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Does mild autism 'look' like my son?

23 replies

SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 12:12

We are starting the assessment process tomorrow where I go in and fill out s long form with the SENCO at preschool on the request of his primary school after reading the preschool's report on DS.

I don't actually know what they think my son might have aside from a general SEN suspicion. When I pressed a bit it seemed like they were thinking mild Autism but I've read and read and I just don't think he fits. ADHD seems a more possible condition but perhaps I'm not seeing what's in front of my nose.

The SENCO says he lacks focus and concentration and is to her mind excessively clumsy.

He has a background of speech delay but has caught up and now has a good vocabulary but he does talk using a long drawn out accent on words. I wouldn't say he is monotone or sing songy but he certainly doesn't talk like an adult! I totally agree about lack of concentration and focus unless it's on something he enjoys doing. He doesn't want to write or draw he does want to pick up tools and fix things or take things apart. He was late potty training but now wees and poos on the toilet with the odd accident.

No obsessions, no tiptoes or flapping, no extreme behaviour bar usual tantrums which I can curtail with Time Out or reward charts. Good socially although does play independently, but seeks out kids to play with and we do lots of play dates. Shares his stuff out happily, lots of imaginative play and pretend play. Loves his brother, good eye contact.

I have said I want the assessment form filled out truthfully and without exaggeration but I'll admit I am a little flummoxed as to what I'm not seeing.

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SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 12:23

I've just remembered something else, sorry! He doesn't like loud music at parties and hates organised activities. So if we go to a party where the corral the kids into a small room for a disco he won't go and will scream and shout and throw himself to the floor. Same if they try and force him into a room to eat a party lunch. If he is allowed free flow at a party with music he is fine, same as if he can sit at a table and eat lunch when he chooses. You can't force him to do anything in this regard.

He also doesn't like joining in with singing. So when they do the singing on the mat he will zone out, sand with forced clapping and dancing - he doesn't want to know. Will wag his finger and get sullen and moody. However if he can pick the music at home he will put it on the stereo full blast and do dad dancing to it.

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SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 12:23

*same

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FrayedHem · 01/05/2017 16:09

Have you seen the report the preschool sent to the school? How do you find his communication skills - e.g. is conversation back and forth, able to follow a topic/game you instigate, understanding and following of instructions? How is he with playing with a friend on the friend's terms/choice of game?

I guess as he struggles with organised activities that is more visible at preschool as there will be things like circle time and rhyme time. Along with not really engaging unless it's an activity he has chosen, may be why the primary wants to investigate further. Reception has a lot of play based learning, but there is still a leap up from preschool in terms of expectation for adult-directed activities.

I'm trying to word my response to your actual question carefully! A child with ASD can very much present with more difficulties in preschool/school as the demands can outstrip their skills to a greater extent than at home. But it is more complex than that (my DS3 presents with no difficulties at all in nursery, but he has ASD) and some children do just need a bit of extra support at preschool/nursery.

SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 16:39

No I haven't seen any report bar a silly one we got given on request that was basically nonsense saying how wonderful he is throughout.

I think a lot of what has been communicated between preschool and primary has been verbal and pretty much discussing his lack of concentration and focus as well as the clumsiness and reluctance to join in.

He is absolutely fine conversationally and also fine at instructions with games although he starts to make up his own rules if things don't go his way! He is very compliant with his friends, they boss him about but he doesn't get bullied.

He was definitely a different baby to DS2. He didn't play with his toys at all until he was nearly 3. No imaginative play and no pretend play. We did SALT sessions and they were absolutely right that when his prebtebd play kicked in so did his speech. Didn't potty train until he was 3 and we have only just cracked him pooing on the toilet at 4.5. So he was definitely developmentally delayed, although walked early.

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BlackAmericanoNoSugar · 01/05/2017 16:50

I would say that it's definitely worth investigating. My DS has ASD and doesn't present typically, but it was helpful to have the diagnosis as it meant that he got extra help. It helped me to think of there being two different aspects of ASD, the processing of information inwards to the child and the outward behaviour displayed by the child. While DS is not typical in most of his behaviour, he does have a lot of the processing issues, like having a very literal interpretation, not getting the gist, not having much theory of mind and not understanding body language.

SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 17:58

I fully expect him to struggle at school with focus, so I agree it would be beneficial to get him help if we can.

I think it is because he presents quite atypically in my mind that I just can't put my finger on a syndrome that fits him when I read about each one. I was half convinced about ADHD until I watched the Rory Bremner program last week and thought most of what they were describing didn't fit my son at all.

