said he knows letter sounds, numbers and can read simple texts.
It really shouldn’t be like this! All schools say ‘inclusive’. Are they? Because it feels like excluding - or looking to exclude before he has even started!

The risk isn't that the school will not accept your kid, it's that they'll overlook his needs because he's sitting quietly, he'll not make the progress he's capable of making and one, three, six years down the line you're fighting for special school.

The fact the school are being arsey us annoying but also useful if you can turn the school's concerns into help. So if they're worried about his verbal communication turn that into an argument for SALT. If school say his play skills are delayed - great - what's the plan to help him develop them? Etc.

God knows it's hard work, but it has to be better than watching a school babysit your child and waste their potential.

A child who can’t communicate needs the support in place from the beginning.

Some schools aren’t as inclusive as others. But, some schools that turn out to be inclusive when the child attends appear not to be because they object to being named when consulted - the consultation responses aren’t necessarily about what they think of the child.

This is so upsetting @PuffHorner he sounds lovely. In reality teachers are often in a difficult position regarding resourcing etc but the ethos of a school makes such a difference. My children are more straightforward but 2 are neurodivergent and their school has such an inclusive ethos and open communication channels.

Work wise I’ve had dealings with the ‘manage them out’ schools and more inclusive schools and often resourcing isn’t the main difference. Whilst I definitely think he sounds like he should be a valued member of the class. A lack of resources means more resourcing needs to be fought for not more children excluded. That said if the school is not usually inclusive I’d speak to other parents and make sure it’s a safe and happy place for him. Such a difficult time.

How have things progressed OP? I feel like I'm in a similar boat, and considering how to proceed. DS started reception on a reduced timetable (one hour a day) and at his three week review, despite what appeared to be glowing feedback from his TA, they're not increasing his time there. And we've been warned that although the time could increase up to half term, it would be reduced again as children "tend to take a step back" over half term. So an hour a day until November and even December sounds likely, and presumably he'll take a "step back" over the Xmas holiday so god knows where we'll be in January. Which is unworkable for a whole host of reasons. I feel he's being managed out, and was warned this might happen by friends working in other local schools so in a way I'm not surprised.

I'm assuming my next step is to re-apply for an EHCNA (and this time appeal, appeal, appeal until I get it) and try to get the school's support on this as presumably they will be able to evidence why they can only have him for one hour a day. But apply myself if they won't.

Apologies for the "all about me" response, but wondered if you were in a similar situation a few weeks in and could compare notes! Best of luck though, it's a rubbish situation to be in and, frankly, insulting and time wasting to everyone involved.

A lack of resources means more resourcing needs to be fought for not more children excluded.

Objecting to an EHCP consultation isn’t necessarily about excluding a child. It can be about fighting for more resources. Schools objecting during a consultation can result in additional support and funding.

@Scratchybaby it sounds like DS is being informally excluded. If you want DS to attend full-time (or part-time but for more than an hour) he can, unless the school is formally excluding or suspending him. Pupils are entitled to attend school full-time from the September following their 4th birthday. Parents can choose to send them part-time until they are of compulsory school age or not at all until compulsory school age or the beginning of the summer term, whichever is earlier, but it is the parents’ choice, not the schools.

Yes, request another EHCNA ASAP. Also, follow up verbal conversations with emails so you have a paper trail as evidence should you need it. When does DS turn 5?

Thanks @OvertakenByLego - he turns 5 at the end of January. It's just that I'm not sure I can stay employed if I have to hold out for that point - and even if I did, I have no reason to believe that they wouldn't cave, admit him full time, but then ring me every day saying they can't cope. Which would result in the exact same disruption to my job, just without any ability to forward plan and try to scrape together alternative childcare out of thin air.

And yes, applying again for an EHCNA, and absolutely agree about getting them to put things in writing. They've outlined their forward plan on a Friday afternoon at 5pm verbally, over the phone - so as of today I'm going to start reiterating what they say over the phone, by email, so they can then "correct" me if "that's not what they meant".

The frustrating thing is that I know he can learn - we've kept his private tutor from nursery and she's successfully doing letter sounds with him, and drawing activities to lay the groundwork for handwriting and she's doing it through 1-1 play activities. It's just that she doesn't set the precondition that he has to sit down to do adult-led table activities in order to do that learning. So school is focusing entirely on him cooperating with their need for crowd control (understandable), plus I think DS is so excited about exploring the school grounds that he doesn't want to sit still and focus - he wants to run and explore. So the only learning he's doing right now is outside of school. I think a different setting is going to be needed in the long run because this juggling act is NOT sustainable.

