PRU for ASD?

[Fightingagain]

Really need advice please. Ds (11) has suspected AS and we are hopefully getting a dx soon. Since December school have only had him for 22 hours per week to match his statemented hours. His behaviour has been getting gradually worse (possibly due to going through puberty) and we are told that he is at risk of exclusion. School now say that they have tried all strategies and want him to go on a 5 week 'course' at a short-stay school (formerly PRU). There will be about 5 or 6 in the class and school think that the behavioural specialists there will be able to help him manage his behaviour so he can have a fresh start in September. Dh and I are obviously concerned about this as ds is incredibly anxious and are struggling to see how this will help him. I have asked the question whether the staff there are trained in dealing with children with ASD's - 'no specific training but have dealt with children with all sorts of problems' . Has anyone had experience of PRU's at all? I can't see this being the best place at all for ds but would like any advice on this. thanks

REFUSE

Whatever you do refuse absolutely to agree to this proposed placement in a (former) PRU.

I have a lot of experience of this - been through it.

The small unit (that is not a PRU) will be a centrally run facility funded by the LA directly. It's sole aim is to get your child straight back into the same mainstream placement that he can't cope with at the moment, as soon as possible. It will do nothing to address the reasons why he cannot cope in his current mainstream school.

They'll tell you it's not a PRU - but it is. They'll taell you that it's a small unit designed to provide additional help and support blah blah..... but it's just a holding pren while your DS and his school have a break from each other for a short period.

What you need to know (and to tell the LA) is that PRUs (and these small units) are not designed for a child with long term special needs - and because your child has a Statement he obviously has long-term special needs. Of course the LA know already that this is not a suitable placemnet for a child with long term special needs as the Dept of Education has reminded them of that fact - so the LA are just trying it on to save themselves the high cost of providiing the suitable support your DS requires. (Just like they tried it on with my son too).

You need to reject this suggestion very firmly and remind them of their statutory obligation to provide a placement that is suitable to your child's age and ability that he can access - as he can't access his current school.

Then you need to look hard at what he needs to be able to remain at a mainstream school and whether his existing school can provide that support or whether you need to start looking at alternative mainstream schools or independant placements. It may be that his Statement needs to be reviewed to identfy additional support.

The last thinh he needs is to be shuffled off to a 5 week placement where these behavioural 'experts' who haven't a clue about ASD will not improve matters - and then be shunted back to the same mainstream provision as before. That would just make matters worse.

So say No and you're within your rights to do so. Ask for an Ed Pysch assessment to identify the problems he is facing in mainstream and start looking around for a school yourself that can support his needs and don't limit yourself to those funded by the LA.

Once the LA know that you know that what they are suggesting is not suitable for a child with longterm special needs so should never be offered in the first place - you can start to talk to them about appropraite support.

Thanks Wet. I have just e-mailed his EP asking for their thoughts on this. When you say you've been through it - what happened in your case?

Another issue is transport to get there. Dh is not able to work at the moment due to having to collect ds from school at lunch time. If he takes and collects ds it will mean a 40 mile round trip daily. Apparently a mini bus is available but I was told that it will have permanently excluded pupils on it - hardly the best role models for an anxious child!

Did you post about theis before or am i imagining a similar post?

I work in a PRU and we get quite a few ASD children. We have been very successful with them - PM me if you like

No no no no no no no no no no no no no

I used to work in a pru, and have also worked in ss with teens with asd. Completely the wrong approach.

X post with Tilly - I guess they're all different, butbthe lack of experience and training would put me off this one...

I did write another long post but lost it in the MN crash!

Basically our LA too offered small supportive setting - that turned out to be in grounds shared with the PRU.

Innocently sent DS there just once - a thg from the PRU next door threw stones at the windows, invaded the classroom and threatened the teachers and pupils. So much for small supportive placemnet, Refused to send him again so they had to resume home tutoring.

Then discovered the DfEd guidance that I mentioned earleir which specifically told LAs that these settings were not suitable for children with long term spceial needs. When LA asked me to try sending him again I quoted that DfEd advice and they stopped trying - cos they then knew that I knew that it was a try-on.

