meeting today - re dyslexia - help needed

[bjkmummy]

after battling sorting out the boys who are both statemented and happy in special schools I somehow missed what was going on with my daughter.

she is 10 in year 5 - her reading age is about age 7 and she is struggling do learn her 3 x times - not sure what level she should be on or what an average 10 year old would be.

over the years - we have moved schools a bit due to dh job - schools have raised concerns but as she is a passive well behaved girl she has basically gone under the radar and been 'ignored'. In march this year she had a bot of a breakdown over her school and asked to change schools. I spoke to her then class teacher who admitted she forgot my daughter was in the class. the school had screened her for dyslexia and it had come out positive s I asked what help school were giving her wihich was none really.

new school immeadiately raised concerns and queried the levels the previous school had said she was at. they felt she was only level 1 in reading etc. school then put in extra 1:1 for her and said would see how this extra support would go and see how her levels went. if no increase then we woul dmeet again in sept and decide what to do next likely they would then call an EP into assess her and give her an IEP.

I have asked for the meeting today to discuss the way forward and have no idea what to say /do. teacher at last meeting when I asked whether she may need a statement mad eit clear that she wouldn't get one. I asked about getting her seen privately to be dx and the teacher assured me no need to do it and school will sort it out. part of me today wants to just say enough is enough and I want to get her seen privately asap.

years have now passed where she has just been left to flounder - doing her homework last night was absolutely painful = she is struggling so much, she struggles with her memory etc and she is becoming aware that she is behind academically - the school she is at now is very small , only 22 in the whole school so she is in a class of 10 with a teacher and TA so nowhere for her to hide now.

I just don't want her to be fobbed off any more. its also complicate dthat we are in an out of county school so not sure which EP they will call in and the school saying she wont get a statement is under their LA criteria whereas the LA we live in are actually pretty good at statementing.

just want to make sure I get this right for her now as year 6 and sats are fast approaching. also being in such a small school makes her the eldest girl now in the school.

Is she SA+? What interventions is she getting - doesn't sound like any if they are only now doing an IEP? Other comments they have made are a classic fob off.

DS1 was not 'diagnosed' with dyslexia until we commissioned private EP report at the end of year 5. This was despite having been seen by 2 different LA EPs. The second one did not do the relevant assessments but assessed his self-esteem (which by this time had been damaged by non-recognition of his needs).

At first the second LA EP knew nothing about dyslexic concerns of the teachers. She said that even if DS1 were dyslexic, which he probably wasn't because he could read and write (high expectations indeed), his levels were too high - she sympathetically cocked her head to one side and showed me a print out of an LA's (unlawful) table showing how far behind the average a child 'had' to be (1b across the board in years 6-8) to 'qualify' for additional support. She said that his levels (3c across the board) were even too high for SA+ but that 'they were doing me a favour'. Bollocks. She also said that a statement would not entitle DS1 to any different support from that already got in m/s primary. Again, bollocks.

Read the Rose Review on dyslexia dera.ioe.ac.uk/14790/1/00659-2009DOM-EN.pdf. Two refusals to assess, plus private EP, SALT, OT and paed assessments DS1 is now at Indi ss (ASD, APD, Add, SPD, anxiety etc). He was also assessed (for Tribunal not during SA for statementing, of course) by the 'official' paed, SALT and EP.

Not to worry you further but transition to secondary can prove too much for anxious but internalising dyslexics. See Robert Burden www.thinkingschool.co.uk/ckeditor_assets/attachments/20/assessing-the-learning-self-concept.pdf?1296135944. No statement means your selection rights are the same as everyone else. Ds1 was out of school for all but four weeks of year 7.

She should also qualify for extra help in SATs - reader/scribe and extra time. She will need the results of EP assessment to get extra time and the head will need to apply in good time.

Google or contact your local parent partnership for your LAs SEN Policy (if you don't already have one . This will tell you the rate of progress the LA uses as a trigger indicating a need for assessment and what measures they use. Some LAs (like Essex) also have a specific dyslexia policy.

