Disturbing Disability Comment in The TImes Yesterday

[Davros]

Did anyone see an article yesterday in the Times called 'I Never Thought I'd Adopt'
www.timesonline.co.uk/printFriendly/0,,1-2966-877950,00.html

It contains a deeply disturbing and upsetting passage relating to autism. The arcitle is about a woman and the process of adopting a baby. At one point her Social Worker recommended she get more experience of childcare. She did some work in a nursery and said:

"This proved to be an invaluable experience. Not only did it teach me numerous ingenious means of keeping tiny minds and hands occupied, but I
discovered that of all the 35 or so children attending, only one seemed difficult to love - and he had some form of autism. "

If you want to complain to The Times, send an email to [email protected]

Of course everyone is entitled to an opinion, but freedom of speech only works when it is not going to offend , and this clearly did.The Times should have had the wisdom and the experience to edit her comment out. Had the word "autistic" been "black" or "Muslim" for example they wouldn't have dreamed of putting it in.

Jimjams, what a lovely picture!

I've been away for most of the afternoon and so have missed a lot of these comments. I'm all for free speech but surely this newspaper should have known where to draw the line. Reading that quote again has made me just as angry as when I first read it this morning. If anyone has the technical know-how they should send this thread to The Times. Maybe they will realise just how ignorant they have been. BTW Jimjams, your little boy is soooooo GORGEOUS! No wonder the girls are already fighting over him.

have had a very very stressful week and about to hit someone so have not read the whole article but simply wanted to respond to comments made here..... yes we have the right to freedom of speech BUT

that carries a huge responsibility to use it wisely. I totally agree that it seems okay to make sweeping and hurtful statements about a number of conditions in the Media YET if it is rascist or discriminatory towards people such as homosexuals - There is uproar.

By all means - have your right but use it wisely

for mums like jimjams and Davros - i am sorry that someone has been so offensive about your children

Jimjams - he is soooooo cute - only thing brought a smile to my face today......

not had time to read the posts but have read the article. my first response is that she is a selfish cow... I mean it is OK to adopt but as long as the child isn't too disabled?! ARggh!!

Can I be completely honest? Before I discovered Mumsnet I would have read that without a second thought. I would have registered - autistic = cold, unloving, unable to empathise etc and moved on. I literally had no idea that children with autism could be affectionate or kind or loving. No idea. Call me stupid, crass, whatever - I just didn't know any autistic children (that I knew of) and in the absence of any other information, I believed the stereotype. I remember the first time I read Jimjams talking about her son (who is a beautiful boy BTW) I was amazed - an autistic child who cuddled and was loving? How could that be? Most people DON'T know. They just don't. They don't mean to be cruel 99% of the time, it's just what they think of as the truth. I told someone else today that I sat with a group of very intelligent, educated, genuinely nice women in their 30s who sat there saying that people with Downs only lived until 'about 35' and that they were 'very sweet and placid'. They had no idea at all that these comments would be seen as unthinking or insulting to the parent of a child with Down Syndrome. To them it was like saying, the Eiffel Tower is in Paris - a statement of fact. Indeed the comments about being 'placid' were, I believe, thought of as quite complimentary. I know this is hard for people to read, but it's the truth out there. And I for one (and I know it's not just for one) feel very grateful that I have learned more from this website. I just kept correcting them and I knew they were amazed with what I told them. Sometimes it's hard not to be 'ignorant' if you never hear any different.

But I also have to say, nobody knows how loveable children (all children) really are until they have one of their own to love, IMO.

Just resurfacing after taking my son swimming and then fireworks at home. I wish I could film him tonight and attach it to this thread, he has thoroughly enjoyed himself and expressed it very much by smiles, hugs, interaction - all just for the sake of sharing his feelings with me, we've had a great evening.
I'm happy to try to send a link to this discussion to The Times if I can do it but I'm out all day tomorrow so, unless someone else does it before then, I'll try tomorrow evening.

sounds lovely davros...... Wish I could see it as well.

I had a very old film developed today. It has some piccies of ds1 with a friend of his standing by our front door- taken about a year ago. DH looked at them and said "funny autism isn't it- you'd never guess which one was autistic". Looking at the photos you would probably guess that ds1 was the NT one. Just becuase in this particular photo his friend is hanging back looking a bit serious and ds1 is kind of leaning forwards into the camera laughing. I forgot to show ds1 the photo- I will tomorrow. Even though he hasn't seen him for over a year he still says his name and smiles as soon as he sees his photo (he still says his friend's mother's name when he hears her on the phone as well).

