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hi this is the stuff ive put together for meeting if anyone thinks i should add more id really apprieciate the imput

11 replies

suedenley · 16/09/2006 17:13

Sorry its a long one grab a coffee lol
Do you ,the school, feel DS sen have been identified ,assessed,and quickly matched with appropriate provision
if they answer yes
Then what provision has been made ,do you feel that is sufficient? if so how can that be when he doesnt have a current I E P
if they answer no (which would be the honest answer)
Why not when an essential function of the lea is to make effective arrangements for this

So do you the school feel that DS's needs will be provided for regarding bullying,support for his education and social and communication support as well as understanding of his dx and allowances made ?
if they answer yes
How and what will be done because if this isnt effective then ds is going to continue to refuse school or end up with and exclusion
if they answer no
So what do you the LEA intend to do to provide DS with his education
if ds has to change school
where is he to go who is responsible for transport if further away
what about his brother
While i feel the school has been helpful on the face of things , arranging meetings at short notice etc, nothing productive has come from these meetings and the situation ive been expressing concern over has got worse as no information i have provided has been taken into account and no provision has been made to help ds with his anxiety over school issues and we find ourselves in this situation.
L E A said statement could be reapplied for in october after time on school action plus but as this hasnt happened and since part of there role is to prevent the development of a more signifigant need and ds is now refusing school surely its a little late for that now and as school refusal is a signifigant cause for concern (the requirement of a statutory assessment)the assessment should in fact be applied for now
if they say no
so are you suggesting that DS refusal of school doesnt show significant emotional and behavioural difficulies, that there arent clear examples of withdrawn and disruptive behaviouror a marked and persistent inability to concentate. Are you saying there is no evidence that he experiences considerable frustration or distress at his difficulties, has no difficulties establishing and maintainig relationships with his peers and that there is no evidence that he has no signifigant delay in the development of life and social skills.
He has all of these problems he is AS so refering to the sen code of practice 7:43 he should be assessed for a statement
should i add anything else please does anyone think please

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 17/09/2006 08:56

suedenley

I would also be very interested to hear their answers as well. These are very good questions to ask.

If you can take notes do so.

IPSEA have a section on school transport; the link for which is provided below:-

www.ipsea.org.uk/transport.htm

How did people find out about all this before the Net; with great difficulty I can surmise. In my particular case I knew about applying for a statement because my friend used to work in a SN nursery attached to a mainstream infants school. She told me about IPSEA and since that time I have spread the word as well. Have even had to educate the infants school about its existance.

Chocol8 · 17/09/2006 10:14

Hi Suedenley, your questions are very good - i wish i'd got the chance to ask these sort of questions when i was in your position.

When i spoke to them about ds's AS/ADHD, i knew they would not be interested, so i took along a Parent Partnership representative, can you do this?

If not, you are entitled to take someone else with you - and perhaps they could take notes for you? I found it difficult to take notes and talk as my head was buzzing (the SENCO was being extremely rude), so i scribbled what they'd said in the margin of my notes, which came in handy.

Unfortunately the school were not as accomodating as i had hoped - they had no SN provision for ds and were simply not interested in learning about any SN's. The new headmistress made it clear that she didn't want SN children in her school so i removed him immediately.

I complained about her to the Governors and had a hearing, but the head just continued to lie in statement and in person, although the school governors did write and apologise.

He's now in a lovely school (ms) and has regular(ish) IEPs and they work with him, not against him.

The very best of luck with your meeting.

mamadadawahwah · 17/09/2006 10:28

Another question, how do they intend to measure progress? What criteria do they use to measure any gains he has made?

What is his present level of educational performance (PLOP) how was this determined, when and what evidence is there they acted on this evidence?

What criteria do they use to determine that a task has been learned?

Be sure to send a letter after the meeting outlining what was said in the meeting and any problems or suggestions you have. If they answer any questions with the pat answer, "thats not our policy, or that is not how we do things", ask for them to put this in writing. Ask to see the policy, ask them to explain questions they answer with "no" in writing outlining the evidence for making a "no" answer.

Be sure to take notes, show them you mean business. Read back everything they say after you have written the notes and tell them you will follow up with a letter of your minutes of the meeting.

mamadadawahwah · 17/09/2006 10:31

go here: www.wrightslaw.com/advoc/articles/tests_measurements.html

this is the american "Wrightslaw" which has tons of info on the law and IEP and SEN provision. Its american but still much of it is very valid for us in terms of common sense.

Here is an excerpt:
In educational situations, it is essential that parents understand
the nature of the weak areas, what skills need to be learned to
strengthen those areas, and how the strong areas can be used to help
remediate the child's weak areas."
www.wrightslaw.com/advoc/articles/tests_measurements.html

Subject: Do teachers' lesson plans reflect children's IEP goals and
objectives?

the IEP journey are listed below in question form. Answering yes to
these questions and the ones posed in a later section (reviewing the
IEP) indicates that our destination may be in sight.

