School given up re disruptive behaviour

[SezaMcGregor]

Hello you may remember my posts from a week or so ago about DS dunking a child at swimming and my disagreement with school regarding appropriate supervision during swimming. DS is almost 7 and we saw the paediatrician on Thursday about possible ADHD.

The paed seemed happy with DS as he is a different boy when 1-2-1 rather than in a group or class when he has to be the centre of attention and is often disruptive in the class.

Saw HT this morning to go through IEP (finish task on time, letter formation, good listening) and she told me that his disruptive behaviour is a "lost cause".

She says that DS is disruptive and she will have to remove him from situations (I'm assuming to his own table again) and that she has a lot on this year to get them all to where they should be.

I almost told her not to bother with doing this for DS as I'd rather his school life be happy rather than stressing about passing tests - but decided not to.

I feel so deflated. I'm not sleeping and then not being able to get up. Any advice other than to KOKO?

Attitude from HT stinks.

Has the paediatrician got any plans to view him in school - my two (AS rather than ADHD) present also very differently in 1.2.1 than in a group.

I think I would second Polters suggestion of looking for alternative schools. He may need a calmer, more stable environment or teachers who are prepared to be a bit flexible to meet his needs. One of my neighbours son's has ADHD and his school bought him a spacehopper which he could use when he needed an exercise break. It's little adjustments like these that can make all the difference.

If he is continuing to be disruptive then whatever strategy the school is currently using is not working so they need to think of a new approach rather than just wash their hands of the problem.

Sounds like they aren't really sure what to do with him.
Do they actually have any strategies for his disruptive behaviour?
Are there any rewards in place for when he is good?
Has they had any input from the behaviour support team (if you have one in your area)?
Pretty disgusting to say his behaviour is a 'lost cause'.

This is "another school". I moved him towards the end of reception year from a smaller school (60 in the school) which I thought would be better for him, but teacher was very negative. He started here after May holiday.

At the end of reception class, HT referred him to Ed Psyc and School Health.

Over the last year, Behaviour Support have come in 3 times, suggesting lots of strategies and underlying low self-esteem.

She said that there's no point including behaviour on the IEP as he won't meet the goals so may as well concentrate on other areas that they can work on.

He's a different boy in a calm environment.

HT did not speak of any positive reinforcement. Seeing MAT team worker tomorrow who has taken DS over from SureStart but does not have the resources to do more than an hour every 3/4 weeks. He's taking my positive parenting class so will try to see what he thinks when I see him.

HT has also refused to take over and carry on TAF meetings as she doesn't feel that they are necessary.

I'm a single parent and so HE is out of the question unless I could get DLA but that seems a bit grabby and not really how I want things to go.

If you qualify for DLA then you might as well claim it.

Did he get a diagnosis of ADHD? It's not clear in your op.

Will CAMHS see him regarding his low self esteem?
It might be worth sitting down with the HT and behaviour support and finding out which strategies are working and which aren't and then figuring out what to try next.
If he is seeking attention then they could try offering him some 1:1 adult time or small group play as a reward for behaving in class.
You could always try another school but it won't help his self esteem if he keeps moving and 'failing' at schools.
Have you applied for a statement?

Sorry, I forgot to say - thank you for your replies, you really do give me some gravity!

We saw the Paed with a view to getting an ADHD diagnosis but he's going to write to school and see us again in 4 months.

HT has no people skills, which is half of my problem as she does not communicate well.

CAMHS are not involved - is that something that I should do or school?

They did give him more 1-2-1 support but have taken it away in the classroom. They were doing 1-2-1 while assembly was on, but I don't know if they are still doing this in Y2. I think I will have to email HT and get all of my questions across. Fucking hate this, I'm sure we're supposed to be working as a team

Fairgame How does one apply for a statement?

Has he been seen by an OT?

If you look on the IPSEA website there is information about applying for an EHCP plan (new form of statements). I am not sure things have got bad enough yet for the LEA to agree to this. However, as the mere act of applying does tend to promote the various agencies into action in our experience it might be worth doing anyway.

If the HT feels he won't make the behavioural targets then she needs to breakdown the target into smaller chunks rather than getting rid of it completely. Eg Before he can turn take with a group of his peers he needs to be able to do it first with an adult correctly, then with one other child etc etc.

OneInEight - thank you for your reply.

