Advice needed urgently please from wise ones regarding SA and the games LAs play....

[pannetone]

Background: DD is 9 has a diagnosis of HFA, selective mutism, generalized and separation anxiety. She has been too anxious to attend school full time since Jan - since Feb she has had 3 x 20 minutes support with a TA one-to-one with me in a room away from the class (too anxious to be in the class). She will only 'interact', and has spoken a little, 'through' a soft toy. DD panics and becomes tearful if we try to hold the session near her class or if she has to walk past a class moving about the school.

We applied for SA last Nov. It was refused in Dec. We appealed and yesterday got the LA response. They say school is supporting Dd from the resources they have. Then say that they will be getting details of DD's academic progress and classroom 'functioning' from the school - and at that point they will reconsider DD's case and if it needs to go to a hearing of whether it can be 'agreed'.

What does this 'LA speak' mean please? Strikes me as a delaying tactic. In our appeal we stated that DD was not in class so why are they saying they are seeking info on her classroom functioning? Can the LA really get away with saying the school is supporting DD when it is evident any strategies they have used aren't working because DD is not there?

To complicate things we got a tribunal date in early June. I can't get the independent reports in til the end of June so I have put in for a later tribunal date. BUT this means the hearing won't be til July or possibly Sep - which is a long time to wait when DD not accessing education at all ATM. Last week we had a TAC meeting and Head said he would put in place 5 mornings a week TA time for DD to integrate her back into school. Yesterday he told me that he wasn't getting the TA til June and instead of 15 hours, DD will get an hour a day with the existing TA 4 days a week for the next half term.

I am just getting so confused with it all. DD isn't being properly supported by the school but the LA pretend she is. Is it better to keep my original hearing date so hopefully SA is given and gets going OR do I need the evidence from the indi reports to 'have the best chance' of challenging the LA refusal to assess. We already have an LA EP report from last May that says DD's needs are complex and that she is 'vulnerable' in terms of accessing the curriculum and social isolation - and those concerns are now reality.

have you looked at www.briteschool.co.uk?

I have a 9 year old enrolled with them and he's coming on in leaps and bounds. 3 afternoons a week of lessons + homework. To be honest I'm so pleased with his progress this year, we've decided to go permy with homeschooling and leave all the LA games and the misery they caused behind.

This wouldn't interfere with her meagre school hours, school but would enable her to access an education perhaps while you wait for Tribunal?

The LA don't care as they've saved a year's funding even if you win at Tribunal. It took me to too long to twig that what I considered a successful outcome and what the system does are often totally contradictory.

I would suggest phoning ipseas tribunal helpline for advice. do you know if you are entitled to legal aid? if so maxwell gillott solicitors are fantastic and might be able to arrange indie reports sooner for you. plus they will explain if you have a good case without them.

regarding the tribunal imo I would not adjourn if your dd is not able to attend school. do u have her nc levels? has she made sufficent progress? I would use all the evidence that you already have to try and prove your case. if you were then to lose at tribunal I would reapply for SA straight away and then you would have your indie reports as evidence.

Is this the official Response to Appeal filed with sendist? Not much of a defence is it?

plus tbh I think that you have a strong case to show that SA is needed as your dc isnt attending school ( shows that school cant meet needs). have you been to gp to get it documented about the anxiety?

The LA speak smacks of the emperor's new clothes. They're supporting her from the resources they have - and anyone who is looking properly, through their own eyes, can see that this plainly is not enough as she is not accessing education. End of.

Agreeing about not adjourning - indie reports can be offered either as part of SA or when you start the appeal for the next layer of crap.

If dd can't be in school and you can get your doctor to support that, you could insist on the LA arranging home tuition. Don't be fobbed off with offers of 5 hours a week, she should have at least 10 (if she can cope with it). If they won't do it, contact a solicitor who can do legal aid, because they could take court proceedings in dd's name to enforce this.

I suspect if the LA finds itself having to fund home tuition it might start taking more of an interest in statutory assessment, because it would be cheaper for them to get dd back into school with the right support.

Keep your original hearing date.