Do teachers' lesson plans reflect children's IEP goals and
objectives? Is the staff person responsible for teaching an objective
(s) monitoring the child's progress as indicated on the IEP? Are the
periodic reviews taking place as scheduled or as needed? Are related
services being provided as indicated on the IEP? Has an IEP meeting
been scheduled to discuss expected changes in objectives, goals,
services, and/or placement? Does instruction focus on the child's
strengths and needs? Are team members working together to implement
IEP goals and objectives? Have friendships and natural supports been
facilitated within the school and community for full implementation
of the child's program? Has the team made appropriate instructional
modifications in order to support the child's participation in
integrated school and community settings?
www.hyperlexia.org/iep_roadmap.html

Using the PEPSI to identify Student Strengths and Growth Needs Once a
PEPSI profile is established, there is a graphic representation of a
student's strengths and weaknesses. Use the following example of a
seven year old youngster to practice looking for student strengths
and areas that might be important to focus on as part of an
individual education plan.

Area Strengths Build-ons Physical Good large muscle coordination
Dresses self Prints own name Not washing hands after toileting Needs
help tying shoes Runs out of energy before tasks are completed

Emotional Very trusting Enjoys helping when asked Tattles to solve
problems with peers Has frequent tantrums Very stubborn, willful

Philosophical Wants to be praised Usually tells the truth Very loving
Bossy with others Takes others' things and cries when confronted No
recognition of others' needs

Social Likes to please the teacher Loves to organize things Tends to
interact with adults or play alone Possessive

Intellectual Counts to ten Writes own name when asked Reads twenty
sight words Likes to copy from the board Preschool grade level work
Five minute attention span Not able to follow two consecutive
directions

Now, write two objectives for each of the PEPSI areas. Stay focused
on strengthening the student's potential. Try to address one of the
objectives toward strengths the student already has.

Physical

Emotional

Philosophical

Social

Intellectual

Building on a Child's Strengths When I'm called upon to assist a
child who is struggling in school, I find the spotlight is often
focused on a child's weaknesses. This is particularly common for the
child with poor social skills, communication skills, learning
disabilities, and/or any other disability. Children with disabilities
already feel they are different. It is up to us to teach all children
that different is not bad, and that each of us has special strengths.
We can help that process along by showcasing every child's special
interest and strengths.

Years of remedial effort have been poured into fixing what's broken,
the deficit, rather than capitalizing on the strength and what works.
In other words, if a child can't read, hours are spent teaching that
child with methods that didn't work in the first place. If there are
behavior issues, the same punitive measures are used over-and-over,
yet there's no improvement.

When the spotlight shifts onto areas where your child shines, in
his/her areas of strengths and personal interest, there are often
very dramatic changes in work effort and negative behaviors often
dramatically diminish.

Child psychologist and recognized authority on ADHD, Dr. Robert
Brooks, developed the term "islands of competence" in reference to
these areas of strength. I interpret his concept in the following
way:

Everyone has strengths, but sometimes they're not obvious. We must
find those areas of strength and build on them. Every person must
feel they are making a contribution to their environment. If we
accept both these concepts, the obvious thing to do is to build upon
them. Every child must feel important and every child must taste
success. Once academic needs are determined and appropriate services
are in place, it's extremely important to begin building self-
confidence and self-reliance. It's essential to have a concerted
effort both at home and at school, with clear communication between
the school officials and the parents.

Dr. Brooks likes for each of his young patients to have a special job
at school in an area related to the child's interests and needs. It
can be something like feeding pets or taking attendance to the office
monitor. This can take creativity and ingenuity, but it's essential.

The schools I visit are sometimes resistant to this effort. After
all, only recently has there been such emphasis on this positive
approach to resolve behavior issues or low self-esteem problems.
Sometimes school personnel look at us like we've lost a few screws.
But it works! Inappropriate behaviors diminish, the child walks
taller, often begins to show improved self-confidence, and
demonstrates reliability. He feels needed and recognized for his
efforts.

Sadly, the child with a disability that impacts behavior and social
skills is often the last picked to help out with different tasks. In
reality, it's one of the single most effective tools to help your
child gain self-confidence.

The focus of scholastic effort must also be on the child's strengths.
Following, are just few examples and suggestions for compensating
effectively for weaknesses and building on strengths.

