ASD 4yo, PIL offer to fund private education

[tigerpug]

Hi everyone, me again. DS is 4 & was diagnosed with ASD a year ago, he is due to start school this Sept. He has lots of extra help at preschool, one on one time etc, funded by EY government support. With all this extra help he is doing v well, meeting all his milestones. However, he constantly struggles socially - he has no friends and is desperate for some, but goes about it in the wrong way (far too enthusiastic, shrieking around other children etc). He is also very selective in what he will and wont spend time on e.g. loves numbers, will NEVER colour in or draw a picture.

We have been worried about the school process for some time, mainly with playground scenarios and with his selective concentration. He has been refused an EHC plan because he isnt deemed 'severe' enough. We are 99% sure he will get a place at our local infant school, we find out on thursday if this is the case. We have met with them, had meetings with preschool senco and the school reception teacher, and they said lots of good things and their approach felt warm and supportive. However, the SENCO has already said that there is no extra funding for us, just the teacher & TA in the large class size.

Anyway, all fine, we felt as comfortable with this as we could. Then we received an offer from PIL who have decided they want to help us financially with DS education. They live abroad and are too old to provide any other support except financial. We are v grateful for this offer but i feel confused about what to do, a few weeks ago our path was in place, now the path has become a maze!

What do we do? As I see it (please correct/advice me) mainstream school options locally are:

• Local infant school (state) with large class size, start in Sept and see how he goes. This was our original plan.
• Can we fund additional support at the infant school i.e. pay for a TA for a few mornings week for example, would this even be an option? I will speak to headmistress when school starts back after the holidays
• Use the money for extra curricular activities i.e. tennis club private coaching?? He was asked to leave our local football and tennis classes because he wasnt able to pay enough attention and was therefore using up too much of the coaches time - harsh but fair. Maybe one on one help would give him a stepping stone to allow him to integrate into mixed classes and make some friends??
• Private school. Fine if we can find one that wont put too much pressure on him to achieve academically, as he may not be one of those children. If we can find one that is supportive, with small class sizes and additional support on offer.

On another note we have been talking to a local private school who dont cost the earth, have a good reputation, but their main focus is getting their pupils through to grammar (yes we are in one of those areas!) so it is very results driven. But they do have some autistic children there who are doing v well as they only have 10 children in each class. Are we crazy to consider this? Or maybe DS starts at our local infant school and if he enjoys learning and engages in lessons, perhaps consider a switch to the private school in a few years?

Our main focus is, and will always be DS being happy, settled, and hopefully making some friends. Im just not sure where this will be more likely to happen. Any advice is appreciated, thank you

Without sounding mercenary it really depends how much money they can offer.

But if funding isn't an issue you could look at independant special school - asd specific. Campian group, priory group, an aba school etc. Very expensive to self fund but if money isn't an issue, could be exactly what he needs. Don't dismiss special schools, until you've investigated them. Mainstream isn't always all it cracked up to be. There are all different special schools out there and some cater for very high functioning children, especially in the private sector.

Perhaps PIL could help fund any independant reports you may need to get an ehc in place (good ep, salt, ot etc) these can make all the difference and prove need for support. Unfortunately often nhs ones are so vague and non specific (budget driven, so don't specify support needed) where as independant practitioners are not afraid to write in the reports what your child really needs. A good ehc could enable you to name a mainstream, private or special school.

It sounds a generous offer of help but I would also want to think about PiL offer, be sure it is sustainable? What if their situation changes? Fees add up. Not meaning to be hard, but you don't want to start him in the perfect school if they can only afford it for 4/5 years.

Long term an ehc could give you better peace of mind.

Best of luck with finding the right school.

It sounds to me as if your LA have missed the fact that they need to be teaching him social skills so that he can learn all of that non-verbal communication through the conscious channel.

Most kids pick up instinctively when they are standing too close, when they are being annoying, how to get where someone else is coming from and what the right volume is to use.

If your dc needs lessons for that, then it should be provided by the school, and if they do not have the resource, then it is time for an EHCP.

It is quite a big job, and usually SALTs regard it as important to have small group classes AND the work covered in those classes embedded throughout the school day, and particularly in unstructured times like play times and lunch time.

If you are looking at getting an EHCP then help with the cost of independent reports would make a big difference. Possibly even help with representation at Tribunal.

Also there are some small independent schools who are very good on SEN and will take kids who are academically mainstream level but who have additional needs.

Hope this helps

Oh, I don't think that the school will let you pay for your own TA to help at school, but I think paying for a good SALT to work with social skills with your dc would be a wise use of money. It will inevitably take time for support at ms school to be put in place.

Some LAs are inclined to refuse assessment requests almost automatically and then cave in just before Tribunal.

The worst LAs then refuse to statement, and then produce a rubbish statement, so several years go by trying to get the statement right. With luck you will not be in one of those.

