SEN, no statement, possible ASD, exluded for two days...what next?

[LaTourEiffel]

I'm so in the dark abbot what is going on, so if anyone outs prepared to help me unravel and maybe point me in the next direction, that would be great.

DS1 has had difficulties with emotional and behavioural development since reception. he's now in year one and having persistent and increasingly violent outbursts.

He was classed as special needs by the school in around November time (2013) at school action plus level.

He is performing very well at reading and maths, but struggles with literacy.

He has violent outbursts at school, which involve throwing of chairs and causing harm to others, both children and adults.

He attends breakfast and after school club at a local day care, who also experience some issues, but on the whole, they seem not as extreme as at school. We attribute this to there being less children, less demands etc.

Due to an incident last week, meeting was called this Friday with school, senco and local authority psychologist. I invited daycare to attend also so we are all on the same page.

He had a community paediatric appointment on the Thursday (referral made by gp after I went there for help). she said she supported my research that he could be on the spectrum, and had made referrals for salt, ot and two a consultant at the hospital.

we dropped him at school. after the appointment, and there was another incident where he threw a chair at a teacher. she wasn't harmed but they've excluded him temporarily due to physical abuse towards staff.

In the Friday meeting, which went ahead anyway, the senco has said that he won't get a statement because you have to be performing below expected targets and because he's so good at maths and reading, he won't get one.

We found out on the meeting that he has been having one to one support on the afternoons since Christmas, but we were unaware and have not meet her.

We also found out that the school has a support worker that does a lunchtime club that he can choose to attend, that builds on social skills, self esteem exercises, etc. He has set himself objectives to not hurt anyone He just doesn't seem to recall this when something sets him off.

What next?

We have a reintegration meeting on tues at 1.30. They said on Friday that may include a phased return to school.

They have also said they don't have the resources available to extend his one to one support into the mornings.

I've spent the last few months with my mobile constantly at my side, dreading the day I get a call to say something terrible has happened.

What do I do?

I have limited support available to me, my only support is mobbing out of the atra over Easter (which stays next Friday here).

This is all new, escalating rapidly, and I have very little knowledge of either special needs or the education system, never mind how it all fits together.

So much to think about, I have no idea if I've missed anything..

I have consistently stated the non value to ds of exclusion, that the reason he is excluded is failure to meet needs, its descimination etc etc.
makes no difference.

we are just biding time till special school with staff who undrrstand ASD is available.

I would not subject ds to more time at school as he simply cannot cope with it, or , more accurately they do not know how to help him cope.
specific circumstances......not necessarily what OP is experiencing.

The school can and should provide up to 15 hours of support before they need top up money from the LA......the SEN budget is not ringfenced for use only for SEN so if they dont spend it on a child they can allocate is anywhere they like......so they miss it when it has to be used for its purpose.........

get the assessment requested, get the needs known and understood, and go from there.

Have Googled it and can see that it's about physical intervention. I don't know if they've had training, in an incident last week they had to physically get between him and the boy he was hitting as he was beyond being able to respond to verbal instruction. They said he had little comprehension of what had happened until they acted it out with puppets for him.

The school have put things in place that are helping him, it seems, but they've not told us what they are doing, or the logic behind it, so in some respects, we are gradually finding out that the situation in school is far worse than we knew.

He has a named chair and pencil, social development sessions, one to one teaching (still can't get over that we didn't know this!!!), and they use puppets to help him regularly, it seems. Probably lots more that I don't know about too.

Apply for a statement. Ask the LA to provide emergency funding so the school can provide full time 1:1. An exclusion won't help anyone other than school and you need to be firm they cannot call you out of work or put him on PT timetable. Look at IPSEA etc on illegal PT timetables. Ambitious about autism just did report on this as have other organisations. The school only have to fund the first 12-15 hours. The top up has to come from LA usually via a statement but they can do it as emergency pending an assessment. For a young child they can statement with one overarching report which can be EP. School want a PT timetable because they don't want him there without 1:1. That's understandable as they have a duty of care to staff and other children. So the LA must step in and top up or offer him a temporary placement in special school, or offer home tuition (& ideally social care support so you can work and someone can look after him, although that rarely happens they usually expect you to quit work). School has behaved very badly not telling you what level of support they were putting in, they should have realised he needed a statement months ago. It's rubbish about academics. DS is not behind with maths or reading and he has a statement with very expensive specialist support 35 hours a week, 48 weeks a year including in mainstream school. I would be making it clear to school this situation where your job is on the line now is their fault for delaying and the school should fund full time 1:1 until a statement comes through or get the LA to. You should not have to suffer because they have not told you how serious things were before now. I would be wanting to see the full school file, any records of behaviour incidents etc ask for this as a formal data request. If they let a child seriously hurt a teacher or another child they are negligent. They probably know this which is why they don't want him there without 1:1. Look at sen code of practice including about emergency placements. But send the IPSEA letter for a statement immediately so you have started the clock. Once they know you won't drop everything and keep him home then they will have to put in full time 1:1 and even teach him away from the class for a while. Anything they ask you to do eg go PT, ask them to direct you to the law or bit of sen code that allows them to do that. You have to show you are not a pushover as it's cheap and convenient for them to drop all this on you. Are there any schools with units attached? The LA can put him temporarily in a special school without a statement, what you don't want is for him to end up in a PRU as they are not suitable for young children.