If your child has excellent verbal skills and creativity, but writing
is a struggle, you might ask for daily use of a computer. If a child
demonstrates such a need, (and I see this often in ADHD and learning
disabilities), than the school is responsible for providing that
assistive technology. Remember your child doesn't have to settle for
the broken computer in the corner of the room (which happens all too
frequently). Any needed equipment must be in working order and be
made available in the regular learning environment. If you're
concerned about the condition of equipment, you can stipulate in any
504 plan or IEP that the equipment be in working order and located in
an area immediately accessible to the student. Perhaps your child
grasps math concepts, but has difficulty performing the actual
calculations on paper. A calculator is a great assistive device for
such children. There might be complaints that the child has to first
learn math the "old fashioned way." Practical experience has taught
me that if a child can't perform very basic math calculations by,
say, the fifth grade, it will probably always be somewhat difficult.
Is he/she going to suddenly become proficient in this area when an
adult or count fingers? Most likely not. This person will buy a
calculator for as little as $5.00 and finally become successful in
performing practical arithmetic calculations. Why not start early to
help the person with a math disability progress rapidly with the
concepts by using a calculator to bypass the disability? This is not
to say a child should not continue to work on mastery of calculations
as well. Or take the fifth-grader who's struggling with second-grade
spelling, perhaps spending as much as two hours a night trying to
learn a list of twenty words. The most common modification, if any is
made at all, is to cut the list in half. What if we let that child
spend spelling time becoming computer literate? With the use of a
spell checker and word processor program to offset organizational
difficulties and spelling difficulties, children suddenly blossom
into creative authors. A child who is very distractible in the
classroom can show dramatic improvement when work is produced on a
computer. Headphones can also enhance learning. Many children with
ADHD tend to lose the thought somewhere between brain and pencil, but
are excellent writers when using a computer. There seems to be an
instant direct connection between brain and screen. Organizational
skills show improvement. Problem solving skills are also honed on the
computer, bypassing faulty circuitry that gets in the way of real
learning. In each of these instances weaknesses are diminished by
technology that levels the playing field for people with
disabilities. The spotlight then shifts from the writing weakness to
the content strengths.
www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/1580/strengths.html

An excellent way to actively involve all those invested in the
inclusion process is to implement the MAPS process when developing
the child's IFSP/IEP. MAPS stands for Making Action Plans or the
McGill Action Planning System. The Kansas State Board of Education
has available a manual and videotape which describes the actual MAPS
process in detail entitled MAPS: A Plan for Including All Children in
Schools (1990). The MAPS manual and videotape might prove to be
helpful in developing strategies for creating a user friendly and
functional IFSP/IEP for children attending inclusive early childhood
programs. Information presented in the MAPS manual is geared toward
older students, however we have found that by using a modified MAPS
system we have been able to create IFSP's/IEP's which are built upon
the child¹s strengths and prove to be functional within the inclusive
setting. www.circleofinclusion.org/pim/seven/maps.html

  1. What happens next?

Development of Goals and Objectives

Goals and objectives should be based on assessment, and should focus
on using a student's strengths and interest to address areas of
identified need. The best objectives contain specific information
about what we want a student to achieve, how instruction will support
the mastery of the goal, and are measurable.

www.parentsinc.org/newsletter/S98/SEQUENC.html

IDEA 1997 brings several changes to the IEP and the IEP team. Not
only will the role of the IEP team dramatically increase, the IEP
will move from a deficit-based educational plan to one that is
strength-based. IDEA 1997 is based on the belief that the majority of
students with disabilities can participate in the general education
curriculum to varying degrees.

www.cec.sped.org/pd/sbsre

The student's areas of strength and need. Whereas a statement of
needs identifies the student's weaknesses, a statement of strengths
identifies the student's own "tools" which can be used to address the
weaknesses. The basis for these statements should be the description
contained in the IPRC's statement. These statements might take the
form "Student demonstrates significant strength in..." and "Student
requires significant instruction/ support to ...."For
example, "Student demonstrates significant strength in auditory
learning"; "Student requires significant instruction/support to
develop reading skills."

Goals for the student. Goals should be based on the strengths and
needs of the student and represent the best prediction of what the
student should be able to accomplish by the end of the school year
www.ldao.on.ca/articles/newiprc.html

The IEP is a written document outlining the who, what, when, why,
where and how of instruction and related services that are to be
provided to a student with disabilities. IEPs are built upon the
strengths of individual students and are designed to help each
student achieve success in school, at home, at work, and in the
community.

The IEP Implementation Checklist p The IEP has been shared and
discussed with appropriate staff members and service providers. p
Instruction focuses on the student's strengths and needs. p
Instruction reflects stated IEP goals and objectives. p Identified
modifications and accommodations are being provided. p A designated
IEP team member is monitoring the student's progress.

www.msde.state.md.us/specialeducation/IEP%20Handbook2001.pdf

Strength Based Planning

Identify the strengths and resources of the student and student's
family and use these strengths and resources to develop an effective
IEP and / or other service plan. One full day offered once in the
fall and once in the spring.