Thank you all. Having written my post I actually went to bed with a migraine - no doubt stress related. Luckily I woke up in time to read your responses and having quickly read your advice I phoned the tribunal with about 15 mins to go before they closed. Apparently there is an order to change the date ready to be written up and issued. the clerk couldn't tell me the date because the LA has to be notified at the same time. BUT I can write in this weekend and explain the situation and ask to keep the original early June date - which you lot have convinced me to do.

bochead - I know about briteschool and interhigh and am considering those for DS (12) who is also out of school with anxiety. At the moment DD' because of her anxiety, refuses to co operate with anything school work related at home - just as homework was an issue when she was in school.

Keep yes, this is the LA official response to my appeal - given with 2 hours to go until the deadline. It is a 'non-response' saying that they WILL be checking her academic progress and 'classroom functioning' and then will 'consult' with us 'in due course' to determine if a hearing can be avoided'. Also they just state that DD's views are 'not recorded' at this stage and they will obtain them if they think it 'appropriate'.

Like your summary ourvye of saving the indi reports for 'the next layer of crap'!

sticks I am not eligible for legal aid. I take your point that I need to get DD's anxiety 'documented' and I will go to the GP. Both CAMHS and SALT are aware that she is not in school. In the TAC last week the EWO told DD's head that he could mark her as present for the morning session when she was in for 20 mins! So now it looks like her attendance is improving (and her class is no longer always at the bottom in the weekly attendance figures so I can tell Head is marking her in!) More 'emperor's new clothes' as ourvye puts it.

nenny _ i have had no success trying to get home tuition put in place - though it is actually DS that I have tried for, not DD so far. My LA will only put in place home tuition once a child has been said to be unfit for school by a consultant. DS has waited almost 3 months for a consultant appt (psychiatrist at CAMHS) - appt now next week. I have said this is unreasonable and challenged it with the EWO but he says DS's school are providing him with education by sending work home. In fact DS (Y7) isn't sent much at all and then can't always do it because he hasn't had any teaching input and being HFA doesn't want to 'do it wrong'....

Are you sure that I can get legal aid in DS's or DD's name to take court proceedings to challenge the lack of home tuition?

Thanks RaRa for that short and to the point cross-post. Just hoping that the Registrar will give me my date back!

caudwell children's charity will fund £2k's worth of ABA if you are on a low income - perhaps this will be enough to help you overcome her aversion to working at home?

If a school doesn't WANT to help it doesn't matter how much resources are thrown in that direction I've learned. So I wouldn't waste the Caudwell help there.

Somehow you need to take the EWO out of the loop of command as currently he's acting as a gatekeeper in preventing your children accessing an education. IPSEA will advise.

Ask school to sign your copy of an attendance diary YOU keep showing DD's time in and time out.

Basically they are saying that they do not have sufficient evidence to defend refusal to assess and need to collect more evidence to see if hearing is needed (ie the original decision is defendable). Well, in law they have already refused - indicating that they are already in receipt of sufficient evidence to reach a such a decision. Don't consent to their collecting more information - like sending in the EP. My home LA could claim justification as they were not the school LA and had no information. Can your LA say that? Don't try and change your hearing date because they will likely concede

If you've got medical evidence that the children can't be in school for medical reasons I can't see how the LA can dismiss it just because it comes from a GP rather than a consultant. Anyway, if the school is sending work home it sounds like they accept ds can't cope, so I don't really see how they've got a leg to stand on. Sending work home doesn't amount in law to providing an education. If it were that easy we wouldn't need schools at all.

If you got a lawyer involved I think you might have to pay for the initial letter threatening court action, but if that didn't work and you had to go to court my understanding is that you'd definitely be able to get legal aid in the dc's names. Unless of course they've got loadsamoney stashed away.

Sorry for short post earlier.

Basically you are making a huge assumption that they made decision based on evidence. They didn't. You therefore don't need to provide much in the way of alternative evidence.

Secondly, you may not win the tribunal but that will be because some judges are corrupt and nowt to do with evidence. On balance though, you will win without providing expensive reports. Expensive reports won't change outcome from corrupt judges.

