ASD base attached to mainstream versus mainstream with support?

[inappropriatelyemployed]

DS is approaching his transition review in Y5. We have to think about schools.

He has AS, suffers from anxiety but can often cope. He is academically able but his communication difficulties are complex and can go overlooked and unsupported causing problems and he will need to work outside the class sometimes.

He has full-time support (just achieved!) and we have won DPs for our SLT on the statement and are hoping to do the same for the OT. I am trying to build an effective, long-term package around him.

What do we do about secondary schools? We have seen a nice, smallish secondary with a very impressive SENCO but there is no specific ASD provision.

Today, we saw a larger secondary which has an ASD base where lots of those little day to day issues would be sorted e.g. homework planning, working outside classroom if stressed etc. They have a SLT and OT who come in and the children go into the m/stream part of the school as much as possible.

There are no local independent schools that I can see who could support someone with DS's profile and I am not sure that is the route I want to go down anyway.

Ideally, I would like him in m/stream but I have to be realistic. I liked the base but is it too 'institutionalising' and would I then be forced to have their SLT/OT support as part of the package.

Am I better sticking with the smaller school and building a bespoke package around him?

Can you revisit both schools and ask them more specific questions?

How big exactly is the MS with ASD unit?
Can you speak to any current parents from each school?
How do the MS with unit integrate their education between the two?
What support is there at the smaller MS in terms of help with things you mentioned such as home work plannings, timetables, etc.

There's not even the choice in my area and while DS is plodding through MS primary I can't see him managing MS secondary, it's a minefield isn't it!

When thinking of a school with 'expertise' on site you need to consider how open that 'expertise' will be to your suggestions and input should you feel it is needed.

You don't want a re-run of Teacher as a TA iyswim.

Doesn't mean it will be bad, but it could be a disaster if they insist that they are the experts and you have nothing to contribute, especially if it doesn't work.

Sometimes the schools without expertise can be better and more grateful for any input from the parent and/or pays for.

"Doesn't mean it will be bad, but it could be a disaster if they insist that they are the experts and you have nothing to contribute, especially if it doesn't work."

Star - that is what I was thinking! They were adamant about it being child specific and flexible but I wouldn't want to go back to generic SLT and OT that I have no control over.

Yourhandinmine - the MS is 1100 pupils with 15 in the base. I can ask about setting up a scheme for the other school which tries to replicate the package in terms of withdrawing when necessary, doing homework on site, organising possessions but then I assume that is what you would want your TA to do.

The TAs in the unit have ASD experience but there is no guarantee that they will understand DS who is a funny one!

Would you dare ask them what they think of ABA?

I worked in a unit. The kids came out of lanhguages and had me but were in every mainstream lesson. We supported them on organisation, socially, coursework, being an advocate for them. We had students who were G&T and some working at very low levels. We were specialists in annual reviews and we delivered a rolls royce service. I was able to be in regular contact with parents. Other statemented students who were not in the unit did not get the same level of continuity and support. Go with the unit. Life gets very tricky for autistic teens. The unit will put him in most mainstream lessons but he knows it is there as a refuge.

Star - that is an interesting point! Worth asking definitely.

Inaflap - thank you. That is very reassuring. I hope this unit is the same! It did look good. A boy approached us to tell us he had been making a plan of the base on his computer and wanted to know if we would look at it. His teacher said yes, if we didn't mind but would he do his geography first while we had a tour of the school.

When we finished, 30 mins later, I wondered if she would remember. She did and asked if we would mind going back to see the plan. The boy had done a wonderful power point and we all praised him and left.

On the way out, I commented on how confident he was and the teacher said he had had a terrible time in primary and would never had spoken to anyone and that he still had 'bad days'.

I thought that was an honest answer and I was impressed that she made sure she went back as promised.

Oh that does sound good. I'd be happy with a teacher like that for my ds.

Thanks. I am going to take DS to see it too.

We had a kid in our unit who had tried to commit suicide when at primary. He left with 8 gcses. The staff in the unit will be better trained, conversant with medodologies and conditions (i mentioned mumsnet in my interview and have used knowledge on here to help many other kids). With support in mainstream its only going to be as good as the TA with him. That will change a lot and he won't have a base to go to. We had some that we saw a lot, others that we only saw now and again. Just because they have a place in the unit doesn't mean they are stuck there and all schools want inclusion.