My LA also offered mini-bus / taxi to get DS to this PRU/small unit. My LA too couldn't guaratntee he wouldn't have to share that transport with the PRU thugs. DS had a statutory right to non-stressful transport so i informed the LA he was too stressed to travel alone with a stranger in a taxi and definitely not if it would include a PRU thug - the very same sort of kids that had driven him out of MS in the first place!!

I would seriously reject this offer but if you do go ahead then insist on taxi for him alone - which you're entitled to.

But you'd be playing into their hands as all you'd be doing is releiveing your LA of it's responsibility to provide a suitable placemnet,. This small school nonsense is certainly not suitable as it's not longterm and in ours the children couldn't follow the full Nat Circ (no science facilities on site).

Ask for a proper placemnet at a school where they are specialists in ASD or ask for a place in an ASD Base attached to a mainstream school.

Thanks again Wet, all this site crashing is really annoying!. I did ask about the National Curriculum and school admitted that they didn't teach that. As he is not receiving a full time education now this is obviously a concern. Talking to the behaviour teacher there though she made it clear that they were focussing on behaviour and obviously not educational learning.
School have said that if/when we get a dx then 'other options' are available so I'm presuming that will be SS.

Yes, site crashing is very annoying

Is he in Y6 or Y7 - so new school in Sep or not?

How near are you to getting a dx? Is it a school/LA triggered assessment, or have you gone privately?

Hi Tilly Hopefully getting a dx in the next few months. This is being done through the school after we requested it.

He should be on the CAMHS waiting list if he's awaiting dx. I wouldn't leave it to school - I'd ring CAMHS and point out that his difficulties are now preventing him from attending school so you need an early appointment. Also get your GP to refer to CAMHS independently.

One thing we've all learnt is that you need to push and make as much fuss and noise as possible to get things done. Don't be afraid to -it's expected. The meek and quiet remain at the back of the long queue.

It needn't be SS with a dx. It can be additional support to enable him to attend existing school or an austic base attached to a mainstream secondary.

Behavior specialists are unlikley to have any strategies that will work with ASD unless they have received ASD-specific training and I doubt v v much if those people have, That's why you need an ASD-specific placemnet as he's already proved he cannot survive in current mainstream provision with current levels of support.

Why can behaviour support staff not come and work in his present placement?

Look at IPSEA for advice on exclusions

OP, you Ds doesn't have 'problems' he has a disability.

Agnes behaviour support have been involved and all their strategies have failed apparently.
Does anyone know our rights on this? Can school just send him there without our permission?

No - they cannot send him there without your agreement.

Your son has a Statement that is a legal document that states in Part 4 where he is to be educated. To educate him elsewhere is illegal.

So the LA try to get around that by saying he will be dual-rolled i.e. will reamin enroolled at his current mainstream school and also at the PRU small unit. Which makes sense as the aim of the small unit is to get him straight back to his ordinary MS as soon as possible.

The fact is - he has a Statement stating that the school that can meet his needs and is therefore named in the Statement is his current school.

His current school however cannot meet his needs - so another placement (the small unit) is being suggested.

That's not the way to deal with needs that cannot be met at his existing school. The correct way is to increase support at his current school so he can copr OR amend hus Statment to send him to an alternative school that can meet his needs OR send him to an ASD-specific base attached to mainstream OR an independent AS school.

All those are valid options - which the snall unit is not.

All those options are also expensive - so the LA is plumping for a cheap unsuitable small unit instead of proper support.

And please remember - children with ASD hate change. he's going to be even worse behaved after the disruption of the small unit and then back toexisting mainstream.

So say NO and ask for support that will enbale him to stay at existing school or for LA to amend his Statemnet to a school that can (and that doesn't include this small unit - not that they should be named on Statements as long term placements anyway)

'School have said that if/when we get a dx then 'other options' are available'
ask the school exactly what these 'options' are - support is supposed to be based on need and not dx.
Do you want him to stay at his current school?

Current school and LEA are failing your son. Tell the LEA to stick their proposed placement where the sun does not shine!!!.

Absolutely NOT re a PRU for a child with AS. Its totally the wrong environment and it could well make an overall bad situation far worse with you as the parents alone to pick up the pieces of such a poor placement..