Try and get your head around levels and expected rate of progress and how progress is measured. Try www.stokehilljunior.devon.sch.uk/downloads/National_Curriculum_Point_Scales.pdf.

To give you an idea, post application for SA etc, in year 6 DS1 had Wave 3 interventions (for dyslexia this is Accelerwrite/Acceleread or similar - again, Google), touch-typing lessons, a voice recorder in addition to increased 1:1). Another boy in his class with a statement and more severe dyslexia did not get these until DS1 on SA+ did.

You need to get onto the school to make sure they are up to date with IEPs as the LA will want to see them to be sure that the school have done all the intervention they can within the school SEN budget. Application alone (expect initial refusal) gets DS on the radar and put a rocket up their collective arses.

You've done this before bjk so you know what to expect

Sorry - I forgot to convert my links

Is she SA+? What interventions is she getting - doesn't sound like any if they are only now doing an IEP? Other comments they have made are a classic fob off.

DS1 was not 'diagnosed' with dyslexia until we commissioned private EP report at the end of year 5. This was despite having been seen by 2 different LA EPs. The second one did not do the relevant assessments but assessed his self-esteem (which by this time had been damaged by non-recognition of his needs).

At first the second LA EP knew nothing about dyslexic concerns of the teachers. She said that even if DS1 were dyslexic, which he probably wasn't because he could read and write (high expectations indeed), his levels were too high - she sympathetically cocked her head to one side and showed me a print out of an LA's (unlawful) table showing how far behind the average a child 'had' to be (1b across the board in years 6-8) to 'qualify' for additional support. She said that his levels (3c across the board) were even too high for SA+ but that 'they were doing me a favour'. Bollocks. She also said that a statement would not entitle DS1 to any different support from that already got in m/s primary. Again, bollocks.

Read the Rose Review on dyslexia dera.ioe.ac.uk/14790/1/00659-2009DOM-EN.pdf. Two refusals to assess, plus private EP, SALT, OT and paed assessments DS1 is now at Indi ss (ASD, APD, Add, SPD, anxiety etc). He was also assessed (for Tribunal not during SA for statementing, of course) by the 'official' paed, SALT and EP.

Not to worry you further but transition to secondary can prove too much for anxious but internalising dyslexics. See Robert Burden www.thinkingschool.co.uk/ckeditor_assets/attachments/20/assessing-the-learning-self-concept.pdf?1296135944. No statement means your selection rights are the same as everyone else. Ds1 was out of school for all but four weeks of year 7.

She should also qualify for extra help in SATs - reader/scribe and extra time. She will need the results of EP assessment to get extra time and the head will need to apply in good time.

Google or contact your local parent partnership for your LAs SEN Policy (if you don't already have one smile. This will tell you the rate of progress the LA uses as a trigger indicating a need for assessment and what measures they use. Some LAs (like Essex) also have a specific dyslexia policy.

Try and get your head around levels and expected rate of progress and how progress is measured. Try www.stokehilljunior.devon.sch.uk/downloads/National_Curriculum_Point_Scales.pdf.

To give you an idea, post application for SA etc, in year 6 DS1 had Wave 3 interventions (for dyslexia this is Accelerwrite/Acceleread or similar - again, Google), touch-typing lessons, a voice recorder in addition to increased 1:1). Another boy in his class with a statement and more severe dyslexia did not get these until DS1 on SA+ did.

You need to get onto the school to make sure they are up to date with IEPs as the LA will want to see them to be sure that the school have done all the intervention they can within the school SEN budget. Application alone (expect initial refusal) gets DS on the radar and put a rocket up their collective arses.

You've done this before bjk so you know what to expect smile

Arrgh!

dera.ioe.ac.uk/14790/1/00659-2009DOM-EN.pdf

I give in!

I managed to force the LA to assess by calculating progress rate using standardised reading and spelling tests. DS1's progress rate was 0.3 (3 months per academic year) but their own policy required assessment where the progress rate was less than 0.6 (6 months per academic year). I also calculated rate during a Wave 3 intervention. It's all in the Rose Review.

