SN nursery dilemma

[alycat]

My DS (aged then 2.5) started at at local SN nursery in Jan 2007, which I chose over another because was raved about as the best.

You cannot visit until you have been offered a place and when you visit you don't ever see any children there (as it is too distressing for children/breech of confidentiallity etc) which I can understand, but it doesn't give much guidance on suitablity for your DC.

He also started at an independent school nursery at same time, with ex Au Pair as his LSA - 2 mornings of a few tears second week, but fine and well settled.

At the SN my DS was screaming 'no' when we entered the car park, for the whole of the first term I was unable to leave the building. For the 1st half I was unable to leave the room!

I saw some very poor practice, which I brought up with the managers - including a very inexperienced member of staff left with 5 SN children, one who had very challenging behaviour and had already drawn blood on someone that day who then was able to drag another child around by the hair. None of them could Makaton (my DS' main form of communication), which I was completely at. It then transpired that several very experienced members of staff had left and 3 young inexperienced members had been recruited in their place.

After Easter he was more settled on and off, but has struggled to settle again since sept. They cannot explain why he is so unsettled, but I know that many incidents (including the dragging by hair one) are not reported to parents. He is much smaller than all the other children, very unstable and I have seen him being pushed over etc whilst there.

My gut instinct is to remove him, but he is supposed to be starting statementing after Christmas. There is another SN nursery locally but (having told me to call her after Easter if still unsettled) she has not replied to my 20+ phone messages I have left since 2 weeks into Easter term.

Should I just give up on SN education altogether?

sounds like he's better off at the other place. It wont stop the statement process.

Don't give up on SN education but do not persist with a nursery that you have no confidence in.
I took DS to my local Lea nursery and it was total crap - actually worse than crap.
I then moved to get into a nursery that had been recommended to me and it was literally life saving. They were BRILLIANT and supportive. Didn't just help DS but helped me learn how to help him.

He is now at school - again SN and he is very happy and doing well.

Trust your instincts

Have just spoken to the head of the alternative SN nursery (she didn't explain why it has taken her since Easter to call me back!)

It will have to be referred to the MAYEMS again (by me or the head of nursery that we aren't happy with, who incidently told me I hadn't a hope of getting him moved to a diff nursery!) next meeting is in October. I have to come up with valid reasons why I want him moved, why I feel other nursery would meet his needs better!

So even if they have a space he wouldn't start there until Jan 2008, he starts school in Sept 2008 - seems not worth it for 2 terms. Head of other says it is. Am going next week to see her.

The situation with current has reached stalemate, I was told (after Monday's debacle) that someone would call me and they haven't so I didn't take him in today.

I am in floods of tears (had to come upstairs as can't cry in front of DS as he gets distressed) I just don't know what to do.

My DH is away in USA until a week Weds, not that he's a great deal of help. My DD has just moved up to the Prep part of her school (yr 3) and is really hating it, in tears several times a day, can't sleep etc) as the change is so great from pre-prep and she's just not ready.

God, it all feels so hopeless (and I feel so useless) just more battles I don't have the energy for.

alycat, you are in West Kent aren't you? could you give me a clue as to your SN nursery whereabouts? My dd is down on a list for 2 dif SN nurseries, and I'm just trying to inforation gather. I understand i you don't want to name them, but findinf independent viewpoints on SN nurseries is nigh on impossible

From my experience: much better to send them to a ms nursery with someone you know and trust to support them there, then to persevere with a SN nursery you have no faith in, and that don't communicate properly with parents. Couldn't you increase his hours at the ms nursery, and possibly pay the LSA privately for extra hours if needed?

Also, you can start the statementing process YOURSELF, NOW - why wait until after Christmas??? It takes AGES to get a statement anyway, and if you want it to be in place for when he starts school you should request it now. www.ipsea.org.uk have a sample letter you can use.

If you don't feel current nursery is right, and I firmly believe in gut instinct, I would say take your ds out. I would say that if you can get him into the other SN nursery (if you like it) it is worth it, even for 2 terms. Otherwise he may be better off doing more time at the mainstream one and you could look into SN again once he starts school.

My dd1 spent a year at an early intervention centre which I never really liked, was never sure about but there seemed little other option. She hardly progressed there at all and although I don't think she was unhappy it certainly didn't bring out the best in her.

Then, at age 3 she was offered a place at another SN Nursery. I nearly didn't accept it. I was ready to give up on SN provision and go down the route of mainstream nursery plus ABA.

But in the end I did and I was sooo glad. It was a completely different story. dd1 spent the last 2 years there and I cried when she left because they were so excellent. She left such a different child to the one who went in (in a good way).

If you can face the inevitable painful process of withdrawing your son, I would say worth it. And don't give up on SN provision, just find a good one.

