cant stop the tears tonight

[thriftychic]

i probably dont have any place posting in sn as no sn have been diagnosed with ds2 . Hes just a mystery . i have tried to get help from camhs but they have been a total let down and seem to think theres nothing to diagnose anyway, hes just odd is the verdict (although they havent really said that exactly)
On wednesday night i went upstairs to hug him goodnight , usually its dh but he was away (never wants me) and in all honesty and without aiming to hurt me he said that he couldnt understnd why he doesnt feel anything for me, that when he looks at his dad he feels great love and like his dad is his world but feels nothing anymore for me
tonight , theres been a big upsetting row with ds2 and his brother ds1 which ended up with ds2 completely torturing himself over why he doesnt love me
i tried so hard to be kind and hug him and stuff but he just wouldnt have it.
i have doted on him so much, i love and worry about him all the time and everythings gone spectacularly wrong since high school.
hes 13 now.
i bet you thought he was little , he doesnt seem to have the maturity of 13 .

Ah sorry it's such a bad night.

IMHO, it's the undiagnosed and unrecognised SN parents who most belong on the board, because RL support is much less and, let's face it, you'd hardly bother coming on here if nothing was wrong.

If he doesn't seem 13, then maybe handling it at his 'real' level is the way to go. Dd (NT) and some of her little 6y old friends go through regular emotional mini-crises. A big hug, simply stating 'ah well, I love you anyway' and then acting unconcerned seems to be the most useful tactic.

The other traits you mention, CAMHS need to take seriously. Presume you've been doing some research already?

we first went to camhs 2 years ago , they did an assessment , they made promises they didnt keep. we last saw them in november and was given a form to fill in , school were supposed to also get one (dont think they did) and i was assured that they would go into school to observe first 2 weeks of january (still hasnt happened)
i rang and left a message for the guy ds2 is under and he never returned my call .
decided not to ring again as they are so crap and seemed to be making ds2 worse if anything.

he genuinely doesnt feel anything for me he used to be my best friend when he was younger .

If Camhs aren't helping, you can ask their PALS (used to be called complaints dept to force them to be more useful. Or go to GP and ask for a referral for second opinion. Community paediatrician maybe, or great ormond street or guys/St Thomas. depends what you and GP think is wrong.

Feeling love, actually loving someone and knowing what love actually is are all very different. And if he has any substantial emotional / social / communication / understanding other people /etc type issues, his ability to actually know that he can love you without feeling waves of emotion, and even when he is bored, unhappy or frustrated with you.

If your emotional literacy is at the 6 year old level, but you have talk to a therapist about it in 13 year old words and concepts, not only would it be worse, you'd probably have a massive headache within 15min!

Could he be having 'normal' teenager feelings, but finding it very difficult to process the emotion due to immaturity? I think Steve biddulf talks about the move away from mum and towards dad at about 13 ( in Raising Boys).

I have the opposite, ds is always telling me he loves me, he even writes list of the reasons he loves and wants me to do the same, he wants constant reassurance. He is extremely insecure and goes way OTT with the love thing.

My point being, my ds's emotionals are very extreme, there is no 'middle', similar to your ds. As mariasalone says emotional/social/communication difficulties and immaturity can often make understanding emotions and feelings very difficult to understand.

Are you suspecting ASD or Aspergers? My DS2 with ASD is lovely and funny, but is completely egocentric and truly doesn't know how to care about others. Your DS obviously worries that he can't control his emotions, not in a tantrummy sort of way, but he feels he can't control who he loves. That is an unusual and not neuro typical response.

I'd go back to your GP, tell them that you aren't getting the help you need and try to get referred to a developmental paed. It can get harder as children get older and develop coping strategies to hide their difficulties.

((((hugs))) My DS2 has never said he loves me. He doesn't understand that it would be a nice thing to say and doesn't feel any need to be loved himself. In his words 'I don't really care that much.' Your DS does sound like he cares, he cares very much he just doesn't understand.

Is he not understanding the difference between romantic love and love for your family (sorry I'm sure that there is a real word for this)? He is at that hormonal age where everything is confusing.

It must be very hard to hear but all you can do is to help him get the help he needs. Definitely go to your GP and ask for that referral to a developmental paed.

DS never tells DH that he loves him, hardly ever kisses or hugs him but is all over me ALL the time. I know it hurts DH :(

Ben10, has a good point, i know that ds has great difficulty with identifying relationships and how these work, how people are connected etc. For example that his nan, is my mum, that his brothers are also my sons etc, etc.

Ds would often say he was going to marry me when he is older, a pretty normal response from say a 4 year old, but he is 8 and it has taken a great of explaining, that you cannot marry your mum and there are different kinds of love.

Even if it isnt so obvious what the problem is. Confusion about relationships and how these work, add to that emotional immaturity, social immaturity etc. It could be a combination of lots of things. He might find the emotions and feelings hard to understand and might only be able to manage these feelings for one person at a time.

It might not be a personal thing, just another difficulty your ds has, i hope our posts are giving you some comfort.

Are YOU upset by his not loving you?

Because the problem really isn't that he doesn't, but that he doesn't understand love and can't express or rationalise it with hormones to confuse the issue.

I tell my children all the time that they don't have to love me. It is MY job to love them and keep them safe. It is their job to be ds/dd and be the best ds/dd they can be with no conditions.

If you had to go away for any length of time I bet you your ds would be heartbroken, but don't tell him that or confuse him with feelings of anxiety and guilt about it. Tell him not to worry, love isn't an easy emotion to understand. You're happy he loves his dad because you do to and isn't he wonderful blah blah blah.

hi, sorry, didnt realise i had all these replies ! thanks all , some very good points made . i honestly dont know what the problem is with DS2 . He struggles with friendships at school and he flips big time over lots of things. mainly not getting what he wants or things the way he wants them. He really makes things worse with kids at school as he is often the one being unfriendly to them. He muscled in with a group of older boys and now he says they are sick of him. I cant always believe what he says though , he is always lying .

This morning because he couldnt find something he was stressing and being extremely rude to me. i told him i wasnt having it etc and instead of being able to reign himself in a bit he dished out as many hurtful comments as possible , called me a scrubber , said my house is small and rubbish and that he actually hates me etc etc.

it was only the other night that he rowed with his brother, then me because he wouldnt calm down and ended up upset that he was wrecking his family and might aswell kill himself.
all this is nothing new and tbh its been much much worse during last year.
camhs said he doesnt have aspergers.

I think he feels great towards his dad because he does all the things he wants , takes him fishing , bike riding etc whilst i seem to be having a stress with him over going to school , homework , bedtimes

He has terribly low self esteem also