Is there a simple non specific learning difficulty diagnosis? All I tend to hear is ASD nowadays, have they put lots of conditions under the umbrella of ASD now?

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Cakescakescakes · 01/05/2017 18:01

ASD requires impairment in three specific areas for diagnosis so it's not an umbrella term by any means. Many of your sons traits sound like my son but he has some additional difficulties too. He has and ASD diagnosis. I would wait and see. Diagnoses aren't handed out lightly so he won't be given one if he doesn't meet the criteria etc.

Emily7708 · 01/05/2017 18:10

Your DS's symptoms sound exactly like dyspraxia (DCD) to me. The clumsiness, delayed milestones, lacking focus, lack of pretend play - these are all classic signs. He won't like joining in organised dancing activities because he doesn't have the coordination or concentration skills, this is why he is happy dancing on his own at home. If he does have dyspraxia please push for as much help and therapy as you can possibly get, as the younger you start the better.

www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Dyspraxia-(childhood)/Pages/Symptoms.aspx

SleepFreeZone · 01/05/2017 22:26

That Dyspraxia link does sound close to him I agree. The only anomaly I could see was his gross motor skills were very good and he rolled/sat up/walked early. He showed no interest in ride ons as a child and has only very recently been able to use pedals or scooters.

I'm going to read some more on it before tomorrow. Thank you!

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Allthewaves · 02/05/2017 16:40

Hi. I have an atypical asd if u can call it that. He manages well at home as theres no expectations or pressures. School he's a disaster and they are currently trying to get him statmented due to his dangerous meltdowns - scissor throwing is his latest. All our friends were shocked at his diagnosis and I was half suprised. But they took two years of different types of assessments and observations so it wasn't a snap decision

SleepFreeZone · 02/05/2017 21:54

Thank you Allthewaves. I'm so sorry school has proved so difficult for your DS. That's definitely the bit that worries me about school. Once he starts having to conform I wonder how he will cope.

Well the meeting went well today. We have agreed he needs help with speech and language. His vocabulary is great but he has got into a habit of elongating the last word of every sentence. So 'mummy can I have some milk' is ' mummy can I have some miiiiiiiiilllllllllk'. I have no idea if this would be described as an autistic trait but his SENCO has decided we should revisit SALT intervention and hopefully get them involved again.

We've filled out the form re, Pead involvement. We'll have to wait and

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SleepFreeZone · 02/05/2017 21:54

See on that one (posted too soon).

Just wanted to thank you for all your help and advice. I'm feeling a lot more positive about it now 💐

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MrsMartinRohde · 03/05/2017 12:07

my son was really very similar to yours at school nursery. they flagged concerns about attention, refusal to comply, melting down when routine changed. fine one to one with an adult, chatty, etc, but no social behaviour with other children. also a mild speech delay and a drawn-out way of speech, he had a very "baby" sounding voice till about 6yrs old. he also refused to do anything unless it was something he wanted to do. imaginative play etc at home seemed normal and he adored - adores (also dominates) his younger brother (2yrs younger). didn't have a clue what parties were about. would never ever do circle time or stories or singing at any toddler group I was at with him and they said he would not join in at nursery.

so they flagged this up, I was upset, they told me they didn't have to take anything further/formally, and that the likely suggested approach was what they would take with him anyway. I wanted to put all this down to him being an August boy who'd never been in any childcare setting and he just wasn't familiar with it.

fast forward to reception - which was mostly ok, some behaviour problems but not really anything that made them want to raise a concern; ditto year 1, though he was not progressing academically; they used to comment that he would seem to be in his own world when the children were on the carpet for teaching but when addressed directly he would usually be able to answer a question, which indicated he had actually been listening after all. by year 2, it was very very apparant how far he was starting to diverge from the rest of the children socially, and that along with really clear attention and focus problems raised by his teachers (he was in intervention math and literacy because of the focus problems) and my own experience with him being harder and harder (at times impossible) to manage at home when it involved doing something he didn't want to do like going to school, bed and homework. after meetings with the senco, headteacher and his class teachers, we agreed to set the assessment process in motion.

from initial GP appointment to the assessment, it was about a year, and after going through the parent part of the assessment I was in no doubt that the psychologist was going to say he has ASD. my son was 7 and a half. SO much stuff I had no realised were indicative of autism spectrum from infancy and toddler years... and it was very clear as in my head I was considering all the many many times I had had the flash of realisation that DS1 was not like this but DS2 was. or vice versa. I almost icked myself for having any sense of surprise at all at the diagnosis. of COURSE. it all makes such sense.