Target Group: Administrators, SPED teachers, social workers, FSWs,
Counselors, CSSS, 504 Site: District Trainer: Felix Training
Institute rrsc.k12.hi.us/sped/kauai/kwsp2.htm

D. Exceptionally Appropriate Practices 1) Writes IEPs using a
strength-based approach www.bgsu.edu/org/focus/preschool.pdf

Strength-based assessments

Create Strength-based Functional Behavior Assessments/Interventions
Train on the development of Strength-based IEP's
www.air.org/TAPartnership/consultant_pool/bios/w_hussey.htm

A good IEP has objectives that focus on a student's strengths and aim
for positive outcomes
www.acl.on.ca/Daily_News/2001/oct01/oct17.htm

The result of the teamwork is and IEP that embraces John's strengths
and the team's goals www.region3.net/Region%
20III/AnnRpt/99annualreport/annual_report11.html

Based on the child's needs while building upon the child's strengths,
the team drafts both annual goals and short term learning outcomes.
star.nm.org/deafblind/forms/facts/IEPDevelopment.pdf

The focus of the IEP should be the development of strategies to build
on the child's strengths in order to remediate weaknesses and build
self-esteem. Educators agree that the best strategy for helping the
child with learning disabilities is to concentrate on strengthening
the child's existing abilities, while working steadily to improve
weaker skills. For example, if the child has excellent verbal skills
but is totally frustrated putting thoughts on paper, the IEP might
specify that his reports be given orally. If the child is strong in
math and poor in reading, the IEP might specify having him coach a
classmate who is struggling with math; reading support might include
reading two key paragraphs in the sports section of the newspaper
each night to a parent. www.ldac-taac.ca/ldindepth/six.htm

  1. What are the individual's strengths, gifts and abilities? So often when educational teams get together, they dwell upon the things that the individual cannot do as opposed to identifying and building upon the strengths and abilities of the individual. The facilitator asks the participants to review the list which described the individual as a way to identify some of his or her strengths and unique gifts. In addition, they are instructed to think about what the individual can do, what he or she likes to do and what he or she does ssd.k12.mo.us/Inclusion/maps.htm

This full-day workshop is designed develop participants' skills in
the implementation of research-validated educational programming for
students with Autism and other significant disabilities according to
IDEA `97. It is intended for all staff working with this population
in an elementary through secondary environment. First, participants
will learn to develop and monitor IEP's using a strength-based
approach, implement proactive behavior and integration plans, and
identify the major research-validated strategies used with this
unique population.
www.nasponline.org/pdf/prel_prog02_thurws.pdf

The student's areas of strength and need. Whereas a statement of
needs identifies the student's weaknesses, a statement of strengths
identifies the student's own "tools" which can be used to address the
weaknesses. The basis for these statements should be the description
contained in the IPRC's statement. The statements might take the
form "Student demonstrates significant strength in?" and "Student
requires significant instruction/support to ?" For example, "Student
demonstrates significant strength in auditory learning"; "Student
requires significant instruction/support to develop reading skills."

Goals for the student. Goals should be based on the strengths and
needs of the student and represent the best prediction of what the
student should be able to accomplish by the end of the school year.

www.ldany.on.ca/Special%20Ed/individual_education_plan.htm

Based on the child's needs while building upon the child's strengths,
the team drafts both annual goals and short term learning outcomes.
www.usdb.k12.ut.us/fss/hand7.htm

A child's strengths should be a part of any IEP and these strengths
should be drawn upon when developing goals and objectives.

Strengths should be identified in all five areas described on page 1.
In addition, strengths should not be limited to only academics and/or
physical abilities. They can, and should, include interests skills,
hobbies, peronal traits, etc.

Examples:

Matt is great at basketball. Dylan is trying really hard to talk.
Benjamin knows how to use the computer. Emily likes to play board
games with other girls. * Nicole can read 4th grade textbooks.

www.geocities.com/Heartland/Village/9021/articles/iepplanning.h
tml

We must develop individualized educational plans (IEPS) that give
more than lip service to a child's strengths and that solidly
reflect, in their goals and objectives, a desire to help children
achieve success (rather than to "overcome their problems").
www.thomasarmstrong.com/articles/empower.htm

What are the parents and other school-based resource people trained
to do? The content of the training is flexible and can be altered to
respond to the goals of each participating school. However, resource
people are expected to know how to: · develop student-specific
interventions · conduct functional behavioral assessments (strength
assessments) · work with families as allies · offer consultation for
preparing strength-based IEPs · describe proactive behavior
management strategies · work with community teams to create strength-
based plans.
www.wbgh.com/nrn/Integrating_Systems_of_Care_Through_Public_Sch
ools.PDF

an Individualized Educational Plan is designed to assist the student
to make reasonable academic gains utilizing his/her strengths and
remediate weaknesses
www.iusd.k12.ca.us/mp/general_info/support.htm

By assessing all intelligences, students' strengths can be recognized
and utilized to address those weaknesses that are identified in the
classroom context

www.york.cuny.edu/~seitz/AERA2001.htm

Introduction On the following pages you will find a collection of
educational strategies for students with learning differences . These
strategies were collected over a four year period and are rooted in
practice. Some of them arose out of conferences involving advisors
and parents, and some from the creative teaching of the faculty.
Still others came from the students themselves; bits of wisdom
prefaced by, "Hey, I know something that works for me; why don't you
try it!".