Good luck.

I was given a tour of an autistic base wheile looking for possible placements for DS.

It was a small unit, housed in it's own building within the school grounds. It had it's own Head and staff that were trained in ASD. The walls had visual reminders on them and pictorial social stories. On a blackboard they had been teaching the children the nuances when you stress different words within a sentence. i.e. I did not... I did not.. etc.

They operated a buddy system under which the children were permananetly paired up. This was to ensure that if one child was bullied but fearful of reporting it his buddy could do it for him.

The children in the unit had almost all their lessons in the base but had to fully integrate with the main school for science and PE. I asked about bullying and was quite surprised to be told that the children couldn't be sheltered 100% and could still be subject to deliberate jostling etc while moving around the mainstream building.

I would have desperately wanted DS to attend that autistic base at age 11 (but as he didn't receive his dx until 15 it was too late for him). It would have allowed him to fulfill his academic potential of studying at GCSE level while also being supported and learning how ASD affected him, surrounded by knowledgeable staff.

The alternative would have been 1:1 in mainstream setting which just serves to draw attention to the fact that he would have been the odd on out in the class. He had 1:1 throughout FE and felt that the support worker was a barrier to making friends and the other students were wary of approaching him with an older support worker present.

The only drawback with the base was that it only existed up to end of statutory education at 16. If DS had wanted to stay for 6th form it would have had to be in the mainstream with no support from teh base - and that would have been a very difficult transition.

It's a difficult choice to make but I left my tour of the base that day feeling desperately sad that DS's very late dx had prevented him from learning in a very she;tered environment, instead of being driven to a mental breakdown by the bullying thugs in his mainstream.

Mainstream secondaries have 2 models for TA support. Child specific or subject specific. Which is yours? I know for a fact that any mainstreams in my local borough are no good for DS as the model is subject specific TA support. This would leave my DS with no specific trusted adult who has enough knowledge of ASD and his little quirks to be able to help him in lesson time. Transitions between lessons would be a disaster as there would be no guarantee he wouldn't get lost in the corridors. Homeschool relationship is not tight enough for ASD kids.

The child specific TA system has it's drawbacks too. Get a lousy one like you and I have already found out, and everything is undermined, no matter how good the package looks on paper. Get a good one and the child learns and thrives like a dream. Trouble is parents have no say in TA selection.

Units vary too - some take a one size fits all approach - again disaster waiting to happen imho for HFA kids. These units tend not to be too supportive of parental iniative the mental attitude is very much "we expert you dumb Mum".

Others are proud of their ability to constantly learn new things and keen to stay on top of the latest research etc while building positive relationships with the child and parents. Many let individual staff specialise in one area to a high degree (eg one staff member might go on every sensory related course there is, while another pursues their interest in language comprehension). This second type of unit is VERY open to expert outsiders coming in as the staff are usually craving more than the usual LA provided training in their personal pursuit of knowledge.

However the peer group in the unit may be lower functioning than you'd prefer and access to the mainstream needs to be looked at closely as things sometimes go wrong when kids leave the unit sanctuary. How sympathetic are the mainstream teachers and how integrated into the main staff room are the unit staff? In some schools it's very much a case of never the twain shall meet. A good unit where staff share the coffee machine with their mainstream colleagues is a gift that I'd grab with both hands. Office politics I know, but they'll have a lot of impact on your son's well being.

So you have four potential choices not just 2 and you need to establish firstly what your REAL choice is.

Lastly just to confuse you is an ASD unit really the right choice or is there a school with a really good communications unit or deaf unit or general unit that would actually be a better fit. (eg my son is currently in a mainstream with a deaf unit as the general teaching style throughout the school is VERY visual - far more so than the primary with attached ASD unit). So often the paper descriptions of schools bear no reality to what happens on the ground when it comes to trying to shoehorn an individual child into the model.

Oh and look at the turn over of the SENCO. If there is a quick turnover of SENCO's in a school then that's a huge red flag. If they are any good they don't tend to hang around long if they feel unsupported by the LA as it's soul destroying not to be able to get the resources to help the kids.