hindsight being 20/20 and me having not wanted to see a lot of it through fear.

if your child has ASD he has ASD. if not, then he doesn't. I don't see the harm in seeing what a profession assessor says. it can only help you support and understand. I really wish I'd pushed for my son's assessment a little earlier, purely for the sense of acceptance and understanding for me and at school, and for him eventually, too. it's hard to watch him struggle with friends (he wants to force his friends to do as he says and doesn't cope when they won't).

as for the ASD characteristics that my son, when 3, did not have, at 7yrs old he certainly does. obsessions/special intersts? check. hand flapping? check. meltdowns? check check check. he showed no signs of any of that till he was 6. frustrated tantrumsm sure, but they seemed age/developmentally appropriate.

oh, and my son's lingering tendency to elongate words was noted by the psychologist who assessed him, and SALT has been recommended, alongside assessment by an educational psychologist. the main assessor said he did not consider he has ADHD, but that the inattention/focus stuff was all part of the ASD.

Roomba · 03/05/2017 14:41

Your DS's symptoms sound exactly like dyspraxia (DCD) to me

I read your OP and thought this sounded exactly like DS1 was at the same age. He has Dyspraxia (as do I, only less severely). The acting SENCO at his primary school had no awareness of Dyspraxia at all, she seemed to be suggesting he had ADHD or ASD and even asked me to spell Dyspraxia when I mentioned I had it and did she think DS did too! To be fair she wasn't a qualified SENCO and was covering long term absence at no notice. When she googled the signs she immediately asked for him to be assessed, as she recognised that they fit DS's behaviours. To give you hope, he's now 11.5, thriving and off to a grammar school in September. He'll never be an Olympic athlete, but he has supportive friends (something I thought would never happen), is lovely and caring and enjoys his hobbies too.

SleepFreeZone · 03/05/2017 19:58

Thanks again 💐

I've had s pretty shitty day with him where he has been horrible fearless and impulsive and managed to get himself into a situation which was bloody scary, somewhere where he should have been safe!!! Is fearlessness and impulsiveness common with ASD?

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SleepFreeZone · 04/05/2017 13:32

For some reason I feel so down today ☹️ I spent last night just watching clips of Autistic children on YouTube. It was the least helpful thing ever and didn't give me any answers. I keep feeling really sad when I think about all the struggles he has ahead of him. I know I need to toughen up as I will be his advocate but I just want to take myself to bed and sleep.

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Areyoulocal · 04/05/2017 13:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SleepFreeZone · 04/05/2017 14:24

Thank you 💐

I know it's going to be tough and I am right st the very beginning with it all, the forms haven't even been sent off yet! I don't know if I'm going to be more upset if it gets rejected than I am if we get an appnt! There's obviously something not right it's just right now we haven't labelled it. I'm dreading us having to wait until he is failing at school for something to be actioned.

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BlackbirdSingsInTheDeadOfNight · 20/05/2017 16:03

I've only just seen this thread so am late to reply, but just wondering how you're feeling about it all now OP? From my experience, a nursery and school looking into the situation so early in your son's education can only be really positive.

My son has been under children's services since birth (born extremely prematurely) and his infant school was aware of all of his disabilities, but they simply didn't care about his needs because he was a quiet child who never drew attention to himself in the classroom. He fell further and further behind and was bullied horrifically, but they did nothing at all to help and merely accused me of being paranoid and inventing problems. He now attends a specialist ASD school with his place funded by our LA, and is absolutely thriving and blissfully happy.

I really think that a school that's so keen to understand your son and his needs is really positive. As for a possible ASD 'label', to start with I was terrified of the thought of my DS receiving this diagnosis. But he's a fabulous, loving, happy and very loved boy and his ASD is just part of our everyday lives now. Good luck with it all OP.

MuminUS · 25/09/2018 20:26

Hi SleepFreeZone - I just wondered how things were going as I think we are at the same point you seemed to be last year. Curious to know how you’re getting on. Really hope things are ok.

CieloMartinez · 01/10/2018 13:38

Hello everyone,

I’m not sure if my concern for my son fits into this thread completely but I can’t seem to start a new thread for some unknown reason so I thought I’d post a message here. I am so stressed out about my (just turned) 17 months old son and would appreciate some feedback/advice!

