Is my son borderline Asbergers? If so should I press for a diagnosis?

[ginsberg]

My ds (now 6) displays some behaviour which might be diagnosed as Asbergers - obsession with cars - their speed, make, model, bhp - inability to sit still, running up and down for up to an hour clapping his hands and talking to himself and making car noises - in every other respect he is a sweet, bright charming boy. I don't mind the "eccentric" parts of his behaviour and other kids are tolerant of them and seem to like him.
BUT
We have just moved from a village to a city and my ds has moved from a school of 20 to a school of 200. His teacher took me aside on Friday afternoon and quite tetchily explained he has been poking, pinching and punching the other children.
I face a dliemma. Do I try and find out if this is a symptom of Asbergers and get him labelled so that his teacher will be supportive, of do I just let him figure it out for himself with my support and risk his teacher labbeling him as simply disruptive?
Does anyone else share my opionion that the present education system is too restrictive so that individulaism is not tolerated as once it would have been?
I'm not saying it's acceptable for my ds to hurt other children and I've already put in a system of stickers and rewards to try and combat it...but I'm just shocked at the condemnatory attitude of his teacher when my ds is clearly not a trouble-maker in any other way.

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He never pinches at home, will occassionally punch, but not so much as feels unusual for a 6 yr old boy. He does need to constantly interact physically, which makes it impossible to share a sofa with him when he's feeling obstreperous, but is very snuggly when he's being sweet.
He used to pinch at his last school too, but it was never such a porblem that the teacher felt the need to make an issue out of it. I think in such a small school, as at home, it was easier to "manage" his behaviour. He was a name not a number on a register there.
Helping him get as much out of school as possible is a good way of looking at it...but I'm still shell-shocked by the idea it might be a Problem rather than just one of those things...if you see what I mean.

ginsberg, I sympathise, my friend's dd was diagnosed with Aspergers at 7. They had always thought she was a 'difficult' child. They're amazing but I know it was a shock initially. If you think getting a possible diagnosis will help your ds then I'd look in to it. What does everybody else think?

Hi Ginseng, like Essbee, I felt the need to get a diagnosis to best help my ds who was at the time (and still is) self harming and being violent towards me. TBH, it was either a case of find out what's wrong with him or he gets thrown out the school. He was eventually diagnosed with Aspergers and ADHD and as I put him on Ritalin, as far as they were concerned, problem solved and he was going to be a good little boy from now on. This is certainly not the case though.

I am happy that I got a diagnosis early on (he was 5) so that I knew what i was dealing with and could read up (and more recently, speak to MNers who know what they're talking about) on the subject.

Last week, my ds cried in the car saying that he was losing all his friends and was there something wrong with him? It was heartbreaking and I would not wish that on any other human being, especially my baby.

The choice is obviously yours, but if he were to be diagnosed, I think that the pros would outweigh the cons - cerainly at school. Also in his new school, he may be labelled as a trouble maker if there is no diagnosis. My son still has that label when it is him who is getting bullied and tries to break up fights because he hates to see anyone getting hurt. (in his teachers opinion, he should leave the situation and get help, not try and solve it himself).

My ds is also charming and an absolute delight and ABSOLUTELY LOVES trains! So, I know exactly what you have to listen to...I know what coupling rods are and all the names and types of trains in Thomas the Tank Engine! I am sure more MNers will have more advice to give but I do understand your frustrations. xx

"Last week, my ds cried in the car saying that he was losing all his friends and was there something wrong with him? It was heartbreaking and I would not wish that on any other human being, especially my baby."

My heart goes out to you. I try and think long-term when things like that happen...you're son will be a great adult with lots of friends, because eventaully everyone learns life is not easy and they become less critical of other people's differences and difficulties.
And LOL about the trains - cars are now my speciality. I now know that the Maclaren F1 has a top speed of 240 mph and that's exactly the same as the bhp of a Vauxhall Astra VXR

I'm not ready to get my son labelled though, I think he's pretty mild and hoping he'll learn with encouragement to keep his hands to himself. I imagine the whole diagnosis proceedure will involve spotlighting behaviours my son assumes are normal and suggesting that they are not and I don't want him to feel he's odd. I want him to believe - like everyone else in this world - that he is normal and it's everyone else who is odd!

Sorry, Ginsberg - not Ginseng, where did I leave my marbless???

Wow, those Maclaren F1's eh? Bet they're not as fast as the Mallard!

I can certainly understand what you mean by saying you don't want to spotlight his behaviour. I really had to think hard about whether to mention when he started mainstream school that he was a "difficult" child who could be violent. I thought at the time that seeing as no one else seemed to think there was really a problem ("what a well behaved gorgeous boy" etc) then there couldn't be and he would settle down with a new routine. My bubble burst after his first week at school when he kicked a classroom assistant and hurt his teacher. Whoops! I had many many phone calls to collect him from school since that time.

My ds, however was quite violent and not like your ds, but then my ds has ADHD too. His consultant recently wrote that "as he gets older, he is a little less hyperactive but the features of Aspergers Syndrome are becoming more obvious and these now cause at least as much difficulty sa the ADHD". As his parent, you know best. xx

Ginsberg - have you read Martian in the playground by Clare Sainsbury, who has Asperger's Syndrome herself? It was recommended to me by Jimjams, and is well worth the read. (We managed to get hold of it through the library - took a while, but only cost 65p! But now I want to buy my own copy).