It's great that your ds is doing well at pre school with the extra support. I think it's important to see that this might also be why he's doing so well. All the extra support in preschool with smaller sizes then mainstream as well as one on one time - won't be available in ms. Coupled with the class suddenly being 30 children in one room in a different environment is a challenge in itself.
Your ds has a dx of asd so I'm guessing it's not only the social awareness aspect of asd that's an issue.

Salt, OT, ep reports all take time and cost ££££. If I were in your position I'd use the time BEFORE your son starts to get these reports.
Armed with the knowledge these reports will provide will enable you to make a clearer decision, if money isn't such an issue.

It depends on the school. If there is a private one locally that has the right ethos go for it. They do exist. But speak to the parents who already have kids there. Make sure it's not something you have been told just to get bums on seats & that those parents have been genuinely happy with what they have paid for.
I agree it sounds like he would benefit from the funding an EHCP brings and it sounds like you have been fobbed off, it is standard procedure these days.
I would contact Ipsea for advice on how to reapply. You can prepay and prebook an advice call.
Then speak to the head about if there is any chance of self funding a few hours support until the EHCP comes through. They might come to some arrangement.
The fact he is making such good progress with support is grounds to argue that he needs support to be continued.

Another thought
It sounds like he might not need 1:1 but would benefit from a small ratio eg 1:4 or whatever
If there are any other children who would also benefit from something like this could you agree to part-fund the support
It sounds like he needs help with staying focused and with social skills from your description and a few hours a day of more attention than the ratio as it stands would help him

What has worked for us (and what I would spend my money on every time) is ABA.

i would find an ABA consultant and ask your PIL to fund that and then take their advice what is needed e.g. a home programme, a home programme + some school time or FT school. They can advise how much 1:1 support would be needed or whether a 1:10 or 2:30 ratio of teaching staff would work. They can support in a private school or train mainstream 1:1 to do ABA. They would help you figure out the best fit.

Its easier to run a ABA programme in a private nursery or private school (at least initially) as Councils tend to block it in mainstream (through fear they will end up paying for it). But of course then you have the fees + ABA costs. Still you could do that for a year or two while you get EHCP in place.

When is he 5? He doesn't have to be in school until the term after he is 5. Could he stay in current preschool and you pay for some ABA training for their staff to help with social skills while you also run a PT home programme?

I would set up home ABA prog and then stay in pre school longer or transition into private school with ABA support for Reception (poss PT school and PT home ABA). If you can do that for a year you will collect the evidence of whats needed (and can use it to fight for EHCP, go through appeals etc).

You can then make a decision for Year 1 whether to go for private school or mainstream with guidance from ABA team and hopefully having the right support (& EHCP) in place from day one. I would not be rushing to put my son in a school that isn't prepared to fund any 1:1 that rings big alarm bells for me - the school should put in up to £6000 of 1:1 and there is no doubt he will need some 1:1 time to learn everything he needs. Is a school with this attitude the right school???

For us mainstream would never have worked without ABA input. It would have been a disaster. Socially, emotionally, academically. I have found 2 mainstream schools clueless.

Don't worry too much about the future just try and figure out what feels right for the next year. What feels right one year for a child with autism often doesn't feel right the next depending on their progress / the gap with others / the changing expectations at school etc. I have learnt to just think one year ahead.

Getting advice from ABA and poss private SLT would help guide you on the right track.

The mainstream school should not be telling you that there is no funding for your child to recieve support at school!! The school have to support him they receive funding to help to support children with special needs and if they need more funding then they need to contact the LA and apply for an EHC needs assessment!!

Dont be fobbed off. I also agree that getting a really good SALT report could help you and the school to learn what areas your Ds is struggling in.

Good luck

Thanks everyone for your replies, we have people here for the weekend so I haven't been able to read in much detail today but I did think it was interesting that there were so many mentions re a SALT assessment. When DS was diagnosed we had a course of 6 SALT sessions and were signed off after 5 weeks because DS was considered to be at an age appropriate level. At best we were given a few pieces of advice to help with eye contact and with turn taking.

I am going to go through all your replies tomorrow but I cab already see that they are going to be very helpful and give us lots to consider - thanks everyone

NHS SALTs are allowed to give one block of therapy. Tends to focus on vocabulary and not on social skills.

A good number of indie SALTs gave up working for the NHS because they were fed up of being told to recommend that one block of 6 sessions was all kids needed when they could see that the kids needed on-going therapy to try and keep up with the increasing complexity of social communication.

Have a good weekend

NHS SLTs tend to recommend whats available not whats needed.

For me a ABA or SLT assessment of language is important to know where the gaps are because so much of school is language based if he's not picking up on long strings of information or not processing / retaining it then he is going to struggle in a mainstream classroom without individual support.

If you do ABA you don't necessarily need SLT too.

Hello OP! Just to add my own ten pence worth....