Rather than focusing solely on a student's difficulties, this
collection of strategies addresses how to use a student's strengths
to compensate for difficulties; how to celebrate and use those
strengths in the classroom and at home. Rather than comparing the
student to a normed group, we look for the peaks and valleys within
that student's profile, i.e. "relative" strengths and difficulties.
This "intra-student" rather than "inter-student" perspective is more
meaningful for purposes of intervention.

This booklet is to be used by staff in conjunction with the student's
Individualized Education Plan (IEP) and multi-sensory planning
handout, and will be a vital resource for lesson planning and for
discussion of a student's learning style. The booklet is divided into
two sections, LONG TERM GOALS IN AREAS OF RELATIVE STRENGTH and LONG
TERM GOALS IN AREAS OF RELATIVE DIFFICULTY. Long term goals are those
areas of strengths and difficulties commonly referred to in a
psychological - educational evaluation. Goals are alphabetized and
there is a glossary of technical terms on the last page.

suedenley · 17/09/2006 10:54

Blimey excellent thankyou mmddww
Thats brilliant thankyou so much for all that help.The school are always treating me like a complete idiot ,being patronizing andlooking at me like im stupid when i descibe DS difficulties , as though they have never come across these kind of problems before, when of course as an inclusive school with quite a high number of kids with asd, adhd etc is quite ridiculous.
So im going in there with the head senco teacher plus the ed phych mental health worker and the LEA with the intention of fighting for my son and being fully prepared even though only had 4 days notice.
They are about to find out they underestimated me

OP posts:
jenk1 · 17/09/2006 11:17

suedenley, can you get someone else there that will be on "your side" so to speak?

The SENCO and Ed Psych will at the end of the day have to go along with what the school say

Can you get your Consultant?, Ours was the only one apart from PP that stuck up for us, our SENCO accused me of having MSBP and said that i was standing at the school gates waiting for something to happen, the next meeting when the COnsultant came and confirmed everything we said i couldnt resist giving her sly looks.

Please dont go unless you have someone to back up what you are saying, in these meetings they are very clever at twisting what has been said and then putting notes in writing about things that you havent agreed on, eg they put something in one of our meetings that hadnt been agreed and our Consultant immediately phoned up and demanded that they omit the part and rewrite the notes which they did but didnt send us a copy .

Dont want to frighten you, its just that after having fought with them for over a year i know what they are capable of.

mamadadawahwah · 17/09/2006 11:40

More stuff from the Yanks. This is applicable in large part to us as well.

COMEBACKS THAT HAVE WORKED

A few suggestions below:

sd; her grades are good
comeback; COMPARED TO WHAT?

sd; why do you want to label him?
comeback; HIS BEHAVIOR LABELS HIM, THE DIAGNOSIS GIVES US HOPE OF HELPING
HIM APPROPRIATELY.

sd; she'll be in a class with 'lesser' students
comback; GEE, I THOUGHT IN THE UNITED STATES WE WERE ALL CONSIDERED EQUALS -
OR - SHE NEEDS TO BE IN THE CLASS THAT IS APPROPRIATE TO HER NEEDS.

sd; grade levels on the tests don't matter
comeback; THEN WHY ARE THEY GIVEN? AND WHAT DOES MATTER? HOW DE WE
DETERMINE WHAT THE TEST IS TESTING, THEN?

sd; we don't do that
comeback; NEVER? NOT EVEN WHEN THE CHILD'S EDUCATIONAL NEEDS REQUIRE IT?
GEE, I THOUGHT THAT WAS AGAINST THE LAW.

sd; PT is not an educational need
comeback; IT IS IF MY CHILD CANNOT PERFORM SCHOOL-RELATED TASKS DUE TO
DEFICITS IN THIS AREA.

sd; _ is not an educational neeed
comeback; SAME AS ABOVE.

sd; this is the only program we offer
comeback; GEE, I THOUGHT THE "I" IN IDEA STOOD FOR INDIVIDUAL - AREN'T YOU
REQUIRED BY LAW TO PROVIDE A RANGE OF PROGRAMS MEETING INDIVIDUAL NEEDS?