"Many UK studies report results not in standard scores but in
reading and spelling ages, from which ratio gains can be calculated
in order to evaluate the effectiveness of the intervention. Ratio
gain is the gain in reading (or spelling) age made by a group during
a chronological time span, expressed as a ratio of that time span
(Topping & Lindsay, 1992). A ratio gain of 1.0 means that the child’s
skills are developing at a normal pace, but they will not be catching
up with their peers. Brooks (2007) suggests that ratio gains of less
than 1.4 are of ‘doubtful educational significance’, between 1.4 and
2.0 of ‘modest impact’, between 2.0 and 3.0 of ‘useful impact’,
between 3.0 and 4.0 of ‘substantial impact’ and above 4.0 of
‘remarkable impact’ (Brooks. 2007, p. 289).

However, Brooks (2007) points out that ordinary teaching (i.e. no
intervention) does not enable children with literacy difficulties to
catch up, and hence it is fair to presume that, in the absence of
control or comparison groups, and where effect sizes cannot be
calculated, findings of ratio gains in excess of 2.0 may be taken as
good evidence in support of the method employed. Indeed, several
studies have shown that, without help, dyslexic pupils progress at
around only 5 months per calendar year in reading (ratio gain 0.42)
and 3 months in spelling (ratio gain 0.25) (Thomson, 1990, 2001;
see also Rack and Walker, 1994)."

Unfortunately ime dyslexic girls often do go totally under the radar. Mainly, I suspect, because girls tend to try to to "hide" and conform whilst in class, whilst dyslexic boys might be more disruptive and so come to the teacher's attention sooner (massive generalisation but that's exactly what happened with my DC).

I would definitely go ahead with a private assessment - with or without the school's blessing. Not least because dyslexia often goes hand-in-hand with other issues such as working memory problems. A good EP will be able to highlight these problems. Times tables are often massive issues for dyslexics because of the memory skills needed to remember them correctly. Also multi-step maths problems might be a problem. My DS was always very very good at maths at KS1 but at his old school (without specialist teaching), his maths nose-dived to the very bottom of the bottom because the teachers didn't take into account his working memory issues. A year out of school with a specialist dyslexia teaching doing two hours a week numeracy has brought his maths slowly back up again.

Good luck- go with your instinct. You've been here before, so you know the ropes [wry grin]. Dyslexia is one of the most invisible of SEN issues and one of the most issue neglected by mainstream schools (massive generalisation again, but this is my experience). As you know, my DS (who was "a resounding NO" to Statutory Assessment from the witch at the LA) is now in an indie SS because of the severity of his dyslexia - fully Statemented and fully funded.

thanks for that - another child is going through statementing in her class at the moment - they moved up from London and had the son privately dx with dyslexia - mum is also head of the PTA and school governor. her class teacher is nice but don't think she realises just who shes talking to ! im no green around the ears mum! ive already had the head tilted sideways look etc and that I wont get a statement. the teacher though is good and I think she means well but slightly pissed off that shes already saying she wont get a statement. what also slightly worries me is that a parent of a year 6 child last year who had a severely dysleixic child was turned down for the local academy which means my daughter could be heading to nowhere land for secondary - again cos shes a girl and is passive she is completely overlooked. deep down in my heart Im also concerned that dyslexia is not the end of the story and im pretty scared to get her tested because of this. that said the EP I used for my sons tribunal also does dyslexia testing so im guessing I will take my daughter to her and at least she knows the whole family story. time to dig deep into the cheque book again - thank god for a PPI payout!