You don’t have to allow the school to get away with unlawful informal exclusions. If you want DS to attend full-time, you can insist. If they called you every day, you could refuse to collect unless they were formally excluding or suspending DS. Sometimes schools don’t go on to formally suspend, but if they do it a) provides evidence of unmet needs, b) forces the school to follow due process, c) limits the number of days the school can suspend for (they would not be able to do it anywhere near like every day), and d) allows you to challenge any suspension.

From the summer term, if DS can’t attend school full-time the LA has a statutory duty to ensure DS receives a suitable full-time education. I appreciate that is a long time away, though.

If you can afford it, have you considered requesting parental leave?

@Scratchybaby

Hi there Scratchy. Please don’t worry about ‘all about me’ - it didn’t come across that way at all. It’s very helpful to hear your experience. @OvertakenByLego is absolutely brilliant with her advice, and although this is ‘just’ an internet forum, she really helped me see a path/feel more positive when I’ve posted here before.

My DS seems ok so far. He seems happy and positive about school which is the priority. But TBH I don’t really know how he is in class. They’ve not said much to me, and I’ve not said much to them. Sadly, I was so upset by DS potentially not getting a placement in September that I feel I don’t want to ‘be on their radar”. There is a parents’ evening coming up - so I’ll find out more then. I’ve had no communication about a three week review, or what the next step is with regards to his EHCP. They have spoken about how they are using his PECS book in class, but nothing formal.

@OvertakenByLego recommended IPSEA and SOSSEN which I fully intend to contact/use if I get communication which I perceive as an attempt to manage him out.

I recently received his paediatric report, and I’m very carefully looking at the wording and have asked the report to be amended before I pass it on to the school. I’m not accepting negative wording such as “has no understanding” - I want it changed to “emerging”. If it states DS “has a lot of needs” then I want that to be specifically clarified, justified and phrased in a positive way.

In my experience, the school has been the ONLY body that has suggested ‘not mainstream’. Everyone else indicated that mainstream was appropriate. So I will fight, and I do think - law wise, or if it went to judicial review - he would stay in mainstream. I want every avenue or opportunity to be investigated and to have evidence of that, before other schooling is considered. The needs of the child comes first.

I don’t want to come across as ‘blaming’ the school, I can see they are underfunded, 30 children in a class. If I blame anyone it’s the Tories for lack of funding for schools/LA’s to support SEND.

However your school does need to act lawfully, and I’d suggest arming yourself and knowing your rights!
Good luck and best wishes to you and your DS.

@PuffHorner one thing I was advised - and @OvertakenByLego can tell me if I'm wrong here - is that it's actually not a bad strategy for the reports to sound as bad as possible for the sake of getting additional support via an EHCP. So even though it kills you (and me!) to read something like "has no understanding" when you know that's not really the case, it will be better for the purposes of submitting evidence to accompany your EHCNA request.

Happy to be corrected though, as I clearly wasn't successful the first time!!

@Scratchybaby I would say - in retrospect - I didn’t change ‘bad’ wording in order to secure his EHCP. I now want ‘good’ wording in order to keep his mainstream place.

Ideally, though - it should be an accurate reflection of who he is. I do think a phrase that says ‘no understanding’ is not an accurate reflection because he is beginning to use - say - ‘to and fro’ language and answer simple questions. I’m maybe now far more aware of the importance of what is written in a report - and that it needs to be clear. However I know this will take time. It’s now over a week and I’ve had no response from paediatrics over my amendment queries. And it took 3 months from the appointment to even get the report.

Ah I see, apologies, I forgot you said you already had one! Yes absolutely agree, now it's important to be accurate.

The waiting times are truly insane. We are only just getting to our ASD assessment date this week after a two and a half year wait 🙄It's a forgone conclusion at this point and the only question is if any other diagnoses will come with it, but it's taken ages because the professionals involved mismanaged the paperwork due to lack of resources, lack of training, you name it. Couldn't agree more that the Tories need to go before they can do any more damage to an already utterly broken system.

