Juggling siblings needs

[getbakainyourjimjams]

Interested in this one.

DS2 is now 4, ds3 1 (so not too worried about him- he's still too young to notice).

DS2's life is beginning to be a bit limited by ds1. As ds1 has got older it has become harder and harder to take him out, to the point where unless he has 1 on 1 and complete free rein we really can't very easily. Obviously this limits ds2 as well. He goes to nursery 4 mornings and 1 full day. I take him and ds3 to a swimming lesson once a week (but no other kids in the class). DS1 also goes to respite on occasional Sundays and we then try to do something with ds2 and ds3- eg pub lunch.

He does have to spend a lot of time in and we can hardly meet up with other families for a lovely day out. Aged 4 (next week) he has never been to the cinema or theatre, hardly ever been to soft play, never been to fetes or fairs or theme parks, never sat on a beach with a bucket and spade. He is sociable and friendly and loves nursery. He hasn;t been invited to many parties, but I think that's because a) I don't know the other mums and b) I hold his party in nursery so we don't get reciprocal invites. He's loved the ones he's gone to.

I'm in a bit of a dilemma- ds1 needs time with us as well. Should I be enrolling ds2 for more things (stagecoach, karate, football???) or should I be letting him chill a bit and encourage shcool friendships and extra curricular school stuff when he starts in September.

He seems happy- but I worry that he has missed out on a lot, and I don't want that to become a problem.

TBH that doesn't worry me as such. It's the fact that is won't get better, that this is it for however many years. Constant constant supervision for as long as I can see.

She's started to do that once a year soapbox. Last year we went away for a week- locally so ds1 could visit us a couple of times. This year we'll do 4 days. DS1 loved it as well- enjoyed the peace and quiet!

Thanks for the listening ear- I must get to bed now. I should have been writing a philosophy essay tonight!

Listening ears- thanks as well flashingnose.

and aloha!

Yes, I can understand that. The forever bit. Most of us can pass things off as being 'just a phase' but your phase will last a very long time

Yes - get to bed - nice to chat

Take care!

Do you have a local branch of NAS or Mencap? They might run some sibling groups. We have also done some whole family activities from Mencap which have been cheap and not the end of the world if it all goes tits up.

I know I get frustrated when we go somewhere and can only stay for ten minutes but at least we can go to a number of places now.

Can you do beach etc when mum has ds1?

I haven't been around much but did skim through the other thread about the residential needs for ds1 when older and the fear of leaving him with people who will not love him and understand him.

No NAS and no mencap schemes (they have residential homes etc). There are some disabled child + sibling events- but I can't take ds2 to those as I can't manage the 3 kids.

We could try and arrange a day to take ds2 out (and have done) but my parents do so much anyway I don't like to ask for more. DS1 is in respite this Sunday so will take ds2 somewhere.

I always take my mum along to Mencap events, then one of us can bail out.

Provision down there isn't too great for this sort of problem.

So long as you can talk to ds2{as he grows} about the way family life is affected and be very open, he will have understanding of the way DS1 affects his life. There may be times when he resents it but all you can do is work together.
My older children have been very good although there have been times when they feel pushed aside for ds3. I do feel that they are more grown up than their peers though and they can spot sn a mile off.

When ds2 starts school he will hopefully get his own little social life.

My mum works full time- so no chance. However I spoke to the dp's person this morning- I have loads of money in the account, and no-one to spend it on. She's going to draw up an ad- asking for autism experience so we'll see....

Good luck, hope someone suitable comes along.

Rich in dp, poor in suitable help. Its a strange system.

I know- I can find people suitable, but very few people who want to be emloyed officially as they already have 1 job, so a 2nd job is emergency tax, or self employed.

Jimjams - your (relatively) flush dps account would seem to be where some of the solution should lie.

what's wrong with people taking a job on 'emergency tax' (I assume this means that the whole lot is taxed at 22%?). Can you push the most likely person a bit harder to take the job with your dp money? OR ... Davros mentioned in my thread that when her DP rate was increased she was allowed not to increase what she paid but to get more hours for her money. Could you do the opposite of this - to pay extra (to account for the perceived 'tax loss') and get fewer hours than you are really entitled to? Yup - it would be a bummer not getting all the hours you should, but at least you would get some that you don't sound as if you're getting at the moment.

