Violence from 7 year old, advice please?

[CrunchyFrog]

He has HFA and has been having increasing rages over the last few weeks - normal, new school year, transition etc.

He often scuffles with his brother, 3.8 years, and that's fine as it's very mild and mutual scuffling IYKWIM, they are able to sort it, it seems "normal," for want of a better word.

This morning, his adored older sister got in his way and he properly punched her in the face. She was so upset, she's 9 and adores him, fights his corner, looks after him. She would never hit back.

He's been head butting me as well, and proper screwed -up face out of control screaming when thwarted.

He's fine (unsuppported) at school, teacher well aware and has done a full-class visual time table, and is helping with toileting issues. For the first time ever, he was unsettled in school the other day, this is very unusual.

Sleep had sorted, but we're back to midnight or later before dropping off (so he's a ratbag in the morning, fine in the evenings as he just does his "things," sorting cards etc.) Toileting has had a big step back.

He's lost his computer time tonight, but he doesn't respond to consequences generally.

Any words of wisdom?

My guess would be that something is not right at school and he is venting his frustration at home on the people he can trust to love him.

Moving classes and teachers is a massive thing, some teachers are not as good at picking up the signs of distress as others.

I think I would go in if I were you and see if someone can just spend a bit of time with him each day to check he is ok.

My Dd3 is not able to tell people at school that she is stressed but the SENCO or TA pop down to class or take her to the resource area to check in with her everyday. The SENCO especially can tell by her body language if she is struggling.

Good luck

Teacher is excellent - but she has 30 kids, and as well as DS1 there are 2 other children with ASD (both statmented for 10 hours a week, so one FT assistant shared between them.) The assistant refuses to work with anyone else, which is probably right.

Teacher really has gone above and beyond, especially compared to last year's, who didn't "believe" in ASD. I think it's possible that this is not the first time he's been "unsettled" in school, but that last year's teacher just didn't realise!

I know the toilets aren't nice (echo, stinky etc) so it's been arranged that he is told to go at quiet times (he won't go if anyone else is in there.)

He's doing very well academically, which is good.

Does a child have to have a statement to get hours with an assistant? He won't get one, based on school behaviour, but I really think he'd benefit from even 10 minutes a day of 1-1/ debrief.

I would really like him reassessed by Ed. Psych, he hasn't been seen since DX at 4. But (yawn) there is No Money, so EPs are only seeing new DX/ transition pupils. I may ring the paed, see if there's any support that way.

The school nurse gave some enuresis advice, but said she's unable to deal with soiling behaviours.

Statements are based on need of one, not on school behaviour. They can also address social/communication needs. To my mind your son is being failed by his school as his needs are clearly not being met there on any level. That will affect his ability to learn in the long run if not the short term. Your home life is being affected too. In order for him to have more hours of support in a classroom he will need a statement.

You also need to think longer term as well, how will he manage at secondary school?

You can apply yourself for a statement document to the LEA, you do not need anyone's permission to do this. www.ipsea.org.uk has model letters you can use.

I would talk with the paed asap and insist that your son is helped with regards to his enuresis problems. Not surprised to read that this was outside the school nurse's remit, this problem needs specialist help. Is your GP any good (if not change GP practice), get this person on side re the toileting issues.

Secondary school is a terrifying thought.

It's a bit different as we're in NI, they still use the 5 stage COP. DS1 is Stage3, broadly SA+. School want him moved down. I am freaking out.

Going to have to grow a pair, basically. Do some arse kicking. Damn it.

I am afraid it will be up to you cruncy

I am dreading secondary too and I need to look at getting a statement for Dd3 too.

I would resist moving him down the cop especially at the moment and I would definitely be going in to see someone about the rubbish transition he has had.

Our children need careful handling and he is obviously letting you know that things are not well at the moment.

Good luck

That's the thing, he had what I thought was a great transition! Letter from new teacher at the end of term, a visit in the last week of the holidays so he could see his seat and peg etc, I guess he just needs more next year!

Sitting here close to tears, FFS.

He's back to soiling nearly daily. XH is struggling with the behaviour and wants me to chase referral to Psychology. It's a big regression, but I do remember that last year things were really tough until October, then improved. So hopefully we'll follow the pattern.

I do feel a fraud on the SN board, only come when things are tough, the rest of the time I just pretend he's fine. I'm sorry for that, I must try and contribute more.

Dont feel bad crunchyabout not contributing on here. Most of us are just relieved to get through each day. I come on here nearly everyday because it makes my life seem normal. I dont always contribute.

Your Ds sounds like my Dd3, he is really struggling with this transition and probably struggled last year too.

Dont let it go on, go in tomorrow and make an appointment with the SENCO. Tell him/her that he is struggling and that his needs are not being met.

Dd3 now has a passport in the 2 classes where she is based, it explains what her difficulties and talents are, one of her talents is developing coping strategies which always involve not asking for help!

The passport also has 2 named adults she can go to whenever she needs to if things are getting too much. One of the adults is based in her classroom part of the day and the other is the SENCO who goes to see her regularly.

Is your Ds ever seen by an ASD Outreach worker? If not ask the school to set this up as they are trained to support children in MS and can be really good.