Ouch, ouch, ouch. What a busy thread, and I have little to add except to agree with the general thrust that this is a crass thing to think or say, and should not have been published. We all know there are people like that woman out there, and a lot of ignorance and misconceptions about SN, but don't wish to be reminded
Jimjams - what a fantastic photo of a gorgeous little boy

Oh dear agree with most people that the article should have been edited properly, but also agree with aloha that most people 'don't' understand certain conditions - especially autism. I hear comments in this by my own own family- my MIL for instance always uses 'mongol' and 'backwards' and it makes my skin creep, but apart from trying to explain to these people that it is not pc and trying to explain about autism etc than we get nowhere, not saying we have to explain either. I am not suprised it has offended sn mothers on here, thats why I haven't read it.

jimjams - photo was lovely, my ds started giggling away when he saw it

I can absolutely understand how hurtful this aside is - I really can and I hope I didn't come across as insensitive. I would suggest that the people who edited the copy are only like the rest of the general public with no particular interest in SN and won't understand why it was offensive unless they are told. I strongly suggest that someone like Davros, who is informed and justifiably angry actually take this up with the reader's editor at the Times, and not just the letters page. I am pretty sure the Times should have one - readers' editors are responsible for making corrections and also for helping to form editorial policy so it hopefully won't happen again. I am a journalist but I have also complained to newspapers when they have printed wrong information in areas where I do know my stuff - such as when the Observer printed a story saying that 90per cent of 40 year olds were infertile, which is just rubbish. I got a correction printed and my information was passed on to the relevant department. I this case, I would expect the writer to be much more sensitive and informed, particularly as she was preparing for adoption and working with children with sn. However, I wouldn't expect a general features editor to notice how insensitive this comment was as they are likely to be have no more knowledge of autism than anyone else in the general public an I think we all know that there is massive ignorance of disability issues out there (I've admitted to being very ill-informed myself). That's why it is important to complain and correct - that way there's a chance that the editorial team will be more sensitive next time and likely to spot a comment that would offend or upset others.

eidsvold, I saw you other thread and was so sorry and cross on your behalf. I think educating schoolchildren about other children with sn is so important and I hope you did really 'teach them a lesson they will never forget' the other day.

someones letter is printed in the times today tho

Thanks for that coddy.

Interestingly people on one my autism lists weren't that bothered by her comments in general (although a couple were disturbed and horrified), as they thought that the woman was so ghastly - in that she seemed more interested in what a child could offer to her, rather than what she could offer a child- that she shouldn't really be taken seriously. I have more problems with the ignorance of the comment really. But as Aloha says I suppose we shouldn't really be surprised- I come across ignorance every time we go out.

Anyway my little auti ds1 has a horrible virus (v high temp) and is all glassy eyed today- all he wants is to be cuddled (wow autistic child wants cuddling- inform the Times- or at least the woman in the article)- so I'm away back to him.

It's a good letter, well spotted coddy. Here it is:

From Miss Margaret Collins

Sir, I was saddened to read the article by Jane Cambridge (T2, November 3). Hoping to adopt, she took a temporary job in a day nursery to see how she reacted to the company of young children but ?discovered that of all the 35 or so children attending, only one seemed difficult to love ? and he had some form of autism?. Does she consider this attitude acceptable? Autistic children are most in need of our love and care. While parents love and struggle to care for their autistic child, it often happens that family and friends hold back, or withdraw altogether, rather than maintaining much-needed friendship and offering support.
Yours faithfully,
M. M. COLLINS,
22 St Philip?s Road,
Cambridge CB1 3AQ.
[email protected]
November 3.

If that woman had sutituted the word black or a boy or spastic etc would anyone be saying that she had a point? No, I don't think so!!!
Discrimination should Never be tolerated, and that is precisely what she displayed with her throwaway comment.

Jj we had that virus - they seem to get better then get worse... sorry

Ill raise a glass of calpol to you

cheers coddy- I think he did the getting better bit and we're back into the worse- has now thrown up everywhere (because of temp I think rather than anything else). Poor little thing. Still wants his cuddles though (Times take note)

Aagh! I've got to do something about contacting the Times with all or some of our comments and I should try to do a decent job of it as aloha describes. I've had SO much trouble with the internet this week, Blueyonder has been on and off and completely unreliable, plus I've got the lurgy too and have completely lost my voice. With the internet down and no voice I've had to rely on text messages! I'll try to do something on Monday but it may just be getting too late, anyone else able to do something quickly?

Come to this thread a bit late really but just wanted to add that my dh did in the past find our ds difficult, don't know if it was strong enough to say difficult to love but ds was quite cold with him for a period. dh would come in from work and ds would hardly even glance at him. dh found this very hurtful. However this was before his diagnosis. things are a lot easier now and I think a lot of it was a two-way thing, ds feeding off dh's negativity and vice versa.

