ABA Friendly Areas

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Last week we were told that our LEA doesn't support ABA to the point where if anybody is doing a home based program, they would withdraw any services available to them, such as portage etc.. (not official policy I should add)

As we are already struggling to find therapists to work with DS here and after reading up about some of the others here who have moved for various reasons such as schools etc. (A certain pregnant lady lodged in a premier Inn springs to mind ), we have decided that we are not going to waste any more time and up sticks. We have only one goal at the moment.

Short term move where there is good availability of tutors and I mean good tutors. If the area happens to be ABA friendly, then that would be a bonus.
we will be renting for 6 months and looking to buy once the house we have is sold.

The criteria is to be around the outskirts of London around M25 corridor. The main towns/cities spring to mind are Hatfield/Chelmsford/Hayes/Watford etc, but is not restricted to them, just an example of the area we are willing to consider.

So I ask all ABA' ers on MNSN, where would you go? You can PM me if you don't want to out yourself on here.

TIA

I don't have an answer to your question but did you know that Yahoo groups have and ABA group and you may get an answer if you post on there too.

Thanks Alison I have posted on the YahooABA group and got some responses. I was looking to cover all bases so posted here as well.

So far, I have got ..
Avoid Herts. Good for tutors but avoid as not very ABA friendly.

'some' areas of SW London are better (although I'd be pushed to actually say good) and plenty of ABA tutors. Westminster is probably best though, but Barnet 'can' be amenable.

Avoid Cambridge and Herts and Wandsworth. These 3 were previously pro -ABA until parents flocked there causing them to hire agressive solicitors and legal teams to get ris. Personally I wouldn't consider Essex either. I've seen some very underhand tactics.
Greenwich is fairly okay and Richmond better than many. If you can cope with living in Waltham Forest then they are a really good bet. Not for being supportive but having feck all alternative.

Nth

Btw, on the site 'whatdotheyknow' there has been questions to each LA on no. Of programmes currently running and whether a result of tribunal. The nature of the responses should give you an idea of what you might be dealing with LA wise.

Hth

Thanks Starlight
Just had a look at the whatdotheyknow website and the responses are indeed very interesting. It almost seems like a postcode lottery in case of provision available.

I have had a look at right move and I doubt if we will be able to afford to buy anything in some of the areas like Westminster with the budget we have, but there is scope in other areas you mentioned so will get on to that.

Not particulary ABA related just general observations, from anecdotal experience (Mum was an SEN teacher who stays in touch with the school grapevine cos of DS).

Avoid Southwark. I've met one too many Mums who have had to go to Tribunal 4 or 5 times by the time ther kid has hit their teens. Basically you go to Tribunal - win. Then the next annual review they snatch it all away so you to go to Tribunal - win. The whole thing is a game of rinse and repeat. I couldn't live like that. This isn't especially ABA related, it seems ow they operate SEN rationing generally - adding ABA to the mix will just add another layer of complexity. I don't know how a family can live like that with long term rinse repeat.
One the + side the PCT is good.

Greenwich PCT is beyond awul generally. It's just a crap health authority all round so before moving there consider how much you'll need the NHS for ANYTHING, from maternity services to GP's. Forget decent portage or salt or OT or........ The good thing is that the LEA just isn't that smart when going to Tribunal and that the Autism advisory service are quite ABA educated (though you NEVER call it ABA for fear of spooking the town hall). In fact the Autism advisory team are pretty good all round to be fair. The LEA will do dumb stuff intimidate you, cos they haven't got the smarts for an intellectual defence Tribunal wise. If you have a good EP report you can win ABA easily. Also Riverston private school is there for HF kids.