[Figures - let's say you're DPs are at £7 ph (i didn't go and check the other thread). Taxed at 22% would give a take-home pay of £5.46. If you're earning £7 ph for a 40 hr week, you would pay approx 85% as tax (very rough figures), taking home approx £5.95ph. To take home £5.95ph on 22% tax-code, would require paying £7.62 per hour. You'd thus loose 10% of your hours, but you would get some! If you're saying that to get someone suitable you have to pay more than the DP rate, is there any way that SS can up your DP rate (or hours to account for this)?]

Alternatively (and / or as well) can you use the DPs to pay someone to help with DS2 - perhap you could ask a mum who is taking her own child to the same activity as DS would like to go to, to take your DS too. Could you then pay them less than the full DP amount, as they are minding DS2 as well as their own child, and therefore more a CM rate than the full amount? That might balance with the over-pay them suggestion above.

IIRC, you don't use anyone for DS2 or DS3 who you could pay with DPs thus releasing your 'own' money to pay for help with DS1 in cash?

Sorry, long wittering and probably unhelpful post, but I get cross for you whenever I read how hard you find it finding someone to pay with DPs cos they don't want (can't afford) to be 'properly' employed.

I did look into upping the rate when we had an ABA tutor - if we still had her I would partially pay her with it, or fiddle the hours- she came in on Saturdays and worked with ds1.

The most suitable person can't work for me because she is living on tax credits (student with kids) - we had an absolute nightmare in the summer sorting that out. There is one person doing an ABA programme in this city(!), I bumped into her recently and she is advertising for new employees so I will see if any of those want to do extra. We were lucky (very) with our last tutor that she was very experienced. We can't really afford to run a mini programme now and we definitely can't afford to take on a consultant, so unless I can find someone as experienced as the previous tutor that isn't really an option. TBH I don't really want anything other than structured play for him anyway as he gets worked hard at school and needs some down time (he reacts badly if he doesn't get it).

I do use my dp's to put ds3 in with a cm during holidays. I have asked today whether I can use them to pay for the extra nursery sessions I have to put ds2 in for. They are going to find out.

The problem really is that even with an extra bod we still couldn't do family trips out with all 3 children so extra dp's aren't really going to help that much- in that I don't want to shunt ds1 off all the time, but that decision means that ds2 (and eventuallly ds3) is going to miss out. I don't know how to balance the 2 of them tbh.

not sure if I have anything helpful to add but my ds1 is similar age to your ds2 and has never been to the cinema and only once to the theatre. he doesn't do much in the way of formal activities outside nursery either and goes swimming much less often than yours. he has however spent endless happy hours on the beach or wandering through the park and quite a lot of time socialising at other people's houses. I can see your problem of balance but I don't think you need to worry at this stage about enrolling ds2 into more 'activities'. School friendships I guess will be something you'll have to work at - but I am sure you will find people happy to invite ds2 round without feeling the need for reciprocation if they understand your situation. I would think that the main thing you might need to try and balance a little more in favour of ds2 and ds3 is the opportunity for free play outside. Obviously no easy way because you can't fulfill all their needs simultaneously, you'll just have to do your best at finding a fair balance.
Sorry if that;s hopelessly unhelpful. just didn't want you to think that the average 4 year old is off doing amazing exciting things every five minutes! Mine certainly isn't....

"he has however spent endless happy hours on the beach or wandering through the park and quite a lot of time socialising at other people's houses", but this is what ds2 hasn't done, the organised activities would be to make up for an inability to do this iyswim.

Still catching up! SC's idea of offering a higher rate for less hours is a good option if you can find someone suitable.
You know my situation, DS and DD are 7.5 years apart so they each get a lot of their own separate mummy and daddy time and, of course, there's only the two of them.
The only thing I would say is that, observing my NT niece who is now 9, she has such a social life based on her school friends and their families, she needs to take a break at home and do nothing sometimes! Judging from her life, I would say that school friendships for DS2 could provide a lot of support. My sister works p/t and if she's stuck her DD goes to a friend's and if she's got a club or activity that my sister can't take her to then one of the other mums will do it. The only thing, of course, is she can reciprocate but she hasn't got the ASD issue. I don't suppose that helps much. I just think that DS2 will develop some friendships and get to know his friend's families in time and that may help.

