How to stop the aggression?

[Suncreamqueen]

Ds is 7. Diagnosed autistic. Mostly ok. Have a raft of issues with school that they’re apparently “trying” to help with.

we also have ds 10. Awaiting diagnosis for autism.

ds7 reacts with aggression when he’s told no & generally breaks something or hits someone-whoever’s to hand, me, his dad & his brother. His brother gets the brunt of it. He’s also steadily trashing our house & the things in it. He doesn’t care if it’s glass etc & will launch anything within reach across the room.

ds10 isn’t entirely blameless as he’ll wind ds7 up But obviously it’s not ok to hit someone. Any tips on how to manage it?

I could genuinely cry. I’m so worn out with it. School aren’t helpful & the message I left with our local autism team hasn’t wielded any contact.

I don’t know how to get through to him that it’s not ok to hurt anyone & break things.

Does DS2 have an EHCP? Some of the behaviour at home may well be due to unmet needs at school. If DS has an EHCP you need to ask for an early review. If DS doesn’t have an EHCP you can apply yourself.

Have you considered PDA?

Have you looked at the triggers for the aggression beyond being told “no”? Things like ABC charts, so you can spot patterns and look at deescalation techniques.

Does DS have any help with his emotional literacy and communication skills. Has he been assessed by SALT and OT?

I will stop with all the questions now, don’t feel you have to answer them all.

Hi @Suncreamqueen - I'm so sorry to hear about your DS. I posted earlier about my DTS1 (6) and his enormous meltdowns, it's just so bloody exhausting and is leaving me in tears fairly often. He doesn't have any formal diagnosis, I'm willing to bet he has ASD but isn't 'that bad' at school beyond inattention, therefore I'm not getting anywhere

Do you have any other local ASD/ ADHD organisations which could help? We have a couple of local (area/ county wide) charities which have been more helpful with resources than the council. Also if you have a formal diagnosis, could your DS join some local sports/ activities groups for children with ASD? We have a swimming club nearby which has extra help for children with any sort of SEN, plus things like Beavers/ Cubs are very inclusive. It might help your DS let off some steam in a safe environment and give you a break at the same time?

I participated in a course recently which helped us to think of meltdowns as seizures - when DC are in the throes of a meltdown they literally have no control over what they're doing - I'm not saying that makes them easier to cope with (if only!) but it did help me understand how DTS1's brain works a bit better. It really doesn't help though when something (and it can be something very minor) tips him over the edge and he goes from 'ok' to 'screaming, hitting meltdown' in a few seconds...

I will go through the ABC charts again though @LargeLegoHaul (we have one of those too!) to see if I can spot any patterns - DTS1's triggers are mainly hunger and tiredness but he goes into meltdown so quickly, it's hard to head them off.

No amazing tips here but just to send you and acknowledge that it's bloody tough!

Thanks both.
no problem at all with questions-happy to answer.
he has an ehcp. Its not enough. He doesn’t get enough hours or enough support. School is a whole other fight that we’re having & I don’t see it improving until we can get him into a more suitable provision. He’s in mainstream at the moment & they’ve finally set the ball in motion for an early review of his ehcp with a request for more hours & put in some info re extra support. So we’ll see. But there’s not a more suitable provision with space for September (because school felt he was coping until recently) so we’re stuck for now. There’s a fantastic inclusion worker who’s on it for us.

he was assessed by salt & has ongoing support in school, but hasn’t been seen by OT since diagnosis when he was 4. I think we could do with this to be honest as his needs have changed.

I know of pda but haven’t done any research into it recently so something for me to look into.

I totally get he can’t control his meltdowns & wouldn’t mind if he didn’t target his brother. He’s a strong kid. It hurts.

It’s a recent change though. He’s previously had meltdowns but not hurt anyone. he does it when he’s overstimulated. When he’s hungry or things change unexpectedly.

I’ve not heard of the abc charts so will look into these. I’ve left another message for my local autism team.

we’ve tried football & ju jitsu. Football he refused to participate in as he couldn’t do what the other kids could. Ju jitsu he’s getting over stimulated/hangry due to timing. We’re trying a youth group this week but might try Ju jitsu again next week with a change in food schedule.

he also has anxiety. Around school. Covid has also left him wanting to stay home. But of course he can’t stay home all day because then he’s under stimulated. But taking him out can also cause over stimulation with the same result 😩

I appreciate your comments. I feel a lot calmer today. Had to tell him no earlier & while He might have thrown a couple of things, he didn’t hit anyone & we managed to avoid a full blown meltdown. We’ll see if we can get him into bed without one.

