Tentative questions re my 6 going on 7 year old DS

[gaelicsheep]

I'm not quite sure where to start tbh. I guess what I want to know is does this sound like a "normal" 6/7 year old boy, or do I have something to worry about?

1. I am concerned that DS seems to be totally "all or nothing" about friendships. He has latched onto a couple of older children in his class (the class spans Years 2 and 3). One, a girl, who was new and we went through much angst trying to get DS to realise that she could have other friends and still be his friend too. Secondly, a boy - he lives quite close by and DS plays with him outside school. But he is becoming so overbearing - he wants to play with said boy ALL the time, keeps asking if he's his best friend etc. I'm getting concerned he will get hurt and really don't know how best to handle it. So I guess what I'm saying is he has a real tendency to be very possessive, although I do wonder if this is an insecurity thing more than anything as it has been undoubtedly been worse since we moved to a new area. He is very sociable and chatty with other children, but sometimes too much so - do you know what I mean - like he doesn't quite understand boundaries?

2. Still with me? He gets angry VERY quickly if you don't quite understand what he is getting at. His dad does have a tendency to do the same thing so could quite easily be genetic/learned from DH, but I don't feel it is somehow.

3. He struggles with motor skills. He was slow to get the hang of handwriting, but is improving now. Riding a bike is very difficult - he still has to have stabilisers, but to be fair we really have nowhere easy for him to practise. I don't know how hard this normally is? Swimming - total nightmare - but then I hated swimming and still do.

4. He really struggles with loud noises or music. To the point of putting his hands over his ears and begging it to stop. When he was younger we had to pull him out of nursery "concerts" etc. because he couldn't bear it. Theatre is difficult too.

So, my question is - I suppose - am I reading too much into all this? I am the world's biggest hypochondriac and Dr Google is a dangerous thing. He is the most wonderful little boy, very sociable and chatty, very bright and engaging. But there are definitely areas where he struggles and if something is causing this then I want to help him.

So really, I'm after any advice or insights anyone can offer me. Thanks for getting this far!

Hi. What you are after is a label, but I think you should be focusing on helping him overcome his difficulties rather than stressing yourself about anything else. As you are saying he has some behaviours that don't help him in his everyday life so that's where you should start. However if you still want to see if there is anything more that that you can get him assessed.

Hi, no actually I'm not really after a label at all, I'd much rather he didn't have one. I could really do with some pointers as to how I can help him though - that would be a great start. But yes I am concerned whether there is something behind it, but I don't even know where to start with getting him assessed. The GP? I did speak to my health visitor about it a couple of years ago and she knew exactly where I was coming from but believed there is nothing to worry about. It's just that certain things seem to have got more embedded since then, so I AM worried!

I posted here btw rather than on a general topic because I know there is regular dedicated traffic with people who really KNOW about this stuff. Not because I've decided he has SN.

Hi Gaelicsheep, welcome to MNSN

I didn't think your OP sounded like you were seeking a label, to be honest. It sounds like there are things that are niggling you, which on their own might just be 'quirks' but when you see them all together, you start to wonder if those 'quirks' all fit together somehow?

The friendship thingy:

Well, that could be your DS simply realising the importance of friendships. It does sound quite suffocating for other children, though. I wonder if you could use 'social stories' for him, which are little stories which give the child information about an activity or subject to reinforce social 'norms'. So, for example, DD1 was hitting her sisters, so her teachers did her a social story called 'kind hands'. It had lots of pictures of her using her hands kindly, and described those situations, then said 'DD1 must always use kind hands.'

Fine motor: Would you say that his issues are to do with co-ordination, or strength, or fluency, etc?

Noises: Some people here have had success with either reducing the noise - ear defenders, etc., or by desensitising by gradually increasing exposure to noises over time.

What do you think?

Understand what you're asking (I think!) - I guess you want to know if there is a 'reason' behind these behaviours other than just that they're behaviours which you're not sure are 'normal'.

I don't think any of here could, would or should try to say whether we think your ds has any kind of 'condition'. The point is, you are concerned enough to ask here, so it might be worth you trying again with your GP (not HV if she wasn't very helpful before).

One thing you can start doing is keeping a diary of behaviour which you feel is unusual/needs help with. Take it along to GP appt and any further appts if you get them.

The only other thing I'd say is, like easysteps said, even if there is anything behind this other than just 6/7yo boy personality, a 'label' is nothing other than a descriptive term. He is your little boy with the same personality, strengths, weaknesses, foibles, quirks, and qualities whether he has a 'label' or not. The important thing is to help him with any difficulties he has.

Re the friendship thing. You could also try practising with him - a sort of live-action social story. Do you have other dc who could help with this, or nephews/nieces/friends etc? ie acting out scenarios of play situations to model situations for him.

We also do a thing called mind mapping with ds - if something has happened with another child that resulted in some sort of upset, we go through on paper the scenario with either/or choices and the end result. So eg
ds gets too close to child A
child A asks ds to move away
ds doesn't move away and continues to be in child A's face
child A gets annoyed and pushes ds away
child A doesn't want to play with ds anymore
ds gets upset

What could have happened:
ds gets too close
child A asks him to move
ds moves
child A is pleased and wants to continue playing with ds
ds carries on being happy

Each step is written in a box with linking arrows, leading to the eventual outcome.

Not sure if this translates well written down (esp this late on a Friday night!) but HTH.

Hi, thanks for replying.

