ADHD at 4years>

[fedupandannoyed]

Name changed and posting and signing off as i am too teary to think but I need to post this right now before I change my mind.

Ok. DS is 4. has always been very lively, very active and a 'typical boy'. He's an only child.

We've had a rough year with him and his behaviour and I have been thinking about ADHD for a few months, but DH dismisses that idea, cos when we look at the symptoms on the net, DS does not tick all the boxes. i don;t need think you need to tick all the boxes to have an illness but DH does not agree.

Main issues - his inability to listen, not taking instructions. he is FAB when he gets my full on all the time attention, and has only in the past 2 weeks started playing with his toys for any length of time. He LOVES tv, and I do confess that when I need a break, he gets the telly as that is the only time he is still.

He loves other children, really wants to play with other kids, but seems to find it hard to make friends. He is loud, had a loud voice and can be very bossy. He is very intelligent, and very astute, but can not seem to understand that he will get a row/early bed if he continues to behave in that way.

He also has a very flashy temper and often his first reaction is to hit. Sometimes he raises his hand to hit, and stops himself, but then might grab my wrists and hold them really tight.

i don;t have a problem with bad behaviour, all kids do things that they shouldn't, and often simply out of curiosity (i wonder what would happen if i threw that apple at the blinds kind of thing) and with nieces and nephews, saying 'stop that darling' or 'that;s enough now' seems to be enough. With DS you have to say it and say it, over and over, loudly, he can hear you but chooses not to, and he does the 'naughty' thing again and again and he gets a dreadful row. I had a dreadul time on the bus a few weeks ago because I gave him a row - even the bus driver commented that I had my hands full. I got off the bus and broke down crying.

I have depression (on ADS) and recently gave up my job to give DS the stability of going the the local nursery attached to the school, 5 afternoons a week. We were hopeful that the stability and the more school lilke environment would help calm DS down, but that has not happened. and it is only by remembering that he was like that at his old nursery that stops me from thinking it is all my fault he is like this, as he spends all his time with me. We do crafts and play board games, stories etc. I don;t to the role playing games which he loves as I am rubbish at it and get bored with that. DH does that when he gets home.

Sorry, it's a bit of a ramble as I am feeling a bit low and upset and DH is not here to talk to about it again but hoping someone can shed some light on DS's behaviour.

hugs to you,
you are not alone!
i have often and still do feel like ths,
has you ds got the same problems at school?
i think you should go to your dr and ask for a referral to see a pead,they will help you,
my ds has adhd,his issues started to become a problem around the age of 2 and a half,and he is 7 now,he got dx just afew weeks ago,but he is getting reassessed in feb for aspergers,
he will be seeing the pead again,

i suppose you could start with asking his school if they are having the same problems,you could write down abit of a diary for your dr, or even video him,(i did that)you mentioned him not appearing to hear you?and talking loud,maybe you could get him checked for glue ear?

ramble all you like,i have plenty on here and everyone is soooo lovely and full of good info,ive learned alot on here!x

If you have concerns (and obviously you do), then you need to contact your GP and get a referral to see a paed. Make sure you not all behaviour that you are concerned about and bring it along to both the GP appointment as well as the paed appointment when you get it.

DS2 has ADHD (along with other things), and he does speak loudly and often appears not to hear us, and can be a charmer one minute and totally OTT the next. It's a bit of a rollercoaster ride daily here.

Agree with others, pop to your GP and have a chat about your concerns. You don't have to take your ds, I didn't. Write 'stuff' down so you don't ramble and he thinks your just not coping. The last thing you want is for him to fob you off with "he's just a boy" ... "he needs proper parenting" kind of thing. Be constructive and precise. Ask for a referral to a developmental or behavioral paediatrician. You don't have to do any of this via nursery/school, you can do it all yourself. You may, however, have to wait 4- months for an appointment. My ds2 has ADHD and ticked most of the boxes but not severely. He is also dyslexic. The loud voice and aggressive behaviour doesn't ring a bell with me, however.