sd; 1/2 hour per week OT is all students get
comeback; EVERY STUDENT? WITH EVERY LEVEL OF NEED? GEE, THAT DOESN'T SOUND
VERY INDIVIDUALIZED TO ME. WHAT IF MY CHILD'S LEVEL OF NEED REQUIRES MORE
OT THAN THAT? HOW WILL YOU MEET HIS NEED?

sd; sI isn't for school
comeback; WHY NOT? MY CHILD'S SENSORY NEEDS AFFECT HIS/HER ABILITY TO
BENEFIT ADEQUATELY FROM HIS/HER EDUCATION. HOW ELSE WILL YOU ADDRESS THIS
PROBLEM SO MY CHILD MAY RECEIVE A FAPE? CAN I HAVE THAT IN WRITING?

sd; we don't have the funds
come back; OH, THAT'S TOO BAD. I UNDERSTAND THAT FEDERAL LAW PROHIBITS
FINANCIAL NEEDS FROM BEING CONSIDERED IN PROVIDING MY CHILD WITH HER FAPE.

sd; she has good grades now, she doesn't need sped anymore
comeback; SHE HAS GOOD GRADES BECAUSE OF THE APPROPRIATE SUPPORT SHE HAS
BEEN RECEIVING. WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU WITHDRAW THE SUPPORT AND HER GRADES
DROP AGAIN? I WILL NEED EVIDENCE THAT SHE CAN BENEFIT FROM HER EDUCATION
WITHOUT THIS SUPPORT BEFORE I CAN AGREE TO ANY CHANGES.

sd; you have to find a social skills group
comeback; IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IS SUPPOSED TO HELP
ME WITH MEETING MY CHILD'S EDUCATIONAL NEEDS. WHAT SOCIAL SKILLS GROUP WILL
YOU PROVIDE?

sd; you have to find a summer school
comeback; IF MY CHILD NEEDS SUMMER SCHOOL, IT IS PART OF HIS EDUCATIONAL
NEEDS FOR AN EXTENDED SCHOOL YEAR, AND THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IS RESPONSIBLE
FOR MEETING THOSE NEEDS.

sd; you have to find a summer camp
comeback WHY? WHAT NEEDS WILL IT ADDRESS? AND WHY ISN'T THIS PART OF MY
CHILD'S FREE AND APPROPRIATE EDUCATION?

sd; we don't need to write that down
comeback I FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE WITH EVERYTHING WRITTEN DOWN. AFTER ALL,
YOU COULD WIN THE LOTTERY TOMORROW AND YOUR REPLACEMENT WON'T KNOW ABOUT
THIS AGREEMENT UNLESS IT'S IN WRITING.

sd; we do that naturally
comeback; I'M SURE YOU DO. HOWEVER, IF WE CHANGE DISTRICTS IN MID-YEAR,
THIS MUST BE SPECIFIED IN THE IEP IN CASE THE OTHER DISTRICT DOES NOT DO IT
NATURALLY.

sd; we don't know how to do an FBA
comeback HERE IS THE NAME AND NUMBER OF AN EXPERT WHO WILL COME IN AND DO
THE FBA AND/OR TRAIN YOUR STAFF. OR - AREN'T YOU REQUIRED BY LAW TO KNOW
HOW TO DO THEM? HOW DO YOU INTEND TO ADDRESS THIS PROBLEM?

sd; [written in IEP] where/when appropriate
comeback; GEE, I THOUGHT THIS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE MORE SPECIFIC. CAN YOU
TELL ME THE TYPES OF SITUATIONS WHERE YOU IMAGINE THIS MAY BE APPROPRIATE?
OKAY, LET'S WRITE THOSE IN, THEN.

sd; [written in the IEP,] in a timely fashion
someback; WHAT DOES THIS MEAN? CAN WE MAKE AN ESTIMATE OF WHEN THIS SHOULD
OCCUR?

sd; just trust us, we know best
comeback; GEE, I'D LOVE TO JUST TRUST YOU, BUT AS A FULL MEMBER OF THIS IEP
TEAM I NEED TO UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT IS BEING DONE AND WHY.

sd; let's just wait and see
comeback; HOW LONG WILL WE WAIT? AND WHAT CRITERIA WILL WE USE TO JUDGE
OUTCOME? AND WHAT STEPS WILL WE TAKE BASED ON THAT OUTCOME?

sd; she has to take that 1 1/2 bus ride
comeback; WHY? DOES THAT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT HER SPECIAL NEEDS?

sd; he doesn't look depressed
comeback; YES, THAT'S WHAT MAKES IT SO HARD TO KNOW WHEN TO HELP HIM.
THAT'S WHY MY (PSYCHIATRIST, PSYCHOLOGIST, DOCTOR) WHO MADE THE DIAGNOSIS
RECOMMENDS WE DO THE FOLLOWING.....

