ABA Meeting - Tips please!

[DietcokeGirl]

Morning all

Hope you not getting bored of the ABA threads as here is another one!

I am going along to an ABA meeting this week. I am not sure if it is right for us but I am going see if we can incorporate it into our lives. DS1 is now 3.9 and whilst I would not say he has 'behavioural problems' it is getting increasingly difficult to get him to do something he doesn't want to do. I also want somebody to assess him properly and help me understand his issues, eg is it sensory, is it about control, is it fear, and so on. Knowing he has an 'autistic spectrum condition' is not enough, I need to better understand how the autism is affecting him, as an individual. Does that make sense?

Have been doing PECs for over a year now and yes he can communicate his needs better but it has not improved his speech. He goes through phases of saying a few words, making animal noises etc but never consistent and he isn't using PECs when he does this. His receptive language is quite good. I suppose I don't know whether I need ABA or private speech therapy or both?!

So, any tips on what I should be looking for, what to ask, fees etc? Star, Silver.. throw them at me!

Has anybody used AP UK?

TIA

It certainly seems that a few of us are curious about ABA at the moment.
I am hoping to get some more info on it this week from an ABA specialist so will feedback.

Ask if you can observe a programme. Make sure there is no tie-in contract. Ask to see their BCAB qualifications (not always essential but make sure you have a good reason why they don't have them).

Seek out how flexible they are willing to be. Can you do a budget version? Can you use your own tutors/family etc. (Even if you aren't intending to, it is worth asking to see how rigid or adaptable they can be. If they can't do it for you, then how are they going to work with the individual needs of your child?)

Ask them about their flexibility around hours. Are they asking you to commit to 40 hours a week or can they be flexible?

Ask for them to explain how much it is likely to set you back over 6 months/a year in TOTAL to go with their programme, and ask what the options there are to reduce the cost perhaps or increase the effectiveness.

Ask them about their own internal monitoring. Who is going to review your ds' programme with some independence, or will the same consultant that writes it, monitor it?

Ask where the resources will come from? Do they provide them, do you have to buy or make them?

Ask them what happens if a suggestion is made on the programme that you disagree with? Do they work around it, cease the programme, or insist that you have to do things their way with threats of your child suffering as a consequence?

Thanks that is really helpful.
I definitely don't want 40 hours a week. It wouldn't work for us. DS1 is starting school in Sept (unless we delayed it) so they would need to be flexible.
I am not one for the 'punishment' type approach. I am not sure if this is normal practice? Is this the type of approach that I may disagree with/they may insist upon. Sorry if I am on the wrong track - just picking up on other threads and this has been mentioned.
We got a letter today saying DS1 has got the school we applied for so that's one good step foward!

No, ABA does not and should not include punishments.

I suppose the issues you might have are which skill to teach first. Do you want to focus on learning the alphabet or drinking out of a cup properly?

If you don't understand the reason for teaching a skill (i.e. is a prerequisit for another skill, does it have to be targetted first for a reason) then you need to be satisfied that your questions are answered properly and that you agree with it.

Great thread, will be spending a lot of time looking into ABA once I break up from work this week. DietcokeGirl-how did you go about finding an ABA tutor? What is AP UK?

dietstartstmoz - not so sure about how to go about it myself really. I am nervous about it as sounds as though some services better than others (as always the case). It is just something I am looking into to see if it can be of benefit to DS1 (ASC, 3.9) and us. How old is your DC?

AP = Autism Partnership UK. I live up North and the head office is up here. I believe they deliver in other areas though.

Has anybody here used their services?

Yes I use AP in Leeds you can PM me if you want. We have people watch DS sessions from time to time and most parents are happy for new parents to sit in. It helped us decide. We don't use any punishments except DS loses tokens on a board for aggressive behaviour. He also wins tokens for good behaviour. If he keeps all his tokens he gets the top prize - if he loses 1 a lesser reward etc. So its not that different than other children at school on behaviour plans.

Thanks for the valuable information.

Will let you know if we decide to go with it. I need to put all this to DH yet!

This person was invaluable to us when we were starting out lost and confused, for affordability and also general guidance.

Ditto all the above, plus I would say that a good rapport with your dc and the tutors is essential. The first month at least will be spent with the tutor pairing with your ds, which means they will be absolutely brilliant fun with him, play with him, doing what he wants, and generally making themselves at his disposal. The idea is that when it comes to the real work, he will be motivated and willing to do it, as they have 'paired' themselves with so much fun their attention is a reinforcer in itself. (A reinforcer is whatever is used as the 'reward' after a task is completed.)

If that basic rapport isn't there, imo the pairing will never be strong enough, and the tutor will have to work really, really hard to get instructional control (ie complying with requests), and to teach skills. And if the tutor is not very experienced, it will make it even harder - even impossible. We have just had to let a tutor go as the pairing, and the bond he had with ds, just wasn't strong enough, and ds just wasn't bothered about working as he didn't have the desire to please him or even really be with him.

Also essential is reliability. And energy! It can be a physical job (particularly with a 3yo boy!).

This might be a different viewpoint from others here, but I also think to be a great tutor, you need a genuine understanding of psychology - whether you have a psych degree or not (though preferable to have one). ABA is all about understanding the function of a child's behaviour, and without this, the teaching just will not be effective. It's not enough just to be fun - you need to think on the spot all the time about why the child has done/said something in order to know how to deal with it.