Silverfrog, yes am in WK (how do you know???) do I know you?

Ask to go round the SN nurseries, the one where you can go round before offering a place is the one I'm hoping to move to.

TBH I am a particularly discerning person (erm, very fussy) and I just feel my DS' keyworker lacks initiative, the whole place is a pc minefield - I was one told, when complaining about staff ratios, that I was a 'good communicator' wtf I'm 35 and (DH and I)run a PR agency, I should bloody well hope so! Everyone talks in lovely soft voices and cannot get to the point or ask a direct question. I think the place is trading on a reputation that was aquired in previous years.

Homsa, am already paying for the LSA as it is a private school nursery so fees + support, although just started getting the nursery vouchers.

His SENCO just called and they have to discuss him next week at MAYEMS anyway, so she will bring it up and talk to the head of the nursery I want to send him to.

Thanks for the great advice and empathy all, and the fortitude to read my verbose posts. Am having a rubbish day/week/month and whilst I was on the phone to SENCO DS removed his nappy and smeared it all over himself and bathroom (and then hall and my jeans as he came to show me!) I then was crying so much I added to much hot to the bath and made his toes pink! I'm going to put him to bed and have a strong cup of tea!

oooh - I posted earlier and the nursery I fled from was in Kent...
Drove me and family all the way to Surrey for some real help.

ohh Pagwatch!!

Was it the local LEA SN nursery you fled from?

btw - I do think it extremely odd that the nursery don't allow visits while the children are there. Smacks to me that they have something to hide.

I have visited several nurseries, both SN and otherwise and always when children are there. How else are you supposed to see if you think your dc would fit in there?

No, don't think we know each other - you mentioned MAYEMS was next week, and my dd is up for discussion at MAYEM next week, so I wondered whether you were in same area. DId a quick search and you had mentioned T Wells.

I hope you get things sorted for your ds. You have every right to be fussy - I have just moved mainstream nursery for dd as her last (extremely good) private nursery was doing nothing for her.

I htink I know which nurseries oyu are talking about - dd could start at one immediately, and there is a waiting list for the other. We are on the waiting list.

God, this is such a minefield.

yes - but should add it was nearly 8 years ago. DS has asd and I had to explain EVERYTHING and they still didn't get it. No one on the premesis had any experience of ASD. Used to pick up child at 12.00 with hands clamped over his ears and self harm scratches down his cheeks. They actually said once " he's been great. Just played quietly with that puzzle all morning. What great concentration"...
Moved home within six months

silverfrog,

We do not live in T.Wells, but nearby

I hope you get what you want from the MAYEMS, we are going for some funding for his LSA in MS - I didn't know there was any available prestatement.

I was told this week there was a waiting list at the one I'm not happy at, basically make your mind up plenty of others want to come here...

My DD goes to school then I have to drive like a loon down the A21 or round the back roads to try and get DS to nursery -it took me 1hr 10mins on Monday!! They then said he hadn't settled because I was late - well let me just pop into my heicopter

It would be so much simpler to go to the other one as I would't have som meny extra journies

If you can't find a nursery then home educate until its time for school. Better to be at home than in a crap nursery. There's probably HE groups around you so you'll have stuff to do with your LO. He'll learn more with you than in a crap nursery.

Pagwatch

Sounds similar, I get he played with cars/trains all morning or he'll be very tired, he just walked round for 3 hrs hrs holding a car...I thought nurseries were supposed to try to engage them in activities...

needmore

a serious 'hats off' to home edders but I would go bananas without a break from him at all. he has a hoover phobia and I can only vacuun when he is out of the house.

he does 3 sessions ms, i wouldn't drop that, but we do take part in lots of play/education/physio at home. Today we had a very long dollies tea party dressing all the dollies, 'pretend' cooking all the food, discussing/naming all the foods, sharing food drinks etc. Then we donned our aprons and washed up the teaset (and flooded the floor!)

Followed by some standing play/exercises.

I do not have the paitience to do this everday after 4 hrs sleep!

I can sympathise there. I HE my older kids but playing with a quadraplegic all day is beyond me. dd has 3 sessions of respite a week or I'd go nuts. She's bright but can do nothing so we have to 'play' for her all day long.
But a bad nursery can cause regression and problems later on if the child is traumatised.

Yep - home ed would not have been an option for me at that stage. this is a child whom we were strongly advised to look for full residential care - before he was 5. Before I could even look at education I desperately needed someone who could manage his behaviours for an hour or two.

The nursery I ended up at was worth it and he improved with the work they did on his behaviours and the help they offered me on how I could manage them too.
I honestly don't know where he or I would be if I hadn't had any respite back then