Social stories - hmm. I've tried these kinds of things before with him (eg variants of the boy who cried wolf to try and make him understand he mustn't lie - oh that's another thing that bothers me btw) but he doesn't seem to "get" the connection between the story and his behaviour. It might just be me being hamfisted about it though . But I have tried gently talking to him - especially about the new situation as I am really terrified of him getting hurt - but don't feel like I'm getting anywhere really.

Motor skills - my feeling is that it is coordination and balance that are the problem. He moves quite normally in other ways, but is quite a slow runner I suppose (so am I though) and was slow to jump and climb.

Noise wise - I guess we've been trying desensitising, and I think it is working to a point. For example we were able to take him to the pantomime and he didn't freak. He has also been OK in school concerts recently, so I think it's getting better. But there are still occasions where he really can't stand a particular noise, not necessarily particularly loud. Fireworks are obviously a complete non starter.

Of all these things, it is the friendship thing that worries me the most. As I say he is really sociable, but I have become increasingly uncomfortable that he doesn't seem to pick up "signals" from the other children. I'm especially concerned about the friendship with this boy, as it would be awful if DS was so overbearing as to be a complete nuisance. On the other hand I suffer from a massive inferiority complex and always assume no one really wants to spend time with me - the last thing I want is to project that onto DS!

One other thing I meant to mention under the anger thing is DS's behaviour when put under pressure. For example, you try and practise maths with him and he will not do it, it's like he loses all ability to do the simplest things when he feels pressurised, and he seriously blows up about it.

Thank you everyone. Books - yes. That's something I can work with, I shall look those up - thanks! I don't suppose you can think of any particular books that might help him with managing friendships? I'll try to speak to the school, but I'm not sure how helpful his teacher will be as I have pissed her off quite a lot recently (pushy parent alert ).

It's quite difficult to get a handle on exactly what is going on because I work full time and I don't feel like I spend enough time with DS, just me and him, when he isn't really tired. I have a 2 year old DD too - also very demanding, but in very different ways! I'm told she's just like me - enough said!

Re the social story stuff. It might be easier for him to absorb if you make things specifically about him. It requires quite a leap to make the connection, as you say, between an abstract story, and how that's supposed to relate to him. Inference is a tricky thing!

And actually it drives me mad, as it's everywhere in children's tv and books - you get stories which are evidently supposed to have some sort of 'message' for children but they're so disguised by layers of inference that there's no way a child could make the connections. But anyway that's my own little bugbear - rant over

With homework etc. Sorry if I'm teaching granny to suck eggs etc but go overboard on praise when he does things well. Sounds like he's quite a perfectionist (my ds is too, won't attempt things if he thinks he can't do them, and gets really ott angry if can't get somethign right). You could try doing somethign called 'errorless teaching' - I don't know too much about it but perhaps worth searching on the SN board for it, or starting a new thread. It's basically where you start off with tasks that you know he can do, and break things down into tiny steps, rewarding at each step mastered.

Might also be worth trying calming strategies - breathing, counting to 10, recognising signs of how he's feeling angry. Say patiently and nicely you'll listen to him when he stops shouting. Then wait, say nothing till he's calm - then only when he's calm talk through the problem. The message he should get is that it's ok to be angry, but you won't discuss things till he's calm.

This is all brilliant, thank you so much! I'm going to have to go to bed now but I'm going to follow up on all this, and obviously if anyone else sees this and has any wisdom to offer I will be so so grateful!

Thank you all

I find this 'looking for a label' criticism offensive too. The op has observed possible symptoms in her ds and wants to know if there's a medical explanation. Quite rightly, because if he does have a condition and it's diagnosed early, then she can get help for him. If not, she can set her mind at rest.

OP, I have to say that some of the things you've identified in your ds, I could say about my ds1, who has been diagnosed with dyspraxia. He also is poor at observing boundaries in friendships and tends to get over-enthusiastic. Plus poor motor skills and terrible handwriting. I'm not saying your ds has got it, obviously, but it's surprisingly common and could be worth looking into. Have a look at the dypspraxia foundation's website, it's got some really useful information there.

BTW, we went to our GP and asked for a referral to a paediatrician, not an OT. I don't know if this is something which varies according to where you live. Your school's senco might know? In fact if your school's senco is any good, I'd have a chat with her/him about your ds anyway. They're paid to know about this stuff!

There is a book called 'The unwritten rules of friendship' which lots of people have found helpful, too. It's about £13 though, so you may want to get it on loan from the library.

Hi OP,

You and I know each other well from a 'different' topic . I'm surprised at the 'label' comment just after your OP and didn't read it like that at all.

I think from what you have written that you are right to have some concerns, not least because you have posted here in the first place, which I think is significant.

If ever the weather gets any better, I woukd suggest going regularly to a playground where you can supervise closely and overhear interactions. Let some consequences naturally occur despite them being upsetting for your Ds. You then have something concrete to discuss, about why things went wrong, and you can pick out something he could do next time to practise. Then go practise. It is better to get as many social mistakes and hurt done now while he is little and you are there to make it better with a chocolate bar and a hug than protect him and not give him the practise and experience until he is an adult.

Thanks Starlight. I must be honest and say I am worried that in terms of the friendship thing I am simply projecting my own very big insecurities onto him. I am terrified of people not liking him, same as I am of people not liking me. Insecurity by proxy one might say!

However, laozi has hit the nail on the head here. Dyspraxia is something I have been concerned about, although even if he got a diagnosis I'm not sure how much help that would be? You know when you go to a GP, do you have to take your DC? I don't really want DS to get the idea that I'm concerned about there being something "wrong" with him - does that make sense?

No you don't have to take him with you - take a full list of your concerns.