What the bloody hell am I going to do about school?

[Sahkoora]

DS (5) has just started year one, and school is just awful for him. Got a dx of ASD with possible ADHD over the summer. They struggle so much with getting him to do anything at all.

He won't sit with the other kids, he's loud, rude, violent, and this week he has started swearing. At the moment, his targets are just to do a couple of adult-led activities a day. He's a bright boy, but he's just getting no education, through no fault of school.

He was on a reduced timetable for most of last year because they just can't cope with him. Expecting the first draft (or whatever it's called) of a statement in a few weeks, but I just can't imagine what they can do that will help.

He already has full time 1:1, a first and then book, he can pretty much wander around the school as he pleases. He has a place he can go and hide, ear defenders if it gets too noisy, and doesn't have to participate in anything he doesn't want to.

He has to be dragged into school every day, and yesterday they phoned me to come and pick him up early under the guise that he was ill (he seemed fine to me).

Been up to our necks in experts but absolutely nothing has worked to make school easier. Things will work for a while and then stop working.

I am coming out of school every day in tears as it's just so hideous. Part of me just wants to take him out of school and home ed him, but I don't know if that's wise.

I haven't got the first clue about how to approach home edding, I worry also about the impact it would have on DS2 (2), as I really want to start taking him to playgroups etc and we've already missed out on so much as we've had DS1 at home all last year being disruptive and difficult.

Also, as selfish as it sounds, I need a break from DS1. I want to occasionally get the house tidy or watch some TV without it being shouted over. I also have an ongoing project that I want to finish, something that will hopefully lead to a career for me.

One of the professionals who was helping us suggested that maybe a special school might be the answer, but I don't even know what a special school is like. He has no learning difficulties other than being unable to cope in a school setting, would a special school help in any way?

Please, any advice wold be good, there must be someone out there who has been through similar. It seems as though all the pros are at a loss with DS too!

So sorry to hear about your sons terrible time at school, I have no major advice to give except to say , go and have alook around a couple of special schools near to you, your LA will be able to give you details. I looked around one for my son ( he is now in his second mainstream primary school but I think it's is very much his last chance, if you see what I mean, as if it does'nt work out here, the next option is special school.) the special school is our back up plan . I was so impressed with it, very calm and orderly,though I appreciate it might not always be like that. The staff and head teacher very clued up on how to handle your child, lots of incentives and rewards, lots of positive vibes. I also liked how they did a lot of outdoor work, and practical activities, lots of sport and the small numbers of pupils can sometimes be a good thing. Don 't rule it out before you've been to have alook at one and spoken to the people involved. I also have a second child and know how it feels to fell like your second is missing out and almost getting forgotten about. hope this helps.

With the statement coming up, would this be my only chance to switch to a special school, or could I make this decision at any time? I had a brief look at the website of a local one and it looks as though I would have to get a recommendation from my LA before we could go and visit?

I know at some point you have to name a school on the statement, would this be the chance? Could I move DS back again if the decision turned out to be wrong?

I am concerned by the lack of exams on offer, but maybe I am wishful thinking there :)

Agree, with higherhill go and look at some special schools as the current placement sounds totally wrong for your son. ds1 moved to an EBSD special school about six months ago and is much calmer and happier there than he was in his large mainstream primary. They cater for him well both academically (he is quite bright) and behaviourally (had multiple exclusions from mainstream but comes home most days now with excellent on his behaviour sheet). Another thing worth looking into is whether there are mainstream primaries with ARP provision for autism. ds2 has just started in one and whilst it is too soon to tell if it will help him it certainly on paper seems to be able to cope much better with his needs.

Your child may well be capable of exams cognitively, but he's got no chance of passing them if he remains in an environment where they are so poorly trained in SEN they can't even get him to sit down, let alone learn.

Special schools cost more than mainstream. You have a legal entitlement to a mainstream education. If you ever get him into a special school, you will have everything on your side if you wanted to bring him out (perhaps once he has learnt how to behave in a classroom, engage with the lesson and develop some coping strategies for the things that make him distressed and needing to jump about).

Thank you, that is very reassuring. So far, it has only been this one professional who has talked to me about special schools, and she did warn me that mainstream schools will be keen to hold on to SEN kids because of the extra money and resources it provides.

Some of the things higherhill mentions, like the practical activities, outdoor work and lots of sport sound right up DS's street.

I just wish I could get someone to talk to DH about it. He's at work so doesn't see the full horrors of school, and doesn't think DS is anywhere near needing a special school.

I suppose when you're not there, hearing about a 5yr old hitting a secretary with a lunchbox and calling his 1:1 a shithead is quite funny, but it's so distressing, also for DS2 who doesn't understand why they are taking his sobbing big brother away every day.

Oh dear, going to have a great big blub now!

You can tell your DH this:

Your son is more than capable of a mainstream education. However, a typical mainstream environment would let him down, ignore, deny and misunderstand his needs, and use any resources awarded to him flexibly to meet staffing or budgetary shortfalls.

In short, your child 'could' be supported at a mainstream school. He just wouldn't be.