You're right Davros- ds2 seems to make friends fairly easily (as much as they do at 3), I think I'm just feeling the guilts..... He always seems to be told to wait, and in a minute etc. He absolutely adores ds3 and they play quite a bit together already so I suppose he'll have him if all continues well......

Well I think we are going to have to do something. Ds1 went to respite yesterday, he enjoyed himself, we took ds2 and ds3 out for a meal (and very relaxing it was too! relaxing!!!!!), then off to look at a huge garden centre, buy some wellies. look at the pets section.

Anyway dh told ds2 we were going out and he said "but it's the weekend, I never go out at the weekend" he's right to. Soooo I'm still investigating stagecoach, martial arts are another possibility (but I don't really think they're ds2's thing), what else runs on a Saturday (or Sunday, but preferably Sat for a 4 year old). Any ideas welcomed.

Jimjams - how about trampolining, football, swimming or gymnastics?
You could also try going to the saturday kids club cinema (if ds2 will sit) as it's only £2 and that includes adult entry.

Stagecoach apparently is very heavy going!

ds2 would sit- but we can't do cinema, swimming or anything that takes an adult as that would leave one person with ds1 and ds3 which is impossible. Whilst I want ds2 to go out, it is essential that ds1 goes out (otherwise his behaviour goes to pot) so that takes up one person.

DS2 is quite grown up for his age really- loves nursery etc (bit of a swot really), which is why I think he's be fine being left somewhere organised. Is stagecoach heavy going at 4? I thought the early years stuff would be OK.

Where do you find out about things like football? And could they be left at 4, or would a parent have to stay? I think he'd prefer singing really to football. Every time I've seen him have a go he stops after a little while as he gets very puffy- especially in winter (he's v slightly asthmatic)I had a look at woodcraft folk- nothing down this way.

Once he starts school things like football may be offered through school. There is an organisation called "Premier Soccer" that runs courses in and out of schools around the country, they might be doing something locally. Otherwise that sort of thing is usually advertised in local sports centres, libraries. Ds1 does dancing - I found out by looking up local dance schools in the telephone directory and ringing them up. Our local leisure centres run supervised arts and crafts sessions for kids aged 5 upwards in the holidays so once he gets to 5 you would be able to start leaving him at things. He will also get invited to other people's houses for tea and they will take him home with them straight after school and if you explain your situation I daresay they would bring him back also. I do think things will start to fall into place once your ds2 starts school, and although you feel guilty I think plenty of 4 year olds won't have sampled all the things you mention.

I feel for you more about not being able to go out. A day spent cooped up with my two drives me mad.....

Jimjams -a lot of the people taking their children to clubs and things at the weekend take younger siblings with them and just watch or sit in the waiting room with the younger one on their knee, or playing on the floor!

I don't think there are many clubs where you can leave them completely at 4 (i.e. must be on the premises) as they struggle to keep anything like the teacher/child ratio they would need to.

I would imagine stagecoach or some other drama club would be fine. There are quite a few children in my DD's ballet class (inlcuding boys) who do drama as well and they start from age 3.

I'm off to bed now - had too many late nights and they're catching up with me

Thanks- for the first time ever I'm worried about him (he's just breezed along beside us all really- very sunny which helps). I just think he misses out, he has such a small circle and just seems so - I don't know- cooped up is probably the best way of describing it- especially since ds3 was born (although they are starting to play together which will presumably increase).

So often I tell him I'll do something with him then ds1 kicks off, or ds3 needs a feed and a sleep and poor old ds2's time is forgotten. He's happy enough, but I asked him if he'd like to go to some sort of class and he said yes and jumped up and down.

Will look up gymtots - I think they do a trampolining type thing, although I have a feeling you have to stay. Gymnastics is another good idea (although the club I know is quite full on). Horse riding?? He's a bit of a wuss I think and I'm not sure he'd meet other children which I'd like.