Not quite sure what I am asking here,...but..

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

DD has Dx of Autism that was just into severe category. She also has GDD. She is 5.10 but is like a 1 year old in many ways.

She has serious sensory issues, no imaginative play and is non verbal, so can't question the ASD Dx, however...

She is suddenly meeting all sorts of NT milestones,albeit very late.

She is clapping, waving, and most interestingly pointing to share interest, all the time, is saying bye bye and generally starting to behave like an NT toddler. She is besotted with cuddles and my attention.

Whati am wondering is..can this happen with ASD anyway?

I have read that severe GDD can present as autism though. Should I be getting her reassessed? We dont see a paed any more but am wondering if we should.

I suppose it doesn't matter that much since she obviously has pretty severe SN so maybe the specifics don't matter.

But am intrigued by these developments and would value opinions...

Hmmm... well they do say ASD is a developmental disorder so even if some milestones aren't reached when they would be in nt development, doesn't mean they never will be.

And of course the social things and joint attention stuff you list are ones which might appear at a 'normal' stage with a child with ASD - my ds (HFA) waved, clapped and pointed within normal milestones. Also has always been very attention seeking. Even imaginative. But is definitely ASD! Impairments and deficits are so varying - and it does seem that one can have severe deficits in some areas but seemingly none in others, and still have a dx of ASD.

I have also observed in my ds that development can seem to plateau at times then suddenly come in spurts. I wonder if something has sort of 'clicked' for her that she has suddenly got the point of joint attention?

This probably isn't helping clarify things for you is it

The most important thing though is hurrah for your dd! How brilliant. And sounds like she is enjoying practising her new skills

I have found that my DS (6, dx of ASD) has, with time, hit some of the NT milestones that he had missed at the 'normal' age. Or are you asking if it can happen so suddenly? The only parallel I have is toilet training - after months of trying and failing to get DS to do it, from one day to the next something clicked.
You're evidently doing a very good job with your DD!

Actually, having thought a bit more, given that she has a dx of GDD too, I'm not surprised you're questioning the ASD dx!

I'd be tempted to watch her for a few more months and then see a paed again for another assessment. You're absolutely right that other developmental disorders can present as ASD (eg S&L delay in younger children).

I have muddied the waters even further for you haven't I. I'll shut up now

Thanks sc13 :)

You haven't muddied the waters Bialystock, they are confusingly muddy already, I think you have just captured my dilemma exactly.

Will try to get an appt with a paed again I think.

I think with an ASD DX alone, the delays are spiky, hitting the triad mainly, hence the 'disorder.' Other milestones tend to be more or less on time. When mixed with other DX it really does get more confusing. My understanding of GDD, was that the global bit, which sounds like it should mean everything is delayed, actually means more than one area is delayed, cognitive or physical or social or language etc.

But you need a paed to iron it all out, I agree.

What a fantastic developmental leap, though.

Yes, I am thrilled, earlier this summer I was still feeling sad when I saw young toddlers pointing at things, now DD has discovered her pointy finger,

cant pass a bus or a motorbike without a big pointy finger appearing

Wouldn't she have learnt to point with ASD eventually though? Dd whose dx is moderate to severe autism and ds whose dx is severe autism both learnt to point. Ok at 17 ds's isn't terribly reliable even now and dd would have been getting on for 5 when it clicked (before that she thought waving her finger around was pointing. I used to ask her what colour so as to narrow it down a bit) but now you'd never know that there was any delay.
It sounds though as if she is making huge leaps of progress which has always been my experience with ds too.
In our area it is far better to have an autism diagnosis than GDD (it gives a greater choice of provision and a higher level of support) so I'd check what you'd stand to lose before considering whether the ASD dx ought to be removed tbh.

DD1 (4.6) has a dx of autism (on the more severe end, she is not high functioning).

she is pointing, has joint attention, give cuddles (but only on her terms), can have lovely eye contact, very considerate. loads of empathy, can read emotions in faces easily....

all very confusing for me sometimes but then DD1 is very much autistic in so many other ways that I do not have any doubt we got the correct dx.

yes I am not thinking at all that it needs removed, but just wondering if it should be reviewed. That is a good point though, we have a great carer through local autistic service. She is far from not having ASD, but I wondered if the other side of her issues (SLDs) are maybe going to end up more prominent or something IYSWIM. Luckily the school she is at deals with both so she will be well supported there whatever.

I am just very aware that a LOT of DD's issues are severe delays in many aspects (she can't jump or run well yet and still has issues on stairs)

Like you though chocjunkie I cannot doubt the DX on many other levels. Especially not when she sits for 3 hours looking at a fork

I suppose I am just seeing a lot of the things her DX was based on changing..which has confused me.

But delighted me too, all progress is good :)

This is exactly what DS2 has done at almost exactly the same ages. He's stil lvery obviously autistic though (just watching him lining up his TTTE toys - I think he's trying to conform to an autistic stereotype, this morning!)

And DS1 presents as almost completely NT, sometimes, until you try to initiate and control the conversation with him about a topic of your choosing.

DD is also appearing as an autistic stereotype today too, lots of sideways looking and not taking me on!

Am interested to hear he did the same..and hopeful it heralds an improvement, as DD "appearing NT" ever and having any kind of conversation would be a great achievement for her!

It is interesting what some of the posters have been saying about having one 'label' or another. Maybe I am cynical, but I wonder which label, if any, would get our children the most help in terms of statements etc.
For instance, I have been wondering if a lot of DS's difficulties have to do with a form of auditory processing disorder. But I'm not sure what good I would get out of a different or additional label

fanjo, my ds2 had a GDD & cerebral aplsy dx before the autism dx.
For me the thing that makes me think that autism is more appropriate than GDD is that his development is disordered rather than just delayed.
ds2 is 10 & can clap, do a thumbs up, point & has learnt recently to choose. so his communication both non verbal & verbal has been much more delayed than other areas

sorry pressed too soon..toileting for example although delayed he mastered at about 5 yrs.
His understanding & following instructions has always been pretty good in comparison to expressive language.

I guess what i'm saying is if you judge each area of development & it is clearly equally delayed across the board then maybe GDD is more appropriate.

I totally agree...there is no way DD seems like an NT toddler IYSWIM so it's clearly not just. 'delay'.

Still confused, but will just enjoy the new developments and hope it will lead to a better future for DD if she can communicate. :)

I think the main thing to focus on is that she is developing new skills. I think this is something that happens whether dx is GDD or ASD though I know only too well that the idea of a different crystal ball with different predicted outcomes can by tempting. ds1 pointed from around 18 months often obsessively at things he liked so it was not a skill that was noticably absent when checklisting for autism but having seen what 'real' pointing is with ds2 I can see a lot of differences in the quality of shared attention and what the level of what was actually being communicated. I think both GDD and ASD can create false expectations for the unwary - that the child will just somehow catch up and not be delayed any more, or that the child will just somehow go on to be very high functioning and fully verbal. Boring advice but all you can really go on is your own child not very general predictions such as they are for diagnostic terms.

Oh I am sure DD won't be very high functioning, she is nearly 6 and like a baby :)

I realise you are a much decorated veteran Fanjo not an unwary one but was just saying that as a general statement of how people might see things at the beginning of the journey.

Yes, you are absolutely spot on , it is what we all hope at the start isn't it :) ( meant to add that earlier)