He's not seen an OT. We've seen school doctor, behaviour support, surestart worker and now the paediatrician. Ed psyc has looked at him: "yes, that's the boy" and flicked through his file (apparently) but not actually assessed him.

He's about to be taken on by MAT team male worker for positive role model sessions but this also means an end to TAF meetings and SureStart involvement which has been so useful to me.

I'm currently typing an email to HT to ask her questions such as whether DS's 1-2-1 during assembly is still ongoing - I'll be giving it some thought as to what else to include.

It depends where you live re: CAMHS. Some will accept self referrals and others it has to be through school or GP. He needs some input with his low self esteem if that is what is causing his behaviour. If he doesn't meet the CAMHS threshold then maybe the children's centre can do some input around self esteem.
There is no point in managing the behaviour if the cause is not being dealt with.
Oneineight is right you probably won't meet the threshold for a statement/ECHP but it shows the school you are serious about getting this sorted and might make them do something.

Also, had I ought to wait until I hear from the Paed before I start going to CAMHS and looking into EHC?

Fairgame - I have no problem with going via GP.

SureStart agreed with me not to get involved with positive play/esteem building as if they go in during school time, it's disruptive to the whole class as DS gets over excited at seeing her and if it's after school, it's just another in a long line of women that he sees and I don't think it would be very beneficial. She agreed to pass his file onto the MAT team who have two male workers which I think would be of great benefit to DS.

It's so hard when school are saying "we've given up with his behaviour" but then saying what a disruption he is etc.

If the MAT are doing the input on self esteem then CAMHS probably won't get involved so stick with the MAT team for now.
If the HT is giving up with his behaviour then what is she suggesting you do? Does she want an ECH plan for him? Does she want him to go to a PRU?
She can't just give up and offer no alternatives, it's ridiculous and a disgusting attitude. Do you have a local parent partnership that you can speak to about all this? I know some people aren't keen on them on here but mine have always been brilliant so it might be worth a try. They can also come with you to meeting with HT.

Fairgame - I'm going to contact Parent Partnership - I feel like this has become a mess now that SureStart have left the picture.

Sorry to hear your head teacher is giving up. My DS (who has an ASC) sat on a separate table for the first few years of primary but that wasn’t “giving up”, it created a separate calm space where he could function better. He was still included with the others when for many activities, and a few years later the teacher tried moving him back to a shared table and that went well. Is your DS getting one-to-on TA time? My DS had full-time one-to-one support and he really needed it. But that didn’t count as “giving up” either.

Needing one-to-one may not be about “being the centre of attention” - at least not in the sense of wanting everyone to make a fuss of him. It may be much more about communication problems, or difficulties interacting with kids of his own age, or difficulties attending to multiple people at once. Which are the kinds of things that the paeditiatrian and perhaps a speech and language therapist should investigate. They really need to figure out whether this is caused by an underlying processing disability because if it is then treating it like a psychological or motivation problem is not going to work.

Also, DLA is not grabby, not at all. I know a couple of people who’ve used DLA to pay for private one-to-one swimming lessons because their kids disrupt or refuse to join in group activities, and that can be a way for them to enjoy swimming and get the exercise etc. DLA is a benefit you can spend on anything that will help your DS and make his his life better and I’m sure you could think of a lot of ways you could spend the money to do that!

Kleinzeit - Thank you for your fab reply - that has given me lots of food for thought.

I'd love to be able to send DS for 1-2-1 swimming lessons.

I think that a lot of the problems that I have with school are the HT's perception of 1-2-1 support, her perception of DS being "disruptive" and her general attitude. For "normal" children, she is a very good head, and when you come to school with statement in hand, she is a very good head - though if you come with a child who does not have things in place and does not make for a calm classroom - it's a different story.

I've sent HT an email with a few non-evasive questions that I hope won't get her back up (she is unhelpful when she feels she's in a corner) asking what strategies they are using, whether DS still gets 1-2-1 during assembly time and whether she feels it is appropriate to look at an ECH assessment.

It is frustrating because on his own, he is so different. When I mentioned this to HT this morning that at home, he'll play with lego for an hour - she started going on about how if I give him 1-2-1 at home, he can't have it at school etc - that was not my point. My point is that at home, he'll go into his room and play or sit and write a story for an hour or more totally lost in his play with no interaction from me - just him on his own.

Little dude has come home tonight saying that no-one likes him at school, no-one plays with him. This is not how things should be.