Moose again, sorry. Advice on what qualifications etc TA/LSAs should have?

[moosemama]

Ok

So we've decided to appeal. EP advised I ask around to find out what qualifications and courses are currently available for LSA's/TA's to attend to ensure they are appropriately trained with regards to ASDs.

This has come out of them trying to remove his outreach teacher and replace her with a TA who has attended the same 1 day 'awareness' course that the rest of the staff (including the dinner ladies and handyman) have attended. EP agreed that this was not enough training or experience for them to be able to carry out the sort of emotional literacy and social/communication work with ds that he needs, but said she is not up to date on what is available so can't advise further.

I have a couple of numbers to call next week regarding local provision - but was wondering what other people have specified and/or if anyone knows of a generally accepted national standard. (Obviously I know there is no such thing, but I'm trying to gauge what seems to be the norm, iyswim.)

A tribunal is not going to think having an outreach teacher input into programmes and oversee them is gold standard or over provision. They just won't. The LA will know they have no hope.

I would just stand firm on what you want. If they offer less say that if they can't provide this support in mainstream you will have to investigate more specialist placements for HF children or buying in private ASC / ABA support.

We were told unprecedented, over-provision, gold standard etc etc we ended up with 35 hours of ABA 48 weeks per year and more SALT that we asked for. The LA still think thats completely unreasonable and 'unfair' and ignore the fact that an independent panel of 3 people, 2 of whom were employed by neighbouring LAs ordered the provision.
What you are asking for is very modest if mainstream is to work. For the majority of children with ASC mainstream secondary does not work.
You have a legal right to mainstream and the LA have to do all they can to make mainstream compatible with your child's needs. Any alternative is going to cost them more so the LA cannot win this one.
Their argument about removing outreach from statemented children is going to make them look ridiculous at tribunal.

I think lots of TAs with the right attitude but no experience can be good with training and support, but they cannot do a complex job without training or advice. Sometimes a lack of experience (and pre conceptions) is not a bad thing.

Our ABA provider gets the job applicants to interact with a child with ASC as part of the interview process. Common sense really. You can tell a lot just by putting them in the same room together.

But even if you get someone without experience they should be paid to go on courses e.g. re behaviour, social skills etc.

Don't let them browbeat you, they are not going to take this all the way to tribunal.

I wouldn't engage with it tbh, it will just stress you out. Just tell them to finalise and you will appeal.

Bochead, my NVQ3 was completed on the job, mostly in my own time, while working with people with ASD. 7 years experience is probably far more use in real terms, but that's not evidence to an employer.

If I'd studied for that year in a college (the way many TAs get qualified) and not gained any experience during that time, my qualification would be worth exactly the same to the employer while being completely fucking useless to the student and their family...

I have met many fabulous TAs and LSWs, almost exclusively working in specialist provision and given relevant training. I've also met many useless bastards causing more harm than good playing at Rescuer in their little job...

That's what we're doing Agnes. We're going to appeal, but I want to know what's reasonable/realistic to ask for.

One of the biggest problem with ds is that he comes across as calm, polite and capable if a tad arrogant on first meeting. One to one, in a room with no distractions most people would think I was lying if I told them he has ASD. It's only when you're with him day in, day out and see him in different situations, trying to interact with his peers, struggling to cope and wracked with crippling anxieties, phobias and low self-esteem, that you start to realise he's nowhere near as high functioning as he first appears. Bless him he is lovely, but he is completely exhausting to be around.

His teacher this year has been fantastic, gone above and beyond for him over and over again and has always been willing to ask for advice on how to handle things, both from ourselves and outreach and she had limited experience of ASD before this year. If all teachers/TAs were like her, there wouldn't be a problem. That said, the poor woman has visibly aged several years and I can now compare how keen and enthusiastic she was at the beginning of the year that to the exhausted/defeated look and sighs of desperation we are seeing recently and know she's reached 'that point'.

Last year's teacher didn't get ds at all, was unwilling to adjust her way of working to meet his needs, kept telling me that he was 'doing it deliberately' and 'of course he can do it, he's just not trying' etc. She is the teacher that told me that there was nothing more she could do to help him with maths, as she'd tried everything and had nowhere left to go - and she is head of ks2 maths! (This year his maths grades shot up in the very first half-term and he has gone from strength to strength with it all year.) She couldn't cope from day 1, was visibly stressed and all but ready to resign by the end of the year, by which time she refused to speak to me at all.

Both attended the same one day, outreach run ASD awareness course that the school is now trying to tell me is 'enough' for ds's TA and both had the same amount of access to the same outreach teacher/team. In fact, if anything, last year's teacher had more support because the EP was working with both ds and her for a whole term while he was with her as well.

At this point we are working on getting the statement right for his final year at primary, we will then use Annual Review to push for the level he needs at secondary when he starts. We are planning to try and visit secondaries over the next couple of weeks and will see what they can and do offer in terms of support and then work with them at AR to come up with a package that suits his needs.

That is if, being academies, they don't suddenly stop taking pupils with statements following the result of tomorrow's case.

I think what you are asking for is reasonable. A TA who already has experience / training or will get some at the outset; and an experienced ASC teacher to oversee the programmes. I just cannot see a Tribunal saying its fine to put in someone untrained and give them no support or oversight. Many LAs do put in much more outreach (ours is not one of them). But thats why so many children end up having to go private. If they leave a great big gap in provision then they have to accept that you will have to go into the private sector to fill it.

Thanks Agnes.

Do you think they would say I was being unreasonable in wanting to retain his current outreach provision for his weekly emotional literacy session, rather than just have her oversee a TA though?

I just don't see how someone with no real knowledge of ASD can do that sort of work with a child as complex as ds. Maybe I'm kidding myself though.

Excuse me, just posting a link to my other thread as it seems to have disappeared off the listing, so dh can't find it.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/special_needs/1490493-Moose-here-again-Ok-my-brain-is-not-functioning-Help-How-do-I-proceed-here

Ahem - try that again Other thread