Social Interaction, when does lack of it become a problem, or is it shyness

[chimphead]

Hi, I have been reading this board for a couple of years but find it difficult to post. However have not seen much improvement in DS over the last year so I feel I need your advice.

How do you know the difference between being shy, not wanting to interact or share or being unable because you don't know how to interact with other children.
When should you be concern about lack/delay of social play interaction. I have voiced my concerns about DS 3.10 to school nursery (when he started in Sept)and HV when he was 3.
Who all say he will improve as he gets older and is just shy. But I seem to be the only one who thinks his interactions are delayed and not in the norm comared to his peers(my friends with children of that age )
He seems to me, to be bright, but sensitive and unable to understand how to play with others.
He does have other issues which do concern me too, but mostly get told not to worry about those too, so sometimes I feel I am worrying for nothing.
He has a very limited diet, only very few food groups ie garlic bread and cheese. He dislikes noise, and crowds. He does not like to go to playcentres when busy or parties at all. Parks are also a problem and I find he will shout at other children and say "Its my park go away" He will not share anything. And I have seen him lash out although at most other times he is not really violent and does not have many tantrums.
He has to say which route he goes on when walking somewhere, we walk alot and sometimes he gets very upset if we dont go way he wants.
He will only watch certain television programs. He has never sat through a film yet, but will watch octonauts, Dora, Mickey Mouse and tom and jerry
nothing else. Although he get very upset at certain story lines especicially swiper stealing things and I often have to turn programmes off.
He will often say he is sad and start crying at certain music.
Sleepwise he is sleeping through the night most nights but this did not happen until he was 3.4.
He has always been slightly unusual and quirky, but so am I and his father. I was extremely shy and still find it hard in social situations, I think I have APD.
But really (thank you for getting this far) do I have genuine concerns for DS or will social skills come to him as he gets older and starts school
When I approched HV this time last year with these problems and because his motor skills were lacking ie did not climb and could not jump.
They sent a paeditric nurse to observe him. She said she saw no problems. But to be honest he is extremely open and loves talking to adults. Not a bit shy
But at home in the front room is not where I see the problems. Its at play centres or in the park, where he clings to me. He wants me to go with him everywhere.
Does anyone have any ideas how to encourage him to share. Over xmas he would not even watch octonauts with his cousin. He said he wanted to watch it "on his own for me". So he hid under the table and did without.

Thanks and worried

Your statement "at home in the frontroom is not where I see the problems " is exactly the same phrase I keep telling dd2s paediatrician. She is 2.5 and is due to have ados test for asd soon. She sounds bit like your son, doesn't like playcentres and busy places, she does like the park but will growl and shout at kids that are on 'her swing'. She still doesn't sleep through night and is fussy with food.
I would go to your gp with a list of your concerns physical, social, emotional etc and ask for referral to peadiatrician . Good luck x

Hello Chimp,

If you are worried you must get another opinion. We had the same sort of reaction from our community paeditrician she was of the "It'll be fine just wait and see" approach. Ask your paeditrician to refer you for an assessment by an educational pyschologist they will visit you listen to all your concerns and then go to your child's nursery to carry out an assessment they will observe him with other children etc and then make recommendations re assistance he will need when starting school in September. Lots of health professionals will tell you just to wait and see how things pan out when he starts school but personally I felt it was better to have the assessments done and dusted and the help in place from day 1 as these things take ages.

Good luck

My Mum is naturally painfully shy (as is her brother - it's very funny to watch them together, they adore each other but neither can start the conversation). My ex is AS - the difference is obvious and is largely based on ability to put your self in another person's shoes or see other people's perspectives - He's "people blind" for want of a better description.

There's nought wrong with shyness and in an educational setting all that's normally needed is a little extra tlc and kindness/understanding from those working wth a child. The same is not true of ASD's. Cogntive behavioral therapy worked wonders for my sisters crippling shyness as a teen.