also, the nursery that provides breakfast and after school club to both ds1 & 2 has suggested that a caf may help us.

Any thoughts on this?

She is saying that she has concerns regarding ds2 behaviour and recognises that essentially, it's just me and dh, and that we need more co-ordinated support.

When I mentioned it to the paediatrician on Thursday, she didn't seem to think it would be necessary.

I am absolutely blind to the politics of all of this, btw...

Agnes, totally didn't see your post. Thank you very much, its a really helpful post and captures my frustrations really well.

I have just found a recent newspaper article about a parent that removed her child from the same school, due to the schools failure to engage external support to get a diagnosis, and that she had to get an independent diagnosis done... her son has similar special needs. She lives at the end of my road, winner how shed fell about me calling in for a coffee and chat

It feels strange typing that ds1 has special needs, until this week, whilst I knew DS had difficulties, I had no idea that it was so serious or that he was consuming so much of schools resources.

I have had a similar experience and have also seen a recent newspaper article matching what you've seen. If possible can you pm me your county - if it's the same as mine I could have useful information for you.

I am a genuine regular here but name change often.

Seen your profile and I think you may well be in the same area. I have sent you a pm.

They shouldn't be getting between him and a child he is attacking, they should be evacuating all other children from the area.

You want to ask them questions such as: what triggers his out bursts? What are they doing to handle these? What outside advice have they sought? (You should have signed for any they have consulted).
I'm not sure that they should have excluded him, if they have not tried all other routes.

Do not feel guilty. If they haven't been making it clear how disruptive his behaviour was, how were you supposed to know?

To be honest if I was that woman who had removed my child, I would be very willing to discuss if I could.

Hi carrotscruncher, have replied to your message ?

I knocked on the other mums door this evening and she was really lovely. She is going to try and put me in touch with other mums with Dc in similar situation.

She is also in regular dialogue with county about the improvements the school is supposed to be making.

I had a visit from the lady down the road last night, she was here nearly two hours, very kind of her to give up her evening like that.
She wanted to help us prepare for today's meeting, and has explained that it became apparent when her DS moved school that the school hadn't been supporting her DS. Further, that the lack of MEP's meant that the new school had no evidence to use in their applications for further funding to get her DS the support he so clearly needs.

I will be requesting that one is put together asap for DS.

In the meantime, the head has phoned to say that she fully intends to tell DS why he was excluded, and it appears that as she so fundamentally disagrees with me, I can't stop her. In an effort to control the way that information is delivered to him, I have discussed it this morning. I didn't need to say much, he already knew - he said he worked it out.

He has also said that he doesn't want to go to school today because people always make him angry, and then he hurts them and gets in trouble and he doesn't want to be in trouble anymore.

The solution would be either not to get angry or not to hurt anyone if he does...... which believe me we've been over time and time and time again. He has calm down flash cards, a calm down corner, gets stickers, button jar for rewarding good behaviour, treats for good behaviour, praise for good behaviour, we ignore the little things...I can't put it all down here but we've tried everything that has been suggested. (Including the time out step). Nothing works. So now he says he knows that this make him a naughty boy, though we've never called him this.

Unfortunately for me, there is now a risk that the exclusion has demonstrated that by behaving badly enough, Mummy has to come and take him home - which is exactly where he wants to be because he doesn't get angry, therefore doesn't get on trouble.

He also is adamant that the TA that school are telling me is there for him, doesn't stay with him, but "goes off to see other children all the time". This is the TA that the head told me had cost the school resources, and that children had to go without exercise books so that DS could have the extra support.

The head has said they have arranged an extra member of staff to do lunchtime duty for this week as a trial to see if it helps.

The school are doing things to manage his behaviour, but despite the paediatrician telling them to treat it like autism, the school are convinced that he "needs to try harder" He needs to "obey the rules". Now I don't have a full understanding of autism, or know if that's even what the problem is, but the paed said DS wouldn't be able to understand the rules. So the problem is going to continue, as far as I can see.