Lewisham PCT is actually VERY good for a London borough and their consultants ave expertise in "rare" things like APD and they have a decent CAHMS dept. Lots of useful therapies on the NHS you can't get elsewhere. Education is generally good BUT gradually all secondaries & lots of primaries are moving to academy status and I'm uncomfortable with how much accountability re SEN's these schools will have long term. Hearing lots of anecdotal exclusions. Also TA's aren't the best they could hire. It's one where you could win ABA, with a good EP report, but I worry re the academies long term. Autism advisory like Greenwich - ABA sympathetic but don't ever call it that. The special schools are NOT good.

Bromley & Bexley - just no, the LEA's will fight over the cost of a paperclip.. Those councils would prefer children with SEN's didn't exist. PCT's not brilliant. Newham & Tower Hamlets genuinley don't have the funds due to a much higher proportion of serious SEN's in the area so will fight to the death. Both have a policy of "inclusion" at the expense of the child in many cases.

Herts LEA are evil. Essex fight very dirty. Wandsworth were good but because they have an ABA school they suffered from familes swarming to the area and have really toughened their approach recently (I looked at Wandsworth last year as my sis has a property there I could easily have rented).

City of London is a good one - they only have one primary school so outsource "everything" . Hackney is suprisingly enlightened, or less good at hiring hot shot lawyers than many LEA's. A friend (SALT) is moving to Islington as she feels she has the best chance of ABA living in that borough, though she hasn't explained why to me as yet, beyond that she asked her professional contacts and it came down to there or Barnet and she's found a good school in Islington.

Any thoughts on Haringey? (I know they do find a handful of home ABA progarmmes, and Treehouse school is in the borough).

Thanks Boc some really useful advice there.
I started looking at places and we can just about afford to rent in most of the places mentioned in the thread but will have to downsize. There is no way I can afford to buy anything other than a crappy flat based on the prices I have seen, so maybe should look outside of London as well long term. It was interesting reading the website star mentioned. The response from LA's is very telling. It's amazing how much you can tell just from one letter.

The advice about PCT is especially useful as we have one preemie who might need some ongoing care..

Try talking to Duncan fennemore, peach or similar, he may know which areas are ABA friendly.

Treetops ABA school is in thurrock Essex.

Sorry meant fund a handful of ABA programmes (aware of this from a Freedom of Information request). Does having an ABA in the borough, as we do, make it more or less ikely to fund home programmes do you think?

Thanks sunshine have spoken to a number of people and they have suggested places like Hampshire where there is a possibility of it having funded but tutors are scarce. So in the short term, we will be moving wherever the tutors are, haven,t decided long term yet.

Is treetops an independent school?

dudesmummy I have not much experience of this, but it seems it's how they got funded that matters more, not the number. As Boc said up thread, you could be looking at lots of tribunals etc, so it depends on how much you are willing to fight. See the website suggested by star .how the response is worded by different LA's says a lot about how supportive/unsupportive they are.

Oh I am willing to fight (fighting Haringey LA for expensive resources they don't necessarily want to provide is in fact quite a significant part of my day job!). Just wondering whether anyone on here has any direct experience of Haringey in particular. I have spoken to people who have children at the ABA school here, Treehouse, but we don't know yet whether that is going to be suitable for DS (he is only 2 and a half and his needs are as yet not entirely clear). Planning to start a self-funded ABA programme in the next few months, whatever. Then start the fight with the LA I suppose.

Sorry, also meant to say, does having an ABA school in the borough, as we do, make any difference, in people's opinion?

dudesmummy one thing i would say is that whatever you do, don't make the same mistake we did, don't mention the word ABA to anybody involved such as HV, Paed etc as it will be documented and the LA will/can hold that against you. Start the Statement process with the LA but keep that separate from the ABA program.

Yes I have gathered that to be the wisest choice. At the moment LA os not agreeing to assess but wants further assessment, to get an assessment by their EP etc (so far I have only private dx, NHS being way too slow).

TheDudes, I am sure you are willing to fight, but are you willing to go on a rinse-repeat cycle for the next 15 years with the expense both financial and emotional?