Look into difference between ABA and VB (Verbal Behaviour - essentially the same as ABA but with more emphasis on language, and learning in the natural environment rather than Discrete Training Trials).

I would think that an ABA/VB programme would cover work of SALT - wouldn't do any harm to get an assessment by SALT but the ongoing work could be done by your tutors.

Would recommend Robert Schram 'Educate Towards Recovery' about VB.

I think people like to distance themselves from Lovaas because they can suggest that their programme has developed and doesn't use adversives like Lovaas did originally.

The thing is Lovaas was a scientist. He moved away from adversives himself because he took data and found that it wasn't as effective as rewards

Skinner had done that years earlier.....

Good threads on ABA at the moment, will look into all these threads later this week. Dietcoke- our DS is a very lively 3.8 and will also be starting school in sept and I am worried, although the alternative is another yr at private nursery on the days I work. DS's future school (older DS goes there) appear to be very approachable, we have already have one meeting and they have discussed whatever PT hours we would want DS to do (everone else is FT from day1), and we are at the start of the stat assess process to hopefully get a statement. DS was DX 5 weeks ago. What about your DS?

dietstartstmoz - my DS is 3.9 and got diagnosis just before he was 3.
We have been getting some support from autism outreach and he goes to nursery 3 sessions per week. He gets 1:1 for most of his time at nursery and that is really going well. He has made a lot of progress apart from speech tho his communication skills have really improved.

Yep I am worried about DS1 starting school. I know he will manage it with 1:1 but I don't know how much he will 'learn'.

smallwhitecat yes of course, that is true - DTTs are used in VB, there is a huge overlap and VB is ABA! Just wanted to point out to the OP that there are the two strands of ABA, and as far as I understand it, VB tends (on the whole) to be less table-top based.

Hiya,
ive been doing ABA VB for a year now, and can honestly say its the best move i ever made!!
it is costly and very tireing but ive seen huge progress in my kids (have two with Autism)
i did the son-rise program before that, but find ABA much better.

I have a meeting with an ABA Consultant in a couple of weeks.

DS1 is due to start school in Sept but they are flexible about part-time attendance, delayed start etc, which is great. I am worried about starting school and ABA around the same time as two massive changes for DS1 (and me!).

Anybody been in a similar situation? What did you do?

I am wondering whether to do part-time nursery and part-time ABA for six months with a view to starting school in Jan (and hopefully continuing ABA).

Dietcokegirl I would say a lot depends on what the biggest difficulties are for ds, and what you need to prioritise.

Eg if his biggest problem is with social interaction, the more time he spends with other children (and his age-appropriate peers) the better. But if there are bigger problems to address first (eg behavioural issues, tantrums, language), then a larger proportion of home-based tutoring would be advisable.

But either way, however long he spends at school or nursery, he should absolutely be shadowed by one of your tutors there. Have you arranged this with his current nursery and school?

As for whether he starts school in Sep or Jan, I would keep both options open for a while longer - until you start the programme and see progress you can't really tell. Your programme provider/consultant should also advise you on this.

Btw I would def try to get the ABA programme started well before he starts school. So don't worry about the two big changes happening at the same time. Also, starting ABA is nothing but amazing for him - no trauma to worry about there, he will love it. It is a team of fun people who play with him and devote all their attention to him - what's not to love about that?! The only thing I would say is that you should get the programme running well before school if he is going to have a shadow at school with him, as it will take a while for him to 'pair' with the tutors (ie come to adore them so much he'll do anything for them).

Good for you for taking this step - ABA is a commitment but honestly you will not regret it. It was the best thing I could ever have done for my ds

Dietcoke girl - I did part time ABA and part time mainstream school (with ABA LSA, that was important) for years, it was absolutely great. It gave my son the ABA teaching, but also exposure to the world of mainstream kids, so he is not phased to this day by noise, chaos etc, and he knows about sitting down for register, how to not bump into other kids, tiny little bits of socialising (eg tutors would get him playing What's the time Mr wolf or the hokey cokey in the playground). If you have found a school which will allow him to be flexible, you've found a godsend! And don't worry about starting both at once - ABA isn't, despite the name, some scary scientific thing, it will really just be about learning through play at first and he will not even know that he is learning half the time.

Thanks, bailey & sosce I was being a bit dim and forgot about doing ABA in school too. Now, we are going thru statement so he should (?!) get some support. Should I be asking if ABA can train the LSA then? Is that how you did it? I haven't spoken directly to the school about flexible start (autism outreach did this for me) but they said no problems with it. We are lucky that our local school has a really good reputation for supporting children on the autistic spectrum and has some experienced (and qualified!) staff.

The more I hear the more I think it is the right thing to do for DS1.

If the school will let you get the LSA they choose trained by the ABAers, that would be great. You have to play it carefully, as they usually don't like any suggestion that the LSA needs anything other than the school's own training (which is non-existent, so it's v odd of them!). But if you can do it tactfully and just say you'd like the LSA to observe ABA and use some of the techniques, so that DS doesn't get a different experience at home/school, that might work well. The other really good option is if you put forward an ABA tutor who also wants work as a school LSA, adding to their CV and your DS's consistency across home/school. If you get either of these, it's a very forward-thinking and excellent school, but you have to give them face - ie make sure you are very clear that the LSA, wherever they come via, is the school's member of staff and reports to them, not the ABAers. Sometimes this is where things go wrong, as the ABAers can be as dismissive of school staff as vice versa. It is a bit like walking a tightrope, but it is all in a good cause!