Getting support from social services

[Edenviolet]

Our sw has informed us that we fall into a grey area where neither the cwd team or child in need team will take our case on so she has to close our case as ss cannot offer support.

How do I appeal this and access some help and support for my dcs?

Thanks

We seem to be going in circles Brian, that was my point there are no 'grey areas' its code for being fobbed off, you either meet the criteria or you don't!

Statements of Educational Needs are intended for Special Educational Needs. Medical conditions will not qualify a child for a statement unless the medical condition causes learning difficulties.

No claw it is not. We are going round in circles here. Yes sometimes social workers may say that to you to fob you off, of course, but what I am saying to you is that there is a gray area policy. For people who don't quite fit the criteria of either teams, but they do need help. This is where senior management will make a decision and force one of the teams to assess the case, even though they don't quite fit the criteria of that team. It doesn't mean they will get a service following that, that depends solely on the outcome of the assessment. I have only posted to advise the op on the steps she needs to take. I have done that because I have working knowledge of the process.

Clearly you have had some issues with ssd in the past. I appreciate that, it happens. But I'm not going to get drawn into a debate. I am simply presenting the facts. Hth.

You seem to have taken exception to my advice to Hedge. My advice is there is a criteria which you either meet or don't. If she has been told she doesn't, then to request a copy of the criteria and written reasons why, and to complain if she doesn't agree with the decision.

I would like to see a copy of the 'grey area' policy. How do social workers know which criteria you meet/don't meet unless they assess?

Well, if you want to see a copy of it then contact your ssd department for it. And obviously whilst a written assessment hasn't been done in the ops case, they have obviously still weighed up the ops situation against their own criteria and have found it doesn't fit their particular teams criteria. This happens too. Which is why, again one team is forced to assess the case under this policy. So that the assessment goes wider than just the criteria for their own team. This is to stop people being batted from one team to another, and slipping through the gaps.
It doesn't always work as the family normally have to complain to get to that stage. If they turn out to be eligible for assistance, then that team will take the case. Even though they don't quite fit the criteria of that team.

And you're right. I have taken exception to your advice, because you're wrong. The op may not be eligible for any help at all. But we don't know that. And insisting there isn't a grey area policy, when you clearly don't even work for ssd, is harmful to other people reading this. Where they might think they have no chance of help from Ssd, and actually, they just might be entitled to help.

'they have obviously still weighed up the ops situation against their own criteria and have found it doesn't fit their particular teams criteria'

How do you know that?

The OP may not eligible for any help at all, she may well be eligible, which is exactly why I stated she should request a copy of their criteria and the written reasons why she doesn't meet the criteria and should complain if she doesn't agree with the decision. Rather than blindly complain.

She could also ask for a copy of the 'grey area policy' seen as you are a social worker and know that it exists, to ensure she doesn't miss out on receiving any help she might be able to get from social services if she doesn't meet their criteria.

how do you know that?

Because they have told her she falls in the gray area. . This isn't unusual for a social worker on the duty desk to run through someones scenario, figure it doesn't fit the criteria without undertaking taking a written assessment you know. You've already mentioned that the gray area is code for being fobbed off in your opinion. So your own advice isn't working for you. So why inflict that advice on someone else?

And actually, its not blindly complaining, it has a clear purpose which you are failing to understand. Yes the op could take your advice. Maybe it will work, or maybe she will continue to fall through the gaps. Or she could take it higher and find out once and for all, without wasting anymore time and emotional energy. Having witnessed this time and time again I've always said what route I would take if I needed help. And its not your route.

That is my advice to the OP Brian, to find out what this 'grey area' is by asking for written criteria and written decision and then to complain if she doesn't agree with it.

Seen as you are social worker and know all about the 'grey area policy', it might be helpful to the OP to provide her with a link to the 'grey area policy', so she is well informed, rather than argue with me.

Each council has their own individual policy on this. So there would be little point posting my LA's policy and outing myself at the same time. As I have already said, if you want a copy then contact your own ssd for it. This thread is becoming more about you and your issues than the ops. I've already advised the op on what to do. Theres nothing more to say on the matter.

For the record it has served me very well to ask for written criteria and written reasons and being well informed, when trying to be fobbed off, so im not sure how you have concluded it hasn't worked for me.

Anyhow I will leave it there as im sure us arguing isn't helping the OP in the slightest.

I think Brian is saying that it really doesn't matter what the criteria of the individual departments are, the point is that OP is entitled to the assessment anyway? If so, i agree with her. The point is what the law says, not how LAs set their internal rules and criteria.

Yes she is entitled to an assessment, however she has been told she isn't. She can complain either a)without knowing the criteria or the reason for this decision or b)complain knowing the criteria and the reason for this and what the law says and why she is entitled to the service.