Don't be mistaken in thinking that there is any justice or that the law will help you if you're smart. SEN law isn't that tricky but it's application and regulation is a farce. You WILL get worn down by the lies and you will not always have evidence to prove your innocence for things you don't know you are being accused of.

Having said that, I don't know much about Haringey. Have you found it on that site. The responses I think are very telling about general attitude, never mind ABA.

Treetops is a specialist ABA school, you need a statement to attend.

Star, I feel I have no choice but to do what I think is best for my DS, whatever the cost. I would hope to get some help from the LA at some stage, and would be prepared to fight for it, but will be going ahead with ABA even without it anyway. If I have to continue to fund it myself I will!

Yes I know I would need a statement for Treehouse School, we are not at that stage yet (DS is only 2.8!), don't know whether or not it is going to end up being an option for him or not, it is very early days!

Treetops and Treehouse are different schools.

Treetops is in Thurrock, and has an ABA/VB nursery. not sure about the rest of the school, but probably some ABA influences remain.

Treehouse is in Haringey, and is ABA all the way through - well established, one of the oldest ABA schools in the UK.

The whole rinse/repeat cycle does happen, but not always. We live in a county with so-called 'gold standard' ASD provision. We lived less than a mile from one of these provisions (and it is indeed very good, but not suitable for dd1). Parents take their LAs to Tribunal to get into these provisions. And yet we won ABA school for dd1. And even when the LA had a golden opportunity handed ot them on a plate to get rid of ABA from dd1's statement (her school closed - prme time to reopen statement and reassess, which given the progress dd1 had made woudl have been disastrous), they happily accepted a transfer to another BA school. And have (again) not contested her annual review.

So it is also possible to win, and then be left alone for a while. Obviously only time will tell how it will pan out for us, but so far all going ok.

We took a long route through statementing, though, and had tried (and dd1 been let down by) the LA provisions. dd1 languished for over a year (without ABA) in the preferred LA provision to prove she would not progress - a tough time, but for us worth it.

Thedudes, of course you need to fight. I'm not suggesting you don't.

Just advising to be strategic. You can't fight everything at once and there really is no point spending 40 hours fighting foe weekly SALT from someone who hasn't the time or inclination or knowledge to deliver anything that will make a difference. Those 40 hours coukd be spent by you researching and then delivering something that will have a better outcome for you child.

You have to keep focussed on outcomes for your child, NOT on winning fights iyswim. So if you have an exceptionally obstructive LA you might reduce number of battles by moving.

Also dudes you say your ds is 'only' 2.8 but that is by no means too early for a child to have a statement. My ds had one by 2.5. Even though he was a long way off school I wanted his rights enshrined asap. I also wanted his ABA programme funded

But I appreciate you say your ds's needs aren't clear yet.

Well LA has refused to assess for statement at present but want more info, to see an EP etc (we don't even have an NHS diagnosis yet). That's fair enough I suppose. I am considering whether to start down Tribunal route already or at least wait until all the assessments are in and see what they say.
I'll be going ahead with ABA anyway whatever happens!
Not planning to fght anyone for weekly SALT as I have been funding that myself for eight months already! TBH I have no interest in whatever little bits of SALT etc the LA/HA want to provide. I know what my DS needs, and he will get it whether the LA likes it/funds it or not! I suppose I am in a fortunate position in being able to fund it myself (although I course I wuld like to get funding somewhere down the road).

TheDudes, getting a statement means you get to choose the school. Choosing the school can increase your chances of getting one that will allow your tutors in.

You cannot refuse to assess on the basis of lack of evidence either, although LAs like to make this claim. If evidence is on it's way you may benefit from appalling now as it takes around 5-6 months for the hearing anyway.

Thanks for that Star, Well the LA has said that once the EP report is done they will be "happy to reconsider" my application. So I will get that done first, then see what they say, I think. If they still won't assess then will apply for Tribunal.
Thanks for all the advice