Approx. around 10/11 months of age, I noticed my son wasn’t always giving the best eye contact as before, but I guess I didn’t really pay much attention to it until now. Confused

Last week has been extremely depressing for me because I have just been constantly going online, typing in “Lack of eye contact in toddlers” onto Google and seeing “Autistic” everywhere in my search. I’ve even tried MChat test where the result was “Traits of autistic behaviour.” I’m aware it’s only a tool and unable to actually diagnose him thoroughly but this is still very frightening!

However, what confuses me is although he will not give general eye contact, it is only when I start to sing a lullaby (his favourite is Twinkle Twinkle ) that I will notice a difference where he gives me incredible eye contact and looks at me straight away as soon as I start singing.

Amongst the issue with general eye contact, the other behaviours that he displays are:

POSITIVES

  • Crawls and climbs confidently
  • Babbles and grunts
  • Eats very well and can feed himself finger foods
  • Understands the word “Stop”
  • He can see and hear clearly
  • He’s sociable with family, friends and other children
  • He sleeps well
  • He can clap when I clap (although this week he hasn’t been doing it much, not sure if I’m just adding too much pressure Confused )
  • He’s very much into iPhones, constantly listens to Little Baby Bum lullabies on Youtube
  • I’ve noticed he tries to imitate the phonics alphabet on the Little Baby Bum lullaby, although it is very subtle
  • He laughs when I tickle him or we play
  • He smiles when I smile at him (when I do get eye contact)
  • He’s very observant (i.e. if I’m in the kitchen, he will try to turn around on his highchair to see me / if someone comes through the front door he will do the same thing)
  • Plays with toys well
  • Stretches his arms out to me but only when I stretch my arms out first to suggest picking him up

NEGATIVES

  • Can’t walk, although he can balance on his own for a second or two, he gets scared when realising I’m not holding onto him and so he drops
  • Can’t talk, doesn’t say anything else apart from ”Dadda”
  • He can’t respond to or acknowledge his name
  • He shakes his head from side to side really fast when he’s excited
  • Flaps hands
  • Fascinated with this one black spot on my living room floor and constantly picks at it (does the same thing at my Aunty’s except he plays with a dead telephone wire)
  • Can throw little tantrums on his highchair, just before eating or after, really kicking, although doesn’t last long

I have spoken to our health visitor, who claims my son seems normal from his check ups, however he suggests to see my GP and get a referral to see a pediatrician for a full check up. So I will keep you all posted.

.. but please let me know what you think it could be!

Thank you,

Cielo

LightTripper · 01/10/2018 14:16

Hi Cielo!

I just wanted to pop on to say that 17 months is very young. I would definitely get on to a follow up with your GP with the list that you put above (because waiting lists can be long, and the sooner you know whether your son is autistic the sooner you can find the best ways to parent him), but it's worth being aware that nearly all autistic traits are normal traits of childhood development: just different in intensity or duration. Start reading up on autism and parenting approaches, and looking for stuff written by autistic adults who can give you a "first hand" view of what helps and what is difficult.

My DD was diagnosed about 6 months ago, just before her fourth birthday. When autism was first suggested (about 18 months before that) I found it completely terrifying, but she is a totally fabulous person and I wouldn't change a thing about her. So far she is coping fine in a mainstream school without a 1:1, with a bit of extra attention from her teacher and TAs. She has friends, is happy and very interested and engaged in the world. I'm very aware she may have problems later, maybe even serious ones: but I just wanted to flag that autism is really a huge spectrum and although there are challenges with the right accommodations it needn't be a nightmare for your DS (or you!).

Hang on in there, push push to get the support and answers you need, but also try not to panic (easier said than done I know! I am currently wondering whether my 19 month old DS may be autistic too due to lack of much language and very hit and miss response to name and it's scary - but the fact my DD is already there and happy actually makes it better, and I wish I had known that when concerns were first raised about her development).

CieloMartinez · 01/10/2018 15:06

Hi LightTripper,

Thank you for that info. I used to be a Learning Mentor for SEN young people that’s why I feel extra paranoid! But those young autistic people were teenagers, not 17 month old toddlers - so you’re right he is young but definitely going this wednesday to get checked out by GP.

Also forgot to mention, this morning when I was reading him a book he will look at the book and then at me with good eye contact.. I’m really hoping this is something that will improve!

I’m starting to feel like it’s my fault that he is delayed. During his first year, I went through burgarly, financial issues, his father and I separated, and with lack of family and a real support system I went through severe depression and was unable to give my son a 100% of my attention. I did all the mandatory things, such as feeding, bathing, changing nappies but I feel I could have encouraged him more to walk, talk and do social activities. All I could want for my son is for him to be happy and HEALTHY.

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