Help in school if no diagnosis or statement

[Soutty]

Hi

My DS has speech delay and no formal diagnosis. Having pushed and pushed he is assigned someone to help him transition from his pre school to primary school in September.

I have been told that there is no point applying for a statement as he is nowhere near impaired enough to get one - ditto one to one in school. However I have also been told that as he is identified as having additional needs his new school will be under a duty to provide him with additional support. At this stage, he hasn't even been accepted into the school but I'm assuming this is a foregone conclusion as his sister is there already. I know there will be a meeting in May (assuming he is accepted) to discuss what needs he has.

Do any of you have any experience of this? What sort of help can I expect him to receive? Is it just a case of them being aware of the fact that he might have a meltdown in certain situations and being conscious of his speech delay? Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Who told you that piece of misinformation in your second paragraph?. It is up to the LEA to decide whether or not to issue a statement and a statement should ideally be issued on basis of need, not diagnosis or a lack of.

How old is DS now, are you actually looking at Infants school?. Is this school in the state sector?. Do not assume anything re admission even though his sister attends this school already. I would certainly meet with this school before May in such circumstances to see how willing and able they actually will be in meeting his needs with no statement in place at that time.

I would apply for a statement and ignore any naysayers particularly if you feel speech and language support is needed in the longer term. SALT support in school without a statement in this area at least is non existant.

Plans like School Action and School Action plus (this is used if child has seen any outside agencies like for example developmental paed, SALT, OT etc) are not legally binding and support on this can also be limited in scope.

www.ipsea.org.uk is a good website to use re the statementing process and has lots of information on it.

Hi

Thanks. He has been assessed by a paed who said and I quote "he seems like a normal kid to me - he's just got a bit of speech delay". He is under SALT but she left and her replacement does only 3 days a week. He is due another assessment in Feb (he was last seen in Oct).

I've been told he won't get a statement by my VBA consultant and by the woman who is co-ordinating his move from his current pre-school and the school that I hope he will attend (which is state). I take your point about taking nothing for granted but siblings should get priority and there are 27 siblings next year against 48 places. It's also the closest community school so if he doesn't get in I will certainly be appealing!

My VBA consultant has read the SALT and Paed reports and that was how she arrived at her conclusion re Statement. The co-ordinator said he would not get it because at every assessment he shows improvement. His EYFES profile is age appropriate save for communication and social development where he is lagging a year to 18 months behind. He speaks in short sentences (4-5 words) and wants to make friends but doesn't really know how to go about it so he will say "where's so and so?" and then when they come to pre-school he will just sit really close to them and smile, that kind of thing. He is toilet trained. He has tantrums sometimes but lashes out very rarely - at school this has happened on less than a handful of occasions.

I want him to have as much help as possible of course - but resources are small and there are children a lot worse off than him I guess.

Just read your post bdaonion. It does seem as though they are reluctant to do too much in the early years.

Forgot to say - he was 4 in October.

Do you think he needs a statement?

Most children don't need one. Most children are catered for out of the school's normal budget.

For example my school has a SALT visit every week, and she doesn't just work with statemented kids.

So it really depends on your child and on their school. No one here can tell you any more details than that.

When you get a school offer I'd make an appointment to see the SENCO and discuss his needs and your concerns with her......

My children have all had an awful lot of surport at school without a statement.

It is very much dependent on the school's overall attitude to SEN. Even if you were fortunate enough to have an understanding and nurturing school this does not mean that such support would remain in place long term or when said child moved into Juniors or secondary.

From my own experience SA plus is very limited and I have seen too many of DS's peers languish on it for too long.

Do not be pulled into this trap either of thinking this:-
"I want him to have as much help as possible of course - but resources are small and there are children a lot worse off than him I guess". I know of too many parents who thought that and were put off by such well meaning but ultimately unhelpful professionals with regards to any additional educational needs in school such as the VBA cons you refer to. Neither she or the woman in preschool will have to deal with your son if he starts to fall behind in infants, you will have to carry that mantle and I do not want you to kick yourself for not acting earlier. It is also not up to either person solely to decide; the LEA does that.

You are truly your child's best - and only - advocate here. Harsh but true.

Hi

Thanks IndigoBell. That's the thing - I thought children needed a statement to get help but I have been assured that even though he wouldn't qualify for a statement he will be catered for out of the school's budget because he has been identified as having additional needs.

The co-ordinator will set up a meeting with the school and the SENCO in May and the leader of his current pre school will be there too. It's encouraging to hear that all of your children have been well catered for without statements. I have read so much about children not getting help without statements, that was my concern.

His comprehension is not age appropriate but has improved hugely over the last year. He was echolaic, 6-9 months ago his response to lets brush your teeth might have been to repeat it - now he will say "ok". Still though, I have had to teach the right response to questions such as how are you which he was answering with "I'm 4" or "I'm Oliver". His hearing is fine by the way. I think a lot of stuff probably goes over his head - it's hard to tell as I have changed the way that I speak to him - much slower, less wordy - so he responds to me a lot but still looks a bit blank when strangers say "hello, what's your name, how old are you do you go to school yet" all in one breath.

