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SN children

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Original poster

Ds and school procedure

17 replies

tacal · 24/03/2015 07:38

Hello,

My ds is 6 and has a diagnosis of autism. He is high functioning and doing well at school with support.

When ds leaves school at 3 pm the door he comes out of is closed behind the last child. I only realised this recently. So he has no way back in to the building if I was not at the gate to collect him. To get back into the building he has to go out onto the public pavement and walk along to the main school gate, go in and press the button for the school office and speak to them on the intercom.

The school have not told the children this is what they have to do if their parent/carer is not there.

I find this very concerning, that the school think so little about children's safety. My ds would probably panic and I have no idea what he would do. He is often last out so not many people around who know him.

I have made him aware of what the procedure is now and we will practice it because he gets confused with what to do at the main door.

Are other schools more safety conscious or is this normal?

OP posts:

PolterGoose · 24/03/2015 07:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Ineedmorepatience · 24/03/2015 08:05

No way!! At 6 they should still be doing a handover to parents!! Especially for a child with SN's!

In the early key stage classes where my Dd's went they were still supervised until the last child had gone with a parent or as polter says they took the stragglers back in!

I would definitely be saying something!

Original poster

tacal · 24/03/2015 10:48

Thank you Polter and Ineed. Glad you agree that it does not seem safe for a 6 year old. I have spoken to the school but they did not take my concerns seriously. I am thinking about speak to HT about it.

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orangepudding · 24/03/2015 11:02

In my children's school infants are handed over to parents. I don't like the sound of your schools way of doing it!

Original poster

tacal · 24/03/2015 11:08

It is not good orange my ds is really happy at the school but I am not so happy with the school

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senvet · 24/03/2015 11:39

My dcs' school had a handover to parents in reception then 2 areas for pick up both manned by a member of staff until all the kids were gone, or any kids left behind were taken back to the office where phone calls were made to sort it out.

AND there was a road outside the school which was a little lane but all the kids were FORBIDDEN to use it and made to go through the school site to get to the office if their adult was late.

The law says (as summarised by Government Legal Guidance)
"However, legal action for negligence against schools is only
likely to be successful if:
• the school has not taken care of a child in a way that a prudent parent would have
done;
• as a result, the child has been injured; and
• the injury was a foreseeable consequence."

The link to the guidance is below. It carries a much more laid-back approach than was assumed to be the law at the height of school-worry about Health and Safety, which may explain why your school are being laid back.

I think that the SEN of your dc means that a system that works for a nt child of 6 (ie the bulk of the class who can manage to leave in time to find an adult) is not safe for your dc.

Personally I don't think expecting other 6 year olds to walk down the road if a parent is delayed is any kind of sense either.

www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/335111/DfE_Health_and_Safety_Advice_06_02_14.pdf

Original poster

tacal · 24/03/2015 12:36

Thank you senvet I have sent an email to the school asking them to discuss this with me again because I am still concerned about it. I dont think they will offer to do anything because they usually refuse any adjustments for ds. Even allowing him to leave his ear defenders on his desk during the day was a big deal and was refused for a long time.

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bitbap18 · 24/03/2015 12:57

That is dreadful! My daughter is just 7 (so in year two) and our teacher will not leave the doorway until all children are collected, and must be collected by someone the teacher knows e,g. The parents, grandparents etc, or a prior arrangement. We have to notify the school if anything happens that changes it and they will not let the children go until they are happy. They have to wait by the classroom, and the teacher doesn't go, and the door is not closed until the child has been collected. If someone that the teacher doesn't know or is not aware of a prior arrangement, they will not let the child go.

In this day and age, with all sorts in the press, I can't believe they are happy with that arrangement for any child, let alone a 6 year old and one with SN!

Personally I would be speaking to the county council/LA who governs your area and checking they are aware of this arrangement and do they have a general policy for schools to use, the schools make their own rules. I bet they wouldn't be happy with this, if they knew about it!

senvet · 24/03/2015 12:59

Good grief. I read something really good about the success of SEN inclusion the other day, and the school's attitude was identified as key.

I'll see if I can find it later today after a battle with dd's school about SEN for exams (sigh).

Original poster

tacal · 24/03/2015 14:03

Hi bitbap the way your dd's school does it sounds perfect and is what I expected when my ds started school. I have been thinking of speaking to the local council to see what they think.

Thanks senvet we are in Scotland where they are in the process of introducing the "Getting It Right For Every Child" system. It looks good on paper but so far, seems to be taking things away from ds. I do not feel the school is "getting it right" for my ds with the procedure at home time so I will have one more try at discussing it with them. Good luck with your dd's school today.

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Original poster

tacal · 27/03/2015 07:30

An update

The school say after 3pm they are not responsible for the children. The children should know they have to go back into school if their parent is not there. The school don't want to tell the children exactly how they get back into school, they think they are capable of knowing to go to main entrance if their door is closed. Also, it is illegal for parents to go into the playground. And the pavement outside the school is busy with parents and the lollipop man is there so they think it is perfectly safe.

It seemed that they would not change their mind on this until I said I was making a complaint to the local authority. Then a complete turnaround. I can go in playground to the door ds comes out. Teacher will hand ds over to me. They will do a social story for ds about this procedure.

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bitbap18 · 27/03/2015 08:21

I am totally horrified by their response!!!!!!!

Personally I'd still be doing the complaint, because they clearly don't give a damn about the children in general, and I'd also be very concerned what else they are doing/getting away with, if they can get something so basic so wrong!

I can't believe they expect 4/5//7/8/9 + year olds to know what to do?! I'm speechless!

PolterGoose · 27/03/2015 08:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

tacal · 27/03/2015 10:31

I am horrified too and I do worry about what else they are getting away with. Last year they agreed they would not give ds any food because he has difficulty eating. I gave them reports to back this up. Twice they gave him food that he could choke on!! I had said that skin on fruit and veg and haribo sweets are especially difficult for him. His teacher decided he should have an apple at lunch time one day (ds has packed lunch so why she did this I do not know). I complained and then a few months later a different teacher gave the whole class a haribo type sweet! I said I was going to make a formal complaint because this was so serious but they put a procedure in place to stop it happening again so I didnt complain.

If I make a complaint now it will really damage my relationship with the school. But I know I really should. I will phone Enquire who can advise me..hopefully. They give advice to parents who have children at school with additional support needs.

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Bilberry · 27/03/2015 13:01

Hi tacal, we are in Scotland too. My dd school tends to open the door and the children pile out to adults waiting in the playground. They only hand over P1s to parents for the first few weeks. The school don't ask or get involved in who is collecting. They also don't tell the kids what to do if we are late (go back in through the door they come out of) though the teachers do hang around a bit. There have been a couple of occasions where a kid (including a P1 last autumn) who should have been in after school club thought they were being picked up and had to be taken back to the office ten minutes later by another parent who knew them.

On the upside, the ASN kids (including those with HFA) are handed over directly by a TA.

Bilberry · 27/03/2015 13:03

Sorry that should be kids with ASN not ASN kids

Original poster

tacal · 27/03/2015 13:33

Hi Bilberry it sounds very similar to ds' school except only p1 parents are allowed in the playground. Maybe it is the way things are done in alot of the schools here. I would be so angry if my child was supposed to go to after school care and was sent out the door. He wouldnt know what to do! I suppose it is good that they do a hand over to parents where the kids have additional support needs but it would be better if there were good procedures in place for all kids.

Thank you for sharing. It is interesting to know that this could be more common than I was thinking.

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