We are also OCC. All the assessments were replicated by the home LA when assessment was granted. This just adds to the delay. You wait months for the EP assessment but you know that the school EP is NOT going to advise that you apply for a statement. This does not mean that DD doesn't need one. Why wait?

yes will get her seen privately - I cant wait any longer - sitting now on a ticking clock and this needs to be sorted/ her memory is awful. I remember when I got my son seen for the tribunal by my EP and the depth of the report and how many needs were identified - I cried and I knew he had severe difficulties so im worried what she will uncover with my daughter. I guess speaking honestly here, ive put my own head in the sand as my daughter has been the one who has kept me sane and for me to now have to even contemplate she may need a statement is breaking me. I have to already statemented and now to possibly have to have my 3rd one done is a hard thing to take but I will dust myself off and I will fight for her as well. in the next city we do have a dyslexia independent type school where the fees are not too bad so that could be an option long term.

also if im being absolutely honest after all of the fighting ive had with both boys and how much im hated by my LA the thought of them picking up a statement application regarding my daughter - I can hear the horrible comments already and expect them to fight me at every single step as some kind of payback for the past of the boys. but despite all of this I cant stand by and watch her sink -with 2 brothers with asd she has more than enough on her plate as it is so I have to do this for her and she is my only concern.

The situation with regard to SpLD makes me see red

If you look at the quote from the Rose Review you can see that the progress rate of dyslexics who receive no or inadequate support tend to make around 3 to 5 months progress each academic year. This rate of progress would according to most LA criteria, trigger SA. So it is not measured!!

Instead, focus is placed upon attainment (measured solely by teacher assessed SATs until year 6) where one sub-level, subjectively determined, is taken to demonstrate adequate progress. So without standardised testing the child will never meet the inadequate progress criteria and is left for the gap to widen to such an extent that they eventually, following years of failure and distress, meet the attainment criteria and become 'bad enough' to support.

No No, No!

I'm dyslexic - I was diagnosed over 30 years ago. It makes me absolutely mad that things have progressed so little since the Dark Ages when I was at school!

Secondary school is awful for unsupported dyslexic children - my own DD1 went through it so I know just how bad it is. Fortunately she's now through the other side and a great success (totally on her own merit) in her chosen life.

bjk - you can do it! You know the "rules" of this terrible game - you are her only hope. But you've got us all here handing your hand through it.

the school my daughter is in - that county has a detailed 'policy' re statementing and the different waves you have to go through etc so I can kinda understand where her teacher is coming from and it would be a battle in that county but she lives in a different county so the statement application goes to them and they have no such policy - in fact seem to have no policy at all which will work in my benefit as they cant go through the usual hoops most people end up having to go through.

with the younger son - her twin brother - when I applied for his statement it was purely cos he had been dx with asd. he was academically okay but went on the angle that it was for socials stuff etc and got a statement easily - infact I moved his school mid way through the process so he was statemented on the basis of no school report at all. my difficulty of course for dyslexia is that I will have an EP report but nothing medical and no real IEPs etc - I could of course wait but we are getting dangerously close now to year 6. she barely knows her 3 x tables at age 10 and her reading is awful and academically she is suffering. she is probably following in her elder brothers footsteps and is following his levels academically, that scares me as when he hit year 6 they forecast he would leave with no gcses - I certainly don't want that for my daughter!

well had the meeting and she has a reading age of 6. they have been doing things with her to help her. she wont get a statement as her levels likely to be higher than a 2a at year 6 so wont meet the criteria! the LA EP will refuse to see her to assess her for dysleixia and the class teacher wasn't very complimentary about LA EPs anyway. the class teacher is dyslexic herself and she whole heartedly recommends that I get her seen privately asap. the school will then do whatever the report recommends. my daughter is now going on the sen register - whatever that means - head teacher didn't want to put her on it unti xmas but class teacher feels she needs it now.

ive booked her assessment for 30th oct - £475 it will cost us. pretty miffed by the text book answers but not surprised wither. I will now wait the results of the dyslexia tests and see what they recommend for her

Hi op.
Check out the tinsley house support thread.
My son (now 10) was dx severely dyslexic in year 3 (after I paid for an EP report - school refused. Like your dd, he is a well behaved boy who fell under the radar)
He is now 10 and just started year 6 at middle school. He is doing very well :)
Don't panic.
There is loads you can do to help your dd - expecting the school/LA to do anything will just waste your time ime sadly.