sd; we don't have a harrassment/bullying policy
comeback; WHY NOT? CAN I HAVE THAT IN WRITING?

sd; she has to stay in to make up that work
comeback; WHY? CAN I HAVE THAT IN WRITING?

sd; he lacks motivation
comeback; GEE, HOW CAN WE ADDRESS THAT EDUCATIONAL NEED?

sd; [phone call] come and get your child NOW
comeback; HAVE YOU TRIED EACH AND EVERY STEP IN THE BEHAVIORAL INTERVENTION
PLAN?

sd; he has to learn to be more responsible
comeback; OKAY, HOW WILL WE TEACH HIM THAT?

sd; more accomodation will only 'enable' him, threatening his future
comeback; OH, I DISAGREE. I THINK THE ACCOMODATION WE'RE DISCUSSING IS
NEEDED TO ALLOW HIM TO MOVE TOWARD INDEPENDENCE.

sd; this is the only communication device we have
comeback IS IT APPROPRIATE TO HIS NEEDS? IF NOT, I REQUEST A FORMAL
ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY ASSESSMENT TO DETERMINE WHICH DEVICE THE SCHOOL
DISTRICT NEEDS TO MAKE AVAILABLE TO HIM.

sd; the CSPD is only for state use
comeback; REALLY? CAN YOU SHOW ME WHERE THAT IS STATED IN LAW?

sd; there's not enough time to discuss this issue, moving on..
comeback; I'M NOT COMFORTABLE JUST DROPPING THIS ISSUE. I'M WILLING TO
MOVE ON IF WE SCHEDULE A TIME WITHIN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS TO DISCUSS IT
FURTHER.

sd; but you have to sign this now
comeback; IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT I CANNOT LEGALLY BE COMPELLED TO SIGN
ANYTHING. I NEED SOME TIME TO LOOK IT OVER BEFORE I SIGN.

sd; art therapy is not a related service
comeback ARE YOU SAYING MY CHILD DOES NOT NEED THIS SERVICE IN ORDER TO
BENEFIT FROM HIS FAPE? IF SO, HOW ELSE DO YOU INTEND TO MEET HIS IDENTIFIED
NEEDS? CAN I HAVE THAT IN WRITING?

sd; parent training? what's that? there's no reason for that in an IEP
comeback; HERE IS THE REGULATION WHICH STATES THAT YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR
APPROPRIATE PARENT TRAINING.

sd; you have to find the right meds for him
comeback; HIS PHYSICIAN AND I ARE WORKING ON THAT ASPECT; WHAT WE NEED TO
DISCUSS HERE IS HOW WE CAN ADDRESS HIS NON-MEDICAL NEEDS.

sd; if we do it for one, we will have to do it for all
comeback; GEE, THAT SEEMS TO FLY IN THE FACE OF THE "INDIVIDUAL" PART OF
IEP. PLUS, IF MY CHILD NEEDS IT IN ORDER TO BENEFIT FROM FAPE, THE SCHOOL
DISTRICT IS REQUIRED TO PROVIDE IT.

sd; there's no way we will authorize a 1 on 1 aide
comeback; NEVER? FOR ANY CHILD? REGARDLESS OF LEVEL OF NEED? GEE, THAT
DOESN'T SOUND LEGAL TO ME.

sd; we need to see your child's medical and psychological records, sign here
comeback; WHY? PLEASE PUT YOUR REASONS IN WRITING AND I WILL CONSIDER IT.

sd; someone will get back to you
comeback; WHO? AND EXACTLY WHEN? CAN I HAVE THAT IN WRITING?

sd; [child going into 7th grade,needs a mentor from the local college
program] we don't do prevocational, you will have to wait til age 14,
transition
comeback ; ARE YOU SAYING MY CHILD DOES NOT NEED A MENTOR NOW? OH, HE
DOES? THEN WHAT WILL YOU DO TO MEET THIS NEED?

sd; he doesn't need AT
comeback; WHY NOT? AND CAN I HAVE ANOTHER ASSESSMENT DONE?

sd; there must be problems at home; aren't you divorced?
comeback; I BEG YOUR PARDON? I DON'T THINK THIS IS AN APPROPRIATE SUBJECT
FOR THIS MEETING. LET'S GET BACK TO MY CHILD'S IDENTIFIED EDUCATIONAL
NEEDS.

sd; your child isn't ready for that
comeback; WHY NOT? WHEN WILL SHE BE READY? HOW WILL WE KNOW? CAN I HAVE
THAT IN WRITING?

sd; subjective measurement is how it's done
comeback; I'M SURE IF WE BRAINSTORM WE CAN COME UP WITH A WAY TO FOLLOW THE
LAW BY OBJECTIVELY MEASURING THIS.