HV's just aren't trained to recognise many developmental disabilities, neither are nursery staff - their knowledge mostly comes from having met other kids with the same condition in the past - very few people get to meet the full range of diabilities there are out there in all their permutations in a lifetime! This is why you should always listen to your gut nstincts as a mum, you'll notice issues YEARS before anyone else does in many cases just cos you are so attuned to your individual child.

As a first step ask to be referred to a developmental pead (community pead in some areas). You can do this via the GP - don't let yourself get fobbed off. It's worth that initial appointment for peace of mind.

Keeping a diary of "odd behaviors" while you wait to see the pead can be useful for medical staff too, and help you to feel you are doing "something". Patterns of behavior can become clearer over time too, as can any triggers for anxiety, sleeplessness etc. Some people have used video evidence.

I agree with keeping diary, it really helps.
Go to GP and demand a referal to a developmental pead. Its intresting, I took dd2 to HV at 2 years and explained i was concerned, she referred us to SN HV who came and sat round my house. She spent 10 mins with us and said, "oh I think shes fine" she then spent a further 30 mins with us, and filled the referal form out before she left!!
You may have to be pushy, but its so worth it. I have 2 girls with Autism, dd2 has had a huge amount of early support and is doing very well. DD1 wasnt dx till 5/6years old and not doing so well.

thankyou for your replies

Yes I think I will go to my GP. I suppose the only person who can do something is me. I really thought that school nursery were going to tell me he was having all sorts of problems but they have not said a thing. The other thing I notice is that being an only child he has no siblings to ruff and tumble or copy. So I often wonder if that inhibits him. He would just stay in the house all day everyday.

There is a sort of parents eveing at nursery soon so I will air my concerns and then visit my GP.

Thanks again for your advice

write a list of your concerns and take it to your GP. demand a referral to a developmental paed.

from my experience I have to say that HVs and a lot of nurseries no nothing, absolutely nothing about asd. between DD's 2nd and 3rd birthday I had countless contacts with HV and DD's old nursery because I had worries about DD. got always told I worry about nothing. we eventually talked to GP (who referred us) & changed nursery. DD got a diagnosis of autism at 3.9 (and she is not even on the high functioning end, at almost 4 she still had only very little speech and language)

trust your instincts. get it investigated and don't get fobbed off! good luck.

Hi Again.
Bochead Can I ask, I always thought that because DS gets upset by situations on TV programmes that he could feel or put himself in other peoples shoes as you say, as much as a 3 year old could do. But reading another thread about another child who got worked up about swiper pinching too. They attributed it to not being able to cope with rules being broken. It has got me wondering about my DS. Are there other ways to tell if a young child shows empathy or not. He often says that music makes me sad, so I just thought he understand emotions.
Is there anything I should look out for, that's noticeable at a young age.
Its all so confusing

I am defo gonna keep a diary
Thanks

Not being able to cope with rules eng broken is an AS red flag I wish I'd known about when my DS was 3.

The diary thing helps you pick up the subleties of behavior over time. I found it incredibly useful to work out what was going on with my DS. Every single child is different. Sometimes kids can seem very shy/extroverted/odd cos there is a simple undiagnosed problem wth vision or hearing at 3.

Keep the diary, book appointment with pead, and then panic only if the pead gives you cause to ; )

I think I always feel worse when I have met up with my friends and their DC (who I have known from being babies as we all met at children's centre). We have been to a play centre today, and you can see my DS does not interact as well as the others. But at least today he did play about a bit and mix slightly all be it for a small amount of time.

However, he really has achieved some things since starting nursery that I thought he would never do. Class harvest festival, Christmas concert and party.
Compared to this time last year where I could not even get him into the church hall.

I think going to school, will be the point when I really will notice if he has any difficulties.

At least I know I can come on here and receive good advice

Thanks

I was shy but not at home. At parents evening my parents would look blankly at the teachers as though they were describing a different child. I think if shy in all situations even 1:1 with another child in own house, or a close relative of similar age then would be worried. Being shy in big groups is not unusual. I still find that difficult.