Do you have an EHCP yet? @Scratchybaby or are you at request stage? Ours went way over the 20 week statutory time scale. I might be able to give some tips here?
Ditto ASD assessment. I was told it would happen this summer. Now I’ve been told it’s another year wait. However, I’m not pushing it now because I don’t want him to be diagnosed - and the school to see this as a reason to say they can’t meet his needs.
Also - I’m finding it helpful to try and use apps etc at home to back up his school learning. DS loves ReadingEggs (very repetitive, and I just do with him any of the games he finds challenging), MathsSeeds, Numberblocks on iplayer - and someone called Matt on YouTube, who is VERY repetitive - but repeats sight vocabulary words (called Fry words I think?? as it’s American).

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mQ0MC1r5wdw&pp=ygUOTWF0dCBmcnkgd29yZHM%3D

Puff you can ask for a home-school communication book. It can be part of the EHCP too. The school won’t be able to use a diagnosis as a reason to state they cannot meet needs. EHCPs are based on needs, not diagnosis.

or what the next step is with regards to his EHCP.

Do you have the finalised EHCP? Do you need to appeal B&F? Is F detailed, specified and quantified with no woolly or vague wording such as “access to”, “would benefit from”, “or equivalent”, “e.g.”, “regular”, “such as”…. Anything detailed, specified and quantified in F must be provided. For future reference, if the LA do not adhere to the statutory timescales you can look at enforcement, via JR if necessary.

I agree with @Scratchybaby. Reports should be accurate, but as upsetting as it is, blunt reports highlighting needs and difficulties is what is required. It is the same for things like DLA too. Getting an EHCP is only part of the battle, you have to keep it (there’s a focus on ceasing EHCPs at the moment) and the provision in it. You also have to remember the paed report is based on how DS was at the time of the assessment/appointment, not how he has developed since. Perhaps rather than ‘emerging’ you could request ‘limited’ (i.e. that still suggests some understanding, but not where you would expect of a typical peer his age).

Ah thanks @PuffHorner that's really kind of you, those are all really helpful - and we've already done a version of this! DS is less into maths right now, but loves Alphablocks and is learning his letter sounds in part via the Alphablocks game on his tablet, and his home tutor is building on that interest and helping him expand it. As I say, he's clearly capable of learning, it's just via different routes. Hence the EHCP.

I tried once before and stupidly didn't appeal the decision not to assess, thinking I'd already thrown the kitchen sink at the application and might as well wait for school to start and see what happens. Now we're in this situation it's clear that I need to become a lot tougher and challenge their decisions. Did you have to appeal every step of the way too?

and that's really useful to know @OvertakenByLego that hanging on to an EHCP will be a longer term effort

@Scratchybaby

In my case the EHCP was finalised in June 2023, I had to reapply for a school place (he had a place through his mainstream application but the EHCP meant a different application process). Three schools were contacted (I think) - one outright rejected his placement, the school he is at now were also planning to outright reject, but I happened to phone the SEND coordinator there just before she filled the form, and she agreed to visit him at his preschool. She then said she’d accept his placement but with reservations. I did have a nightmare week thinking he’d have no school place in September and I’d need to resign from my job. So maybe it’s best not to listen to me too much because I still feel pretty disaffected by it all. I didn’t appeal as the LA told me this would ‘freeze’ his placement (apparently untrue) - and I just wanted to get him in school, get his uniform, keep my job - and not spend the summer holidays emailing, chasing, panicking and not knowing what I was doing in September! I think contact with schools etc is limited over the summer holidays too.

During my nightmare week, I felt I’d pushed for something that was now proving detrimental to his education. In principle it’s the right thing to do, but the execution of the whole thing has been a minefield. Which is why I now feel a bit detached.

@OvertakenByLego yes, again in principle the school should base on needs not diagnosis, but I’m finding that different people have different opinions : and when you get that conflict it takes time, resources, appeals, judicial reviews etc. The key issue being length of time/lack of funding that’s required to come to that principle being upheld.

I was able to make a couple of adjustments on his final EHCP. One was removing a comment about COIN units that I’d made - which the SEND coordinator had taken to mean I’d been looking at COIN schools. Again, I’m not sure if adjusting final EHCP’s is ‘allowed’ in principle - but I think the case worker did it to stop me appealing.

Unless the school is wholly independent (where an offer of a place is needed) they don’t make the final decision, the LA does (not counting SENDIST), and schools can and are named against their will. The LA is not going to amend a MS placement purely because the pupil now has a diagnosis.