When making a complaint, in my experience you are better off being well informed.

She can complain without knowing what the criteria are, because the only relevant criteria are those set out in the Children Act and other related legislation, not the LA's internal criteria.

However, I wouldn't bother to go down the complaints route if I were you. I would go to an experienced community care lawyer from a firm that offers legal aid (because you could take action in the children's names) and get them to take up the fight. I suspect that a well phrased threat of judicial review will get the LA moving much more quickly than a complaint will. Ideally you should also go for a firm that can help with the education issues as well.

Exactly Nenny the LA must assess a disabled child by Law. 'Policy guidance has been issued by the Government in relation to the
Children Act. Local authorities are bound by it unless they can provide clear and adequate reasons for their decision not to. The guidance contains all the details about what local authorities are expected to do in order to fulfil their statutory obligations and is therefore extremely useful for parents'.

I already provided links for the op and what the Law says up thread.

However I fear we are making a very simple process far too complicated for the OP by arguing about it.

"How to get an assessment for your child"

Initially, contact the team that deals with children with disabilities in your local authority to request an assessment. Alternatively, you can ask your GP, health visitor or a voluntary organisation to contact them on your behalf.

OP has said that she has NOT requested an assessment and I am guessing the 'team' of ss who are involved with the OP are not the disabilities team.

Local authorities have eligibility criteria that they use to determine whether a child is "in need" and qualifies for an assessment under the Children Act. If your local authority has decided that it will not assess your child, you can ask to be given the reasons for this decision. If you feel that your child should be assessed under the Children Act, you may wish to complain.

If you want to complain about your local authority, you should do so in writing or verbally to the complaints manager within 12 months.

Your local authority will respond within three working days to acknowledge receipt of your complaint. They will then discuss with you how long your complaint is likely to take to investigate. They must respond fully within six months unless a different time period has been discussed and agreed with you"

Complaints take a long time, requesting an assessment from the right team, quoting what the Law says you are entitled to and how you fulfil the criteria, should take 10 days.

Ive just been through this with my mum too. Elderly lady, advanced stages of cancer. 'Access team' told McMillian nurse my mum doesn't meet the criteria, as she lives with my dad.

No where in their 'eligibility criteria' does it say that you are not entitled if you live with a partner, it is based on need. I found their published criteria, phoned back, told them their own criteria and what the Law states and hey presto my mum is entitled, on the same day.

Sometimes knowing your rights, is far quicker than a complaint.

Sometimes knowing your rights, is far quicker than a complaint.

And quite often it isn't.

As always with MN, people are sharing experiences Brian and informing the op of her options.

Indeed they are claw. Glad you've remembered that

Glad you have too Brian, as at one point your only purpose for posting seemed to be to accuse me of all sorts

Not accusing you of anything claw. I didn't actually join the thread to get into a silly debate with you about a system I know inside out. Just letting the op know of the most effective way to resolve this. Not sure why they translates as accusing you of all sorts. You seem a little paranoid dear.

Brian, your first post on the thread was to me to enter into a silly debate about 'grey areas'.

You might be a social worker (a condescending one too). However I and many others on here are 'customers' of SS and have knowledge of the system you claim to know so well. SN section of MN is often used to share our experiences and what has and has not worked for us, when using these services.

You entered in a 'silly debate' about a 'grey area policy' when the OP is entitled to an assessment by Law IF she requests one. She has not requested one.

In my experience a complaint can take up to 6 months. A request addressed to the Director of Social Services, should take 10 days and by Law they must assess.

Oh dear. You really are missing the point arent you. The point of escalting it is so that the team are aware that this case needs to be assessed beyond the remit of their own team eligibility criteria, and that some needs are likely to fall into the grey area, but may still need funding. Without this direction (and knowledge that they may be able to obtain funding) they are likely to say that the case doesn't fit the criteria and will therefore close the case. Exactly what has happened to the op in fact. Even if they do the assessment, (in the way you have suggested) they will still be writing it up against their own eligibilty criteria. The case will bounce around the council to different teams who will say the same thing, and finally end up in a file marked closed.

People trying to take the route that you are suggesting will find a much harder battle on their hands, and the results are less likely to be satisfactory, for the reasons I have just pointed out. Its only when the cases get escalated that social workers often become aware themselves of the grey area process. You need the worker to be going in there with a more open mind about what they are and are not allowed to do, and this process, (direction from above) aids this greatly.

Yes, sometimes the complaint process can drag on a little. That is why I suggested that at the same time as making the complaint, getting the local mp to also take it up with the council and liase on the persons behalf. These two things together always yield an extremely quick result. ie less than a week, rather than months. To put it more bluntly, (and even then I'm not sure you will get this) it has always amazed me how quickly ssd jump, and make sure everything is done properly, once an mp becomes involved. Every single time.