Something to keep in mind is that ADHD often presents with other common comorbid conditions - such as Aspergers, ASD, dyspraxia, DCD...

DS2 has ADHD, DCD, AS, and sensory processing problems, and in the words of the paed "it's hard to tell when these things overlap so much, exactly which condition is causing a particular symptom." Which is why it often takes so long to get a dx - because it's can be quite complex unravelling it all.

fedupandannoyed
"With DS you have to say it and say it, over and over, loudly, he can hear you but chooses not to"

ADD or ADHD, can appear to many to similar to Auditory Processing Disorder (APD) as listening disability, or not being able to process all that you hear. And some who have APD are sometimes miss diagnosed as having ADHD, the specialists really have to understand how the different but sometimes similar conditions differ and how to understand the differences when making a diagnosis. Things are complicated further because psychiatrists assess and diagnose ADHD, and Audiologists assess and diagnose APD, and you may not get to see both types of professional for a true diagnosis. You could have a look at Attention & Memory Aspects of APD

And if the professionals finds it difficult to get the correct diagnosis, then that suggests the parents using the internet could get it wrong as well. So as others have said you need to get see your GP and mention your concerns, and take all downloaded copies of the research which you think best defines your DSs issues.
Most of these types of issues are not always diagnosable until the age of maturation 6-8 years of age when children stop growing out of these types of developmental issues.

Thanks everyone for your replies. DH was adamant that we will never put our son on medication so what would the point be in going to the docs. Me, i feel that I need to know if is behavoiur is normal and if not, how to cope with it and help DS and me. Me getting stressed and not coping is not helping either of us.

He has some issues at nursery. Being bossy, not listening, was rude and covered his ears when it was a little girl's turn to sing. He didn;t want to hear Baa Baa Black sheep. that was his explanation and we've not been able to reason with him that that was a very rude thing to do and how would he feel if someone did that to him. the nursery teacher is very good, but I;ve not mentioned my concerns as I have done so here. Fron what you have said, it wouldn't be until he is a little older that he would be able to get a diagnosis.

And, reading here, it seems that there are overlapping and very similar conditions and getting a diagnosis can be difficult. We are going to wait until after the xmas hols to see how he is then (we had a bad xmas last year with him) and I might press DH to come to the GP with me if things are still a concern.

DH still says this morning that DS is a boisterous boy and that is his nature. The total opposite to me and DH, which is what makes it all the more noticable.

thank you for letting me ramble and I'll look at the links posted here when DS is at nursery.

fedupandannoyed Please note that just because you don't want to medicate your son doesn't mean you shouldn't investigate it further. We do not have our DS2 on medication, and we don't plan to in the near future, however, we went through the process because it provided us the support to get a statement for school, so that he has 1:1 full time (he's in year 1 now, and has had FT 1:1 in reception as well - and he definitely needed it!).

The diagnosis process can take a long time, yes, but that's just it.... it takes a LONG TIME!! If you wait until he really starts having problems in school, you'll just be starting out on the road to the diagnosis, whereas if you start now, you will have access to more support as well as getting a lot of support lined up for your DS while he is still in nursery. The key here is not to wait until he falls behind, but to recognise that he potentially is going to struggle more with school and set up support now to alleviate that.

It takes months to get in to a paed, months to get into see an OT if he needs that, and in most cases, months of forms and questionnaires and tests and such by the paed to see whether or not he has ADHD (and/or anything else). And a statement takes a minimum of 6 months to sort... that's absolute minimum.

Just something to think about.