Anyway its been a few days since I rea dthe article but thinking back the comment just seemed so unnecessary. I don't actually care whether she found the child loveable or not because I don't think her view is particularly important. But why have that remark at all? It just didn't add anything to the piece - its not as if she went onto adopt an autistic child in the end.

A lot of this got me thinking about what it is to be loveable. Is it to do with reciprocation? Is this why we find autism hard because they appear not to want to please others and are self-centred and rigid in their ways, and who may not smile much... all these things that make people 'loveable/attractive'??

I can't help returning to the view though that this woman must have been a rather shallow - I mean she obviously knew the child was autistic but was focusing on the 'loveability' factor and not really looking at the child underneath... this is why fundamentally the comment never should have been put in because it was a remark made by an ignorant person breeding more ignorance for the readers of the article.

jimjams - lovely photo. Hope he gets better soon.

I don't know Eulalia- the thing is that's not really been my experience of autism-ds1 has always had huge problems communicating and gets his knickers well and truly in a twist if something happens when he's expected something else (although he's fine with last minute changes if he understands that a change is being made) but he has always been reciprocal and smiley and all the other things autistic children are meant to do. I would actually say he's a lot less self centred than hi 2 year old NT brother (athough that may well change as they grow- all 2 year olds are self centred I guess). I agree the comment was unnecessary- I think it's similar to the comments mentioned earlier by Davros about children with DS being "sweet and affectionate". It's just stereotyping, and not recognising that all children are individuals (some more difficult than others certainly, but I'm not sure some are more loveable than others).

I think we ought to show this thread to some professionals as well- I lost count of the number of times we were told that ds1 couldn't possibly be autistic because he was "too tuned in", "too friendly" "eye contact was too good", "too affectionate", "too loving", "too interested". This probably explains why it toook us a year and half from raising concerns to diagnosis. The person who eventually recognised the autism and forwarded us for diagnosis wasn't even an autism specialist (she was an ENT surgeon and specialist in verbal dyspraxia). She said she was horrified that we had been missed on so many occasions by so many different people. This was 2 weeks after ds2's birth and I was a wreck! It would have been easier to deal with when I first took him along and asked whether he was autistic. As Davros says I think they're all big wimps.

Maybe too many pros read ignorant comments like this?

Davros I'm happy to send a link to this thread to the times (who to though? the letters page?) I don't think I'll be able to string together much more though- we have the lurgy here as well. DS1 has just started his second day on the sofa and I feel as if my head is about to explode!

jimjams - this just goes to show how different autism is in different people. My ds also has good eye contact when he wants to make it. He can still at times totally ignore me when I am talking to him. The thing is he is extremely affectionate at times - loves cuddles and will smile spontaneously. Other times it depends largely on how he is approached. My mother is a good example - she expects grandchild to dutifully come in and give her a kiss. ds doesn't do things on command or necessarily at a set time (hence the disappointment when dh arrived home from work (ds probably didn't even realise that he had just arrived)). If left alone ds will give a kiss maybe a minute or two later when he has thought about it or feels ready - however during this interval my mum probably would have huffed or made a negative remark such as "what a strange child -you are so unaffectionate". ds would have picked up on this and have retreated further from her. Thus over time a negative relationship builds up ... this is what has happened although it is getting better now that my mum is understanding him and autism better. My dad on the other hand leaves him alone and ds goes up and gives him cuddles and climbs on his lap unasked.

I think many autistic children pick up on these seemingly minor points, ie tone/volume of voice, touch, timing of approach, direction of approach and so on and get confused by it. Some people think that because they don't understand semantic & pragmatic language that it is unimportant to the child or that they don't even notice it (eg seeming 'deaf' at times) but the point is that they do notice it too much. They are hypersentitive to these things and may ignore you because they are trying to tune out the different stimuli or just shutting it out totally.

Sorry I know you know this already just commenting in case this thread does get sent onto the Times.

The woman in the article was looking at the autistic child totally on her own terms of being loveable and because she probably knew nothing about the condition didn't know how to 'win him round'... OK this is not necessarily her 'fault' but this throwaway remark was so damaging to the image of the autistic child.

I know that to others ds can look dreadful at times if in whiney mode or having a tantrum...but on other occasions he looks delightful.. He has rather an old fashioned air about him showing pleasure at the tiniest little things. Just yesterday he was urging me to look at the flowers in the supermarket and was getting smiles from the other customers

good points Eulalia. I suspect you're right about the woman in the article- and then when she found out that he was autistic rather than thinking "oh I needed to interact in a different way" she'll have thought "oh that explains it- autistic children are cold, difficult and unreachable".

Just taken ds1 to the out of hours dr (waste of time- but we were told to go by dr we rang for advice) and my god I spotted another autistic child. I'm 100% certain he was (as was dh). How many are there now? It's ridiculous. He was affectionate though