sd; your child won't be able to keep up in a regular class
comeback; I KNOW, THAT'S WHY WE NEED TO PROVIDE SUITABLE ACCOMODATIONS AND
MODIFICATIONS.

any others appreciated! 
ty! 
```````` 
Hope some of these help (can you tell I was starting to get angry? LOL). 

Michelle W 
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The correct comeback to most of these is something I learned at an advocacy workshop: "Show me in writing where your policy states that". If it isn't in writing, it doesn't exist applies here, too. Eileen L. 
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sd; we don't do that > comeback;I realize that none of your current students are receiving a program like this one, but since IDEA requires an appropriate education which meets each child's needs, there are no encompassing absolutes. If the IEP team agrees that this service is a appropriate and meets a needs, it can be done. sd; this is the only program we offer > comeback; I realize that this is the program that some students are currently receiving, but since it is not appropriate for this child and does not meet his need we need to discuss other options> Individual Education Plans are just that: individual, and perhaps if a new program is started you will find that it will also meet the needs of others. sd; 1/2 hour per week OT is all students get > comeback; I realize that most students do not requires the extensive occupational therapy that my child does, however I hardly find that offering him the amount of therapy that the other children need either individualizing his education plan, or appropriate to him. Let's discuss HIS needs. > sd; we don't have the funds > come back; Gee, I thought that discussing funding during an IEP was illegal- let me just get that on tape. sd; you have to find a social skills group > comeback; Since my child has an identified need in social skills, and it has an impact on his education I ask that the SD meet this need by providing social skills training. sd; you have to find a summer school > comeback; Let's discuss my child's eligibility for extended year services in order not to regress over the break. sd; we don't need to write that down > comeback I will note it right here in my parents notes, can I also get that on tape? sd; we do that naturally > comeback; Great! So then let's just add it to the notes so in case of staff changes. sd; [written in IEP] where/when appropriate > comeback; Let's modify that to make it more concrete. sd; [written in the IEP,] in a timely fashion > someback; Let's qualify that to give us a deadline- what would you consider a timely fashion? sd; he lacks motivation > comeback; Let's make up a plan to motivate him, write a goal, get a behaviorist to work with the teacher to help find his motivation and support her efforts. > sd; [phone call] come and get your child NOW > comeback; Is he ill? Is he suspended? The he will ride the bus home like always. If you would like to set up a meeting to address some behavior issues I would be more than happy to. sd; there's not enough time to discuss this issue, moving on.. > comeback; Well, then let's schedule a meeting to finnish it up when you can take time to address all of the issues at hand. Here is when I am available..... sd; if we do it for one, we will have to do it for all > comeback; The beauty of an IEP is that it is individualized plan, and only what a child needs it required. I would like the name of the person and the date which I will hear a reply from them written into the IEP notes. 

If you were refused something, the school owes you your Procedural Safeguard of Prior Written Notice. 20 U.S.C. 1415(c) (1) a description of the action proposed or refused by the agency; (2) an explanation of why the agency proposes or refuses to take the action; (3) a description of any other options that the agency considered and the reasons why those options were rejected; (4) a description of each evaluation procedure, test, record or report that the agency used as a basis for the proposed or refused action; (5) a description of any other factors that are relevant to the agency's proposal or refusal; (6) a statement that the parents of a child with a disability have protection under the procedural safeguards of this part and, if this notice is not an initial referral for evaluation, the means by which a copy of a description of the procedural safeguards can be obtained; and (7) sources for parents to contact to obtain assistance in understanding the provision of this part. BE SURE YOU RECEIVE YOUR PROCEDURAL SAFEGUARDS BY LAW

suedenley · 17/09/2006 13:52

Hi jenk
Yes taking keyworker with me and husband so got support on my side, yes they are sneaky buggers though only just realised the extent of there sneakiness.
Still think ive got some surprizes in store for them this time. unless they read mumsnet lol

mamadadawahwah
All this is excellent will read it over a few times write it all down to make sure some of it stays inside my head. Thanks again this is brilliant

OP posts:
Saturn74 · 17/09/2006 13:57

Hi suedenley, I think you had a list of things that your DS said would make him feel more comfortable in school (apologies if it wasn't you! ). I would make sure you document those and ask when they can be implemented - and if not why not.

suedenley · 17/09/2006 14:39

Hi Humphreycushion
Yes that was me. Head already said no to those requests so am going to ask why his requests are unobtainable when LEA are present as it states in the sen code of practice
children, who are capable of forming veiws,have the right to recieve and make known information, to express an opion and have that opion taken into account in any matters affecting them.
But im leading them into a false sense of security by letting them think ive forgotten about the fact they have said no , their sneakiness is rubbing off on me lol

OP posts:
Saturn74 · 17/09/2006 15:01

Good for you - take no prisoners!

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