Delaying increases the paperwork volume diluting your case.

regarding the LA response I would think that this is just an initial response to their deadline set by the tribunal to let them know if they oppose the appeal. so what they are saying is yes at the minute they feel the school are supporting dd from their own resources so oppose the appeal (remember this is just the LAs opinion and at the tribunal you will be able to challenge them on this. my LA tried to tell the tribunal that my ds didnt need salt as his speech problems were due to habit, despite having a dx from a salt!).
they will then have a final evidence deadline (same date as yours). so if they dont have any evidence to support their theory that the school are supporting your dd they will probably conceed. however dont be suprised if they start offering to send in an EP etc as it will be to gather evidence against your case, so dont agree to this.

Hmmm _ I am now realising the LA must have been delighted when I asked them to agree to a later hearing date - it would give them more time to defend the indefensible, and delay means less money spent (they hope.) And indeed they have said they have no reports or documents to submit at this stage. The final evidence date (for the early June hearing I now want to keep) is the 1st May. I have already submitted with my appeal the LA EP report that was done last May - can they submit it 'as well' and just pick out the odd 'positive' comment out of context?

Will the SENCO and class teacher really turn up to give evidence at the hearing? The SENCO won't help the LA case - she is always saying the school needs advice on how to support DD. And what can the class teacher say that is relevant to the current situation - she can only report on how DD was when she used to be in class more than 3 months ago which is hardly relevant to how she is now. (Though the CT never considered that DD was anxious in class because she could talk to one friend and 'appeared' happy, conveniently ignoring the fact that DD has selective mutism which is an anxiety disorder in itself, together with her generalised and separation anxiety disorders.)

So I am emailing this weekend to get the Tribunal to let me keep the original hearing date. Should I also be tackling the LA on the school's failure to put in place appropriate education in the meantime when DD is medically unfit for school? Who does that letter go to? The woman whose name was on the letter refusing SA?

Sorry for all the questions. My life is in 'freefall' ATM with DD and DS3 off school with anxiety. Haven't got round to doing a parental request for SA for DS whcih I should do. And DS2 (for whom I 'won' a disability discrimination agaist his [different] school for failure to make reasonable adjustments) has come back from uni after 2 terms because he hasn't managed the transition and we more than suspect that it is because the uni hasn't put in place appropriate support....

I doubt they would submit their own EP report that doesnt fully support their case. more likely they might try and get an EP in to find new 'evidence' or if they are using HT and CT as witnesses they will probably use reports from them stating they can meet your dds needs. although if your dd is not in school due to anxiety and you can get this in writing from gp I cant see how they can prove they are meeting her needs, so it might be likely that they conceed.

I suggest you make a formal request for copy school records, it sounds like there could be some stuff in there that supports your case.

The council probably has someone like an EOTAS (education out of school bod) organising home education. Contact him/her.

Do you sign her in and out of school at the office?

You can request the list of her log entries (dates & times) which nicely shows the 20min/day problem. You can also video or audiotape one of the sessions, and submit that to work on generalising any tiny improvements she makes.

If you start by taping her talking at home, and bring it to watch at school, it would be hard for school to refuse. Plus it might even be (slightly) useful

The LA are probably not giving this much thought. It's probably a cut and paste job into a standard letter, just the standard delaying tactic. They'll have a couple of dozen tribunals in the pipeline at any given time.

Did you see the autism documentary earlier in the week? There was a brilliant triangles animation (see minute 31 of the YouTube lecture) based on the tendency to generate and assign imaginary meanings to events. We tend to assume human mind and motivation apply to any random object. Autistic people are somewhat less affected by this foolishness; the neurotypicals didn't come out well!

Anyway, my point is that much LA's behaviour will 50% Machiavellian scheming and mind games, and 50% random motion, but differentiating is hard, cos humans tend to assume it's all meaningful.

Thanks Maria - yes I saw the 'triangles animation' and I get your point about attributing meaning to something meaningless!

In your earlier post are you suggesting I video DD on the pretext that it will help her progress but actually with the intention of submitting it to the Tribunal? See, I am no good at 'playing the game' yet.

Both motives