Ds would be your child except for one thing which is called ABA (applied behaviour analysis) which is a specialist behaviour approach. Ds attends mainstream parttime with ABA staff and has 1:1 ABA the rest of week. He has just gone into year 2. There are no suitable SS here. Ds is too bright for then and too autistic for mainstream. So instead of travelling to SS the specialists come to him. LA services and training can be very poor and mainstream staff no idea what to do with children who won't follow instructions. You could look into the possibility of getting more specialist support into mainstream. I could not home ed ds he would be as non compliant for me as he would at school. The benefit of ABA is they train parents too. It's expensive and no one will suggest it as LAs don't want to pay usually you have to start ABA privately and prove it works. Caudwell children charity will sometimes fund it. Even paying for a little and proving he can learn and behave with proper support can be enough to win funding ( we had to go to tribunal). It would be a way of keeping him in mainstream.

Yes. ABA brings the 'specialism' into the classroom. It is best available therapy for a child with ASD or a child of any kind as it insists on a very detailed assessment of skills or absence of those skills and then works to a programme to address them on a minute by minute basis ensuring optimal learning in all areas, academic, life skills, independent skills and social skills.

BUT, Local Authorities fight very hard against it and it would almost certainly require a tribunal (or two) to get it, as well as a school that would be open to the idea (which is hard to ascertain because they don't want to go against the LA).

Speaking as governor of a primary school, I think the professional is behind the times when she tells you a mainstream school will benefit financially from a SEN child. After the cuts in funding in this area I would be very surprised if this is correct for your son's school.

from experience I strongly advice you visit the SN schools incl some independent SN schools. higherhill and others describing ABA have listed all the benefits of an adequate provision that your DS needs. DS may be similar to yours and they only thing that can turn him around in few days was ABA. He not only complied but asked for more :)

I totally agree ABA is hard to win. But you can win it on 2 main grounds 1. Failure to make adequate progress with current approach and 2. Challenging Behaviour.
By the time the OP got to a tribunal she would have plenty of evidence of both. LAs are also less against it where the alternative is also expensive. OP there are some ABA schools around too depending on where you live. Also dual placements between SS and mainstream which can work if the SS can train mainstream. What you don't want ( and which is really common here) is for your ds to be put in a school for children who are much less cognitively able just because that is the only place that has staff ratio and behaviour experience. Our LD schools are a dumping ground for children who are clever but who mainstream have failed. Not all SS are like this but you need to be careful your ds will have a peer group.

I'd suggest you think about saying to the school that sending ds home early or using a reduced timetable is not an option - it's unlawful exclusion. That will incentivise them to push for more support in school and/or for him to go to a school that is able to meet his needs.

can you discuss a split placement? Hopefully you will be able to get a true idea of where he would be most suited.
Also have a look around other MS schools sometimes even if the staff are willing, a lack of training & experience and the school size & physical environment can make a huge difference. Good luck

Hi zzzzz

I don't have any general figures, no. I am speaking from my personal experience on the finance committee of a primary school. The funding for one child with SEN has been cut, he has 1 to 1 help so this is now partly being paid for from the overall school budget. Another has an autism diagnosis but is entitled to no additional funding at all (I believe that the link between statement and funding has been broken?).

The school at which I am a governor is committed to providing the support these children need, and funding it from whatever sources we can. I would never use the term 'drain on resources' to describe these children. But it is very inaccurate to believe that the school benefits financially from them.

Thanks everyone for your replies. I think what I am worried about at a SS is exactly what Agnes describes - that DS would not have a peer group. Despite his abominable difficulties, DS is really popular at school, he has lots of friends and plays ok with them at lunch time etc.

We have a local SS that comes highly recommended, though. I think me and DH need to go and have a look and have a chat with people there. Starlight is absolutely right when she says about him not being able to even sit down in an exam hall.

Sounds like ABA is something I am going to have to research. As I said before, the professionals seem to be at a complete loss and DS is not progressing. They are happy if he chooses to do a single adult-led task in a day, and none of these are actually "with" his classmates or of any real educational value. It's all playgroup stuff, like playing with water and sand and playdoh.

Over the summer, we did loads of reading and learning about space and planets, and DS absorbed it like a sponge. I had hoped that this was the kind of thing he would be doing once he got 1:1, learning that was geared around him, but I think getting him to behave in a classroom setting has been their main focus.

Feeling quite disappointed really. Yesterday DS had a meltdown when I took him into school and the SENCO really told him off for shouting at his 1:1. Completely unhelpful as DS wasn't being deliberately disrespectful of adults (as she said), he's a scared, disabled little boy who didn't want to leave his mum. It didn't help at all. Not sure I trust her to be the one making decisions after that.

Thanks again everyone.

Believe me zzzzz, we are doing everything we can to get extra money for the children I am referring to! No luck so far.

Sorry OP, I didn't mean to hijack your thread. Good luck with getting the best possible arrangement for your DS.

zzzzz there has not been a 'cut' to SEN funding which was never ring-fenced. However, the change to who funds how much is treated by schools 'as if' it were a cut and in the privacy of the BOG heads speak of not being able to 'afford' any statemented DC because they will be forced to fund the first x amount. Of course, no such legal force applies to SA and SA+.

Sorry to add to the hijack.

zzzzz did you read the bit where I said our school is committed to providing support to SEN pupils, whether we receive funding for it or not?

I Home Educate my son who has asd. It is v hard work but worth it, he is learning so much and his behaviour is a million times better than it was when he was being let down by school. I wonder if you could get any respite from social services so that you got a break and time for yourself? Or is there anyone who can take him out for an afternoon at weekends? I don't really get a break but your son's behaviour sounds a bit more difficult.

tumble Have you tried ebaying some interactive white boards or giving the HT a pay cut?

These resources are not statutory like a SEN child's provision.