"That's the thing - I thought children needed a statement to get help but I have been assured that even though he wouldn't qualify for a statement he will be catered for out of the school's budget because he has been identified as having additional needs".

Oh balls to that, its yet more misinformation. My son is now at secondary and its not true honestly what you've been told. All this guff detailed above is all designed to put parents off from applying.

What kind of help do you think he needs?

Obviously it doesn't require a statement to get the teacher to speak to him appropriately :) - but it does require her to be told.

Do you think he'd be best at a Speech & Language unit rather than a MS school? - For that you'd need a statement.

School may or may not have a good relationship with a SALT. Their TAs may or may not have had any training.

Do you think he'd be able to learn in a group situation? Or only 1:1?

You need a statement if he needs a lot of 1:1. You don't need a statement if you want the teacher to be very careful how she phrases things....

Something like a TA doing a program provided by a SALT with him for 15 mins every day, wouldn't require a statement.

Well I think that the school need to be fully aware of his issues and make sure that they deal with him in the same way that we are at home and that his pre school are dealing with him.

I don't know whether he'd be best at a speech and language unit tbh. I'm hoping that continuing with VBA (we've only been doing it since early December) will help him to catch up by the time he's 8/9.

Learning wise I think he could learn as part of a group. He is up to speed with where kids are meant to be prior to starting school. Like a lot of spectrummy children he is interested in numbers and letters and can concentrate and persevere for long periods of time on things that are tricky/fiddly. He participates well in group activities in pre school. Having said that, he does learn better visually so the way things are taught in school might not be the best way for him personally to be taught iyswim - but then having 1-1 won't change that.

I think that the school need to be fully aware of his issues and make sure that they deal with him in the same way that we are at home and that his pre school are dealing with him. - you don't need a statement for that.

I think he could learn as part of a group. - that's excellent.

he does learn better visually - school do lots of that.

I have no idea whether he needs a statement or not. (Obviously).

You can apply for a statement any time. But unless you have an LEA EP recommending one they are incredibly hard to get.

I would talk to the SENCO and see how you feel after that. I would also make sure I had a nice written trail so that if I did want to apply for a statement I had everything that had been tried all documented.

After you've talked to the SENCO, send her a nice email thanking her for her time and confirming everything you've agreed :) (Which is the start of your paper trail)

Thanks, that sounds like a plan. I think I feel more comfortable with waiting to see how he adapts to school before applying for a statement at this stage. At the moment it's very hard to gauge how he will progress and how helpful the school will be - but I have more reasons to be positive than negative I think. I've certainly been impressed with the school so far - although my DD is NT - but it's a start.

I would have a chat with school in any case (make an appointment with both the ht and senco) it should all be covered in your transition meeting, but it's always best to give them a heads up in advance. And ask how far in advance the transition meeting needs to be to allow plans to be put in place.

We were in a similar-ish position as dd2 was due to start yr r when her bro was in yr 2. School already knew she was upcoming (we were v open that she has sn when her bro and sis got their places) but we made sure that they were fully aware of needs. There was an official transition meeting (and in fact the lea decided to statement for yr r in the end) but she had happily been on sa+ from teeny tiny with no problems. She had 1-1 support throughout nursery with no statement.

For school, you need to be asking them about sa+, about how often the school allocated slt goes in and whether ds will be seen in school, about liaison for his iep (and whether school routinely take input from parents and therapists when target setting), and how they manage iep and review meetings. At this stage they should be termly. Twice a year from yr 1 usually.

He might not need a statement. But he will need support, so you need to make sure school know in advance what will be required.

I would also be tempted to tick the special reasons box or whatever on the application form, as well as assuming he will get a sibling place. We successfully argued that dd2needed to be in a familiar environment due to her sn, and to have a sibling in the same school for social reasons (she was theoretically verbal but huge problems with dysarthria. Comms were the main reasons for statement.)

Soutty

The key difference is that any support school delivers without a Statement can be withdrawn at any time. So if school budgets decrease you may find your child's support ends.

Whereas - any support that is stated in a Statement must be delivered - it is a legal requirement that school must satisfy.

Ignore anyone who says he does not need / won't qualify for / there is no money for a Statement.

As Atilla says - they are talking rubbish.

not to be alarmist but especially with the cuts, school age SALT can be very thin on the ground, I have heard in some areas only the statemented children receive SALT.Obviously if you have private VB consultant then NHS SALT may not be a particularl worry. But I think that Attila and Wet do make a lot of sense.

I do think as stated above that a meeting with the senco at the primary school is your best bet. You're basing your concerns on what the pre-school workers are telling you, but the senco at the primary school is going to be of much more help to you in this regard. He/she is the one that is going to be able to tell you what the school can (and will) set up immediately. That alone is going to tell you loads about where the school itself stands in assisting him with his needs.

Then go from there, once you've spoken to them.