It strikes me as bizarre that your DS would be entitled to so much support in Early Years but then none at school. DS1 (dx of ASD and a lot of assorted extras) is 9 years old now so it was a while ago for us and things may have changed (and I daresay that as ever things vary from area to area), but he received very minimal support at nursery as the staff:child ratios were smaller, so it was far harder to get government funding for nursery support. We did however get a Statement for when he started in Reception.

We were in a grammar school area which also had very snooty private schools which wouldn't even consider offering DS a place. He had 1:1 support at our village state school, but having worked hard with us to get the Statement they then seemed to totally lose interest in him. All sorts of bizarre things happened, like the school having a group for social skills and friendships but him not being allowed to go to it because it was only for children without Statements!!

We moved away from the area when DS was in Year 2, to escape Grammar School Land and to send him to a small private school in a non-grammar county which is very, very nurturing. (The school, not the county!) Pluses for us are:

• the smaller classes (DS is with a maximum of 14 other children)
• the younger children (with our agreement the school moved DS down a year, as he was born extremely prematurely and this has impacted greatly on all areas of his development)
• the greater flexibility (his curriculum has been personalised to him, e.g. he does virtually no sport but lots of music, as the competitive nature of sport completely freaks him out but he finds music very calming)
• the school's desire to help him to blossom as an individual and make positive progression at his own pace (can you see that I love this school!)

However I entirely agree with previous posts about trying to get an EHCP in place. Given that your DS has government funding for EY already, surely someone is missing a trick here in saying he isn't eligible for an EHCP. We've gone private because state wasn't working for us, but you may well find that it does work for you, especially with a bit of guidance from private ed psychs, SALTs etc.

I hope you got the primary school that you want in today's allocation - assuming that you do still want it! x

Hi lovely, knowledgable mumsnet folk. Thank you for all your replies.

We found out last Thursday that DS has been awarded a place at our local state school (mainstream), so I have a meeting on Monday with the head & senco to discuss exactly what they can and cant offer us. I am also going to ask about the possibility of us funding some extra support for him there. As I've previously mentioned, I really cant understand how he is expected to go from so much additional support at pre school to limited help at primary school, especially when they haven't been able to clarify exactly what they will do for him there. Frustratingly they seem to have put him in an 'ASD' category in which he doesn't fit. They have mentioned offering him taster sessions to help him feel confident and settle in because they assume he is introverted and struggles with new environments. DS doesn't need this. He is an extrovert, and over confident, who will run into school on his first day and not look back. His over confidence needs to be managed, but not by settling in sessions. Re the actual amount of funding they would have for DS, every one of our local primaries all said the same thing - the funding helps with extra TA support but they cant commit to an exact amount of time per pupil.

DS also has a session on Monday at a local private school, the one i mentioned in my first post. I am looking forward to finding out what they can offer him there, but again I am not very helpful as they are a mainstream, school whose main focus is on results and getting their pupils into grammar. They have already said that DS sounds like he will fit in, so I am going to give them lots of 'bad day' examples and see what they say. I worry that they might take our money but down the line could decide he isnt the right sort of pupil. I dont want D~S or myself to be in a pressured situation. Anyway, lets see what they say.

I am really struggling to find any local ASD specific schools - we live in quite a rural area and the only 2 schools I have found that focus on children with ASD seem to be for pupils with quite severe needs, for children that have been excluded from mainstream. I am happy to link to the schools if people here dont mind? Similarly if anyone has a recommendation for a good, supportive ASD focussed school in S E Kent I would love to hear from you.

From all of your helpful replies, I think once the meetings on Monday have taken place I might need to revisit the EHC refusal, perhaps tackling it by funding some independent reports which might give us more chance of DS being reconsidered. I am also looking into ABA too.

Before Mondays meetings with the local primary school if anyone has any advice on questions to ask then I would really appreciate it.

e.g. What help should they be able to provide for a child with ASD (and no EHC plan).

Agnes you mentioned up to £6k of funding, is this a given? I looked into this before and our LA do not give specific information on budgets per school/pupil. Am i within my rights so ask if my son will have £6k of funding and to ask exactly how this will be spent?

Thanks everyone

Up to 6k is discretionary within a non-ring fenced SEN budget. My la used to provide additional guidance - SA up to 1.5 hours, SA+ between 1.5 and 5 hours, then AEN/statemented up to 12 hours where 12 hours roughly equated to 6k.

In my LA EHCPs now state 6k plus 4k APW and a top up band. Schools are expected to fund first 10k before LAs contribute financially. So it is no longer 'up to' otherwise there would be no top up.

This is only a given if you have an EHCP. Not saying this is strictly legal but is normal practice.

They have mentioned offering him taster sessions to help him feel confident and settle in because they assume he is introverted and struggles with new environments. DS doesn't need this.

I wonder if this would benefit of the staff in getting to know dc, even if dc doesn't need to get to know them?

It might help them to get a more detailed plan sorted for support, maybe