Anyway - as well as loads of helpful stuff about AS in general, it also has some useful comments on the benefit of seeking a diagnosis, especially when the child reaches the stage where they personally need an explanation as to why they are different.

HTH

I can't add much that will be of help. However I have come across one useful thing re the pinching issue. Our SN department prints pictures of hands with a red line through them and laminates them . They have found that these can be helpful in reminding children with ASD that they shouldn't pinch. The children keep them on their desk, and this can work quite well.

Tom was diagnosed with ADHD at 7....and we were ready for that as he had been very hard work from birth....however they hinted at asperger's then and we WERE NOT READY at that time.....and sure enough many of his 'difficulties' appeared to reduce for a while whilst we were concentrating on loads of strategies to help his ADHD.....however by age 8 i had began reading about Aspergers and began to recognise him in the 'spectrum'.... previously i had a very stereotypical (ignorant) idea of AUTISM which Tom did not fit......even now when days are going well and life with Tom is fun ....i find myself 'watching' him for 'proof' that the diagnossis is correct....however the good days come to an end and he will struggle again and at those times i am in no doubt!

My 7 yr old is being diagnosed and with him there is No respite- yes there are days when he has fewer tantrums,less anxiety and less need for routines....however EVERY day he has these problems and he is (like chocol8's son) very sensitive to the fact that he is different and his friends are few....and few want to join him at the moment colecting Sycamore seeds!

I think the friends issue is going to be the biggest hurdle - my ds simply does not understand that other children are not interested in the same thing as he is at that moment. (I totally recognise the sycamore collecting reference mrsforgetful). But he is happy to play ALONGSIDE other children - at least when I see him (lord knows what happens in the playground) - as long as they're happy doing what they want and he is doing what he wants and they sort of come together and move apart...it's fine at 6 yrs old. I don't know how it will develop. but I'm not ready yet to accept a diagnosis of Aspergers, however mild.
This has been a rather traumaic weekend, and I think I'l stick to denial for a while...

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i also agree with what you said about how we should 'celebrate' our children's 'individuality' rather than make every child 'fit in'....however i am a dreamer!

Be kind to yourself- don't be hurried.......if and when a diagnosis is sought/made- then THAT will be the right time.

And if he is happy,and you are happy....there may never be any need.

Hi ginsberg (after the poet?). My DS1 has a diagnosis of high-functioning autism. He is five now, and was diagnosed at three and a half.

I had been concerned about him since before his first birthday, and for myself, the diagnosis was actually a relief - I have been much happier since then, and have also found it easier to understand him and try and help him as best I can. However I do hear what you say about the system being intolerant of individuality. Like yours, my DS1 is very very borderline, and I'm sure that many many children who are similar to him go through their lives without ever being diagnosed.

If I were you, however, I would do my best to put an end to this poking, pinching and punching behaviour though. If for no other reason than that one day soon, someone will poke, pinch or punch him back harder.

Anyway, good luck with whatever you decide.

yep, after the poet (howl! ;))
I'm not sure about getting a diagnosis. Ds has always been high-maintainance but I've revelled in his odd charm. Even the realisation that he fits into a specific category of dysfunction (excuse expression) has me looking at his strange behaviours as problems to be solved instead of charms to be enjoyed and I feel a mixture of rage and pity that he can't be normal (once again excuse expression). I can't undo my realisation, but I can prevent him from the same one for as long as possible, IYSWIM.
As for the punching and pinching, we already have a strategy in place. I go and pick him up from school in 5 mins and find out if it worked on day 1!

Yay! Ds earned his sticker today - no pinching or punching!

That's fantastic!

I do see what you mean, Ginsberg. And really good to hear about the success today!

hi my dd has displayed autistic traits from 18mnthsold,now3, very obsessive and constant hand flapping,has anyone elses child done this flapping and if so has it stopped?

miss H It might be an idea to start a separate thread, so your post doesn't get lost?

We're a lot further down the line than many posters on ehre (opther than the wonderful MrsF of course).

My personal stanvce is that by getting a DX you are arming yourself if needed. You can't hit a bad patch in a few years and say OK I will get a Dx then.... it tkaes (often) years to get one in palce, by the time you factor in waiting lists, different sepcialisms etc. And if your child develops a need for help at school 9can happen- did to us, exceedingly bright child just doesn't move forwards at school) you then factor in another 6 months plus for a statemnt.

If you have a DX, disclosure is totally yur choice- you tell only poeple you think it will benefit, if that's what you choose.

Gosh - I'm on this thread!

Ginsberg I think you have taken a sensible approach. Its not uncommon for children at that age to be fixated on one thing they like. If he seems completely isolated and uncommunicative at school, disruptive (after having time to ajust to the new school), unable to function well out of his normal pattern, doing everything in certain orders etc, its time to look deeper. The strange eccentric behaviour may just be imaginative play. Has he explained what he is doing when this happens? Can he be disrupted when he does the eccentric gestures or is he completely focused?