When you say schools don’t have enough space what do you mean and who told you? Being full is not defined in law, and on its own being ‘full’ is not enough of a reason to refuse to name your preference (exception being if the school is wholly independent). The LA has to prove the school is so full admitting DS is incompatible. The bar is high, higher than an “adverse effect”, “impact on” or “prejudicial to”. Unless the school is wholly independent the LA can, and must, name the school regardless of the school’s objections unless they can prove one of the exceptions. Although September is probably unlikely. Have you looked a independent SS and out of area settings?

A proper EOTAS package doesn’t necessarily have to mean DS is under stimulated, so if that is something you think DS needs look into it further.

For football, look at ability counts teams/sessions.

Have you had social care assessments? A carer’s assessment for you and an assessment via the disabled children’s team for DS2 (and potentially DS1 depending on his needs).

@LargeLegoHaul there is a lovely specialist school near here, one of DTS2's classmates is hoping to start there soon (he has physical disabilities as well as ASD). It has a very good reputation for helping DC who need more help - physically and/ or with teaching - but they have to define 'full' as a specific number otherwise they can't offer the same level of service to each child. Really what we need is more specialist schools but obviously they cost £££ so it doesn't happen...

I really feel for all the DC in mainstream schools though who are perhaps getting some extra help but not enough - or just the environment isn't helping with their learning style - or they don't fit in socially. DTS1 is invited to a birthday party in a couple of weekends but after tonight's meltdown I'm not sure I want to risk him in an enclosed room with lots of stimulation

Have you looked at local church groups for SEN children @Suncreamqueen? Again they are often run by people who have SEN children themselves, we went to some pre-Covid and all the people were lovely, really looked after DTS1 and encouraged him to join in. (You don't have to be religious to attend, we aren't particularly!)

but they have to define 'full' as a specific number otherwise they can't offer the same level of service to each child.

Unless the school is wholly independent that isn’t how the law works. The LA and school may tell you it is but their local policy and practice does not trump the law. It is possible to successfully appeal a refusal to name a SS because the LA claim the school is full but cannot prove incompatibility, which they won’t do if their argument is only that the school has reached an arbitrary number they deem as full - case law shows the bar is much higher than that. Although, I agree more SS places are needed. However, the SEND Green Paper shows that isn’t the direction it’s going in.

@LargeLegoHaul I think the inclusion lady told us that it had been left too late. We told school in October he was struggling & were told he was fine in school. We were then told by our auitism team that we were teaching him to “build resilience”. I wish we hadn’t let them talk us round.

no one tells you any of the stuff you’ve just shared 😖. I’ll speak to our local parents in partnership & see if they can help at all. Mainstream just isn’t for him anymore & hasn’t been since reception really (which was disrupted by Covid). I feel awful sending him in everyday. A 7 year old shouldn’t be hiding under the kitchen table when it’s time to go to school 😭.

we had a social work assessment when he got his first ehcp but not since. Should we ask for another? How do we go about getting a careers assessment? I don’t think I’ve even heard of the disabled childrens team?

there’s a couple of nice groups we go
to @LucyCarlyle30 but not all are on every week & we’ve previously been a bit limited by lack of transport & timing/Covid etc. but we struggle to motivate him to leave the house a lot. Even for days that would be fun 😖

I think the inclusion lady told us that it had been left too late.

This isn’t true.

Be careful with SENDIASS, IPSEA and SOSSEN are better. Some SENDIASS are helpful but too many repeat the LA’s unlawful policies.

Yes, ask for another social care assessment. You ask social care for a carer’s assessment. Model letter for the former here. Model letter for the latter here.

@LargeLegoHaul (great username by the way-we also have a plethora of Lego scattered around the house).

thanks for the info & the model letters.

we’ve just heard from school today that he’s been awarded more 121 time so he has the maximum now (I’m told). & that they’ve referred us for further support. I left another message for the autism team yesterday & they’ve assigned us an intervention worker so hopefully that will help.

thanks for the time & advice. I hit a low on Monday when I posted.

How many 1:1 hours would that be? I’m sceptical of what you have been told. There shouldn’t be a blanket policy of the number of 1:1 hours given. There are pupils who receive in excess of full time 1:1 to allow for prep time etc.

Interesting. We’ve been offered 32.5. He had 20 previously. I didn’t take the call from school, his dad did so I’m not sure on the exact wording of what was said.

they are making strides at school but it’ll be too late for our ds.

we have a meeting on Monday morning though for an Early Help Assessment so we’ll see what happens there.