triggles you are so right! it takes ages to get anywere,
it took from the day i went to the gp to get a referral till a few weeks ago to get my dx,just over 3 yrs! and i now people who havent got that far yet,and they are waiting longer! its so stressful....i knew all along we wouldnt medicate,but i just needed to know what was "up" with my ds!
im still not there tho,as his aggression has got so bad in the last few months,the school think he has possible aspergers,and odd.
my ds talks loud,and i have to talk above him and containly repeat what i say to him so i know hes hear me!arrrrggh!
he argues with everything and everybody...
he is overactive,when he sits at the table he gets up several times to check things,we have to keep getting him back to eat..
his concentration level is low,he also acts like an embarressing fool in front of people.....he has rituals,things have to be do in a certain way,or else!!
hes likes his personal space,and god help anyone who invades it! ,but he invades others,and to him,thats ok!!,it does go on the list,but it might give you an idea if your ds has any "issues"
like you my dh wouldnt believe there was anything up with ds,but as his parent,and a "woman" we stress more anyway, i took ds to the dr,(altho as some1 said you dont have to) ....
i have found since getting the dx ive understood him alot better,im calmer,
my next job is to find out what else is going on and to get others to understand him,as hes not a bad boy! xxxxx

Hi there we got a diagnosis for our daughter of ADHD and we chose not to medicate just now. Just because we don't want to medicate doesn't mean other support isn't available to you. My daughter talks loudly and is bossy! However she doesn't tick all boxes for ADHD but still received a diagnosis .it all depends on the child. Talk to nursery see what they think as well and good luck

Fedup Doctors don't = meds. My ds2 is not medicated and I will strive for that to remain as is. However, the dx has only benefited him. School now understand his attention difficulties and he gets lots of extra help.

Crazygal my ds talks loud,and i have to talk above him and containly repeat what i say to him so i know hes hear me!arrrrggh!
he argues with everything and everybody...
he is overactive,when he sits at the table he gets up several times to check things,we have to keep getting him back to eat..
his concentration level is low,he also acts like an embarressing fool in front of people.....he has rituals,things have to be do in a certain way,or else!!

That is my son! And funny you should mention embarrassingfool infont of others, I am always telling DS not to show off.

DH and I did not talk about it last night. I am having a bout of fatique which has knocked me for 6, and DH thinks it's how I'm feeling that means I interpret DS's behaviour in certain ways. there is no doubt that when I am feeling on form, then DS behaves much better, but is that because I deal with it better or does he play up when he knows I'm not well and it is another way of getting attention?

madameSin and Chundle you put it so well, it's the diagnosis that is the most helpful thing, for both the child and the parents.

I have made an appointment for me for other things, so I will mention to the doctor when I see her then. That's not until January so it will be interesting to see how DS behaves during the holidays and how DH interprets that behaviour (he is off work right through and so will see DS so much more). He did acknowledge last Friday that our son does have a problem being still, but that's as far as he is willing to comment.

i would take ds to the gp on a sepearte appointment,not on the same mention it on the same appointment you have,i did this once,and the gp said lets just sort you out first!
i had a day off work yesterday and spent 1-1 time with ds,there wasnt a problem with him most of the day....however,when i needed to have a shower/get tea on/sort washing out...he then became a handle full,he needs alot of adult time,and demands it,and at school that is also a problem,
you cant be on form all of the time,im certianly not! you would get worn down,
altho what you say is true,when you are on form we do deal with issues better,xxx

thats a good point, Crazygal, seperate apoointment it is then :)

I'll be honest, I use the telly when I need to get things done otherwise they just wouldn;t get done. DS demands a lot of adult attention too.

Oh don't we all!! That tv is a blessing!
Ds is not allowed tv in the morn b4 school. When he gets in he can have an hr of it,then he has to play or do something to help me. Then after tea/homework he can watch on programme of something he likes and that's it. We have spe time with him. That's 1-1 time for up to an hr,sometimes he gets alot less,depending on time and how we feel. He loves it. He has loved frozen planet and documentaries on volcanos etc. I let him watch that when ever he likes.
I just find he copies alot of the catoon. Like sponge bob...he's banned in our house coz ds He crys like him and calls me and idiot because sponge does it!! So I'm carefully on watch he watches. Xxxx

We have 3 DC, all with ADHD. Not one of them is the same and none ticks all the boxes on any checklist.
We have decided to medicate and the improvement at school is phenomenal, however I appreciate that everyone makes different decisions on this.

Yep, medication can really help some children. Obviously it's not for everyone, and you still need all the strategies etc. But I don't think ds1 would be doing anything like as well as he is without the meds.