I'm guessing it's too early for ?

mumytime, they have had an educational psychologist come in to do an assessment, as part of his action plus, but there's been no clear strategy, objectives, timescales or owners for the strategy identified.

The head said last night that the ed psych has arranged for DS to have some one to one anger management from a seperate specialised ed psych. So this has been arranged without any explanation of who will do it, what qualifications they have, details of how the course works, timescales, method of delivery etc. Maybe I'm being a control freak ? but I want to know!!

I've had a doctor say to DS "why can't you stop upsetting your mummy", and had to watch my child climb inside himself with shame and hurt in response; so I've learnt the hard way that there are some really insensitive idiots out there .

They should give you that kind of information, also an outside person can't see your child without you being informed (and I think without your consent really).

Is your son changing schools soon? If so I would talk to the next school to see if they are any better.

Are you in contact with the NAS? Another mother at my DDs school has been bombing our school with information and got someone from the NAS to advise them. They still don't totally "get" it, despite lots of experience but are light years better than your DS's.

Children with Autism can understand rules, its just they have to be explained to them very clearly and explicitely, and then they want to see them rigidly adhered to. However if a situation becomes totally overwhelming they can totally lose it, and not be able to control their actions. (I think it is like a frightened animal, that will lash out if cornered.)

ds is very much like you describe, he gets upset if he can't do as told and if others don't do as told, often taking out upon himself to try to correct other's behavior, but other children don't want him to do this, and he doesn't seem to know when or how to deal with this. At this point the description of the frightened animal (with teeth and nails) comes to mind.

I just wish his reactions were in proportion to what was happening, everything's always so dramatic.

I'm so exhausted with it all and don't know how to handle him anymore .

Okay you need help. The explosive child may help, I haven't really used it as the behaviour happens far less at home (and is much milder).
My DD doesn't really get her feelings and we have found The Asperger's children's toolkit useful.

The best thing about DDs diagnosis is that I feel less guilty, and have also realised she never is going to act just like the others. I do also find myself getting cross if school or others try to blame her for things she just can't do.

If they've done the official exclusion letter with notice of your right to ask the governors to review it, that part of the exclusion is legal. However, a phased return isn't: the exclusion ends when it ends and ds is entitled to be in school full time thereafter, with all the support he needs to try to avoid similar incidents in future.

hi there, this sounds outrageous - you need to get an SA in place - Ive recently gone thru this process and now have a Statement. I can give you the following tips:

1. when you send your "I am writing to ask you to assess the educational needs of my son " letter, enclose all your evidence and proof with that letter as they wont write back to you to ask for it they will just refuse you if the evidence is sent initially - or at least noted on the letter that it will follow "within the next 4 weeks", do not delay write the letter ASAP as its a slow process - If its useful Ill post up a draft letter to the LA for you to use
2. your Parent Partnership at your LA should be able to help you thru this process - use them but dont show them all your cards - some are better than others but remember they are funded by the LA - at least they will help you navigate the process
3. REPORTS ARE KEY : ask the school to do a report on your child's behaviour and the fact that they cant cope and send that too. Get a report from every single person who has been working with your child, enclose your own report too in the form of a chronological diary of events. Write up all meeting notes in full and circulate via email to the parties involved for an accurate record which will then be 'on file', enclose these too, especially if the outcomes they are suggesting are inadequate. All the letters from the school especially the exclusion one re. being excluded for physical abuse towards staff .
4. create your ideal SHOPPING LIST: this is your informed list of what you want, schools/TA/OT etc. Im not sure where you are based but if this school are failing to cope with him then the Statement should either offer a TA full time or name another school that can cope with him - better you do your research and find out what is best/works for you so that there are no surprises when the school is named thats an hour and half away from where you live and you cant possibly accept.
5. STATIONARY: start a physical file now, keep everything in order with file tabs and make sure you keep all the original reports, if you are organised about what you are trying to achieve and have a map of how you are going to get there then it wont seem so overwhelming - stick a massive wall chart on your wall of where you are now and what you need to achieve
6. FUNDS if your funds are tight then start saving your pennies - sorry but you might end up at Tribunal and you will need to ring fence circa £6-10k BUT I'm a firm believer that if you put in the hours now at the front end - you have a better chance of getting a result you can live with from the LA.

Some good advice from others on here tho' too oneineight and tethersend seem to have gone thru successfully too
good luck
Tx

typo line 4: they will just refuse you if the evidence isn't sent initially