I always thought it was normal for Dd3 to waste the whole of the first term settling in, until I moved her to this school and the SENCO said it is absolutely not normal and shows that poor transitions are taking place.

Thanks for replying

DS1 has, up to now, presented with extreme passivity, but this week his teacher has described him as "hyper" and "unsettled." I think that's a reasonable description. Up until now, he hasn't been "bad" enough for in-school support as all of his issues have been either mild or out of school.

There is a team who go in, but they don't work with the parents - it's all about improving access to education. His academic stuff is totally fine, teacher is still finding his level but hasn't challenged him yet, even with all the anxiety he is still first to complete work, and I've watched him - it's all right, first time, without apparent effort. If I could figure out what's making him anxious, I could fix it, but he won't/ can't TELL ME, the wally.

I don't see how it can be social, he has loads of friends (he's very lucky, his "strong interests" are Doctor Who and music, the other kids are still at the stage where they're awed at an encyclopaedic knowledge of classic Who!), his speech is nearly within normal limits (disordered rather than delayed), there is bullying tolerated in the school.

He's currently sorting his cards. Not even nearly tired. I just want to fix this for him. XH, though a lovely man, is a chocolate teapot, and I am feeling the weight of this stuff very heavily today. Especially when friends all go "Oh, my DS does that too/ that's normal/ all kids do that..." NO THEY FUCKING DON'T. THEY DON'T. If they did, then YOU would be panicking too! Being a bit stroppy or having a tantrum is NOT THE SAME as DS1's utter meltdown. It just isn't. Their kids aren't regressing to shitting their pants everyday and headbutting their parents. They don't scream with some undefined emotion that they can't cope with. ARGH. Sorry, venting.

I guess I thought a DX would help. 2.5 years in, we've had one 10 min review with paed, SALT and NOTHING else, because he doesn't misbehave in school. That appears to be the crux of it.

We are the same, in that Dd3 was diagnosed exactly a year ago and has not been seen by a single proff since!!

She is very passive at school and never gives them any trouble, this has a price though because she can come out very uptight and can be difficult to manage on the walk home.
Dd3 is like your Ds in that she cannot put her feelings into words, she is getting help at school with this but we have a long way to go.

Her old school completely failed to spot her difficulties and made it very diffiuclt for us to get the proffs to take us seriously.

After she left that school she told me that she used to get help by waiting for someone else on her table to ask for help. She also made sure that she kept her photo on the "happy" side of the emotions board because if anyone put their's on the sad side they had to explain to the teacher why they were sad!!

My guess is that your Ds has the ability to develop coping strategies similar to these but of course every time he moves class he has to start again.

I really feel for you and your Ds but this can be sorted so long as he gets some TLC at school and then you might want to look at getting him a statement. I am seriously considering it before Dd3 goes to secondary.

Spoke to the SENCO this morning (also class teacher!), she's going to have a think about who to contact WRT to school issues. She's convinced he won't get a statement, this is a teacher who has been SENCO for 15 years - it's not that she doesn't think he needs support, just that it is so very, very hard to get without academic problems or behavioural problems that impact the classroom.

Morning from hell, he had soiled the bed so had to shower, he Doesn't Shower in the morning. Punched and kicked his wee brother who was unable to fight back (that's how you know when it's meltdown time rather than scuffling, the wee one was scared )

Got them to school, then spent 2 hours on the phone going from pillar to post trying to get an appointment with SOMEONE. Eventually rang the Children with Disabilities SW team, he has a named SW but we've never seen her. Someone is going to phone back ASAP. So probably next year.

Have you looked at PDA on the NAS website? You might find some of that theory worth applying to get him to do more things without a fight.
Re daily shower, don't worry about that until they actually smell! Really not a battle worth fighting.

Had to be done today, silk, he was covered in poo!

I do generally pick my battles with more care

Going to have a look at the NAS now.

I agree with silk re looking at PDA ,the behaviour is often not that obvious till 6/7 . The methods are helpful when behaviour stems from anxiety/ need to control.

We had a better morning, no serious lashing out, just a bit of grumbling about getting up. He said he felt happy today.

No word from SW yet. Paed appointment in 6 weeks for a review.

School basically doing the usual thing - all the problems are at home, therefore it's my problem. So I don't think I can hope for any support from them for going for statement etc.

He has HFA , he will present differently indifferent settings , and anxiety in one where he "copes" will be displayed at home where he feels safe, school should know this,just because they can't/ won't see the anxiety does not mean there is no anxiety! Makes me so angry, I get this too, but my son is 4 and only doing mornings 4 days a week so he copes ok, because of that. I have not got a statement yet either,trying to summon the energy to tackle it !

Little bit of progress - things are calming, HV is phoning the school this week ahead of IEP meeting to explain masquerading etc. Paed appointment in 6 weeks, GP on side. Fingers crossed we start getting somewhere!

That's great, maybe start to do daily diary and video if you can. Give them every chance to see what you see.

Yes I had success writing what was basically an essay on all DS's oddnesses and problems. Then when I discovered PDA I was able to write a new one explaining how things had changed with our use of PDA theory.