Section 47 inquiry of Child protection Act

[kakool]

Hi everyone,
I need your advice on above matter.

I have a 14 years old autistic daughter with very violent behaviour.

i have been going through very difficult times with her for many years.

She started to hit and hurt the people over 3 years ago.i was also hit many times in past. i have a report where her doctor witnessed her hitting me while we were there.

The previous school excluded her permanently when many of the staff members were hit by her and taken to accedent and emergency.
I requsted social services in past to give me some respite, i was offered only 9 hrs but later i was told they can't find a suitable staff to take her out.
after one and half years i asked them to close her file.
they however mentioned in her core assessment the violent behaviour and hurting me and other people.

on the basis of all these reports she was givin a boarding school with monday to friday last year in september.

she is much better in her current school but became very violent at home and started to hit her two baby brothers age 2 and 1.

she runs after the babies and creams sky high, shouts, kicks on furniture, they are very scared.my 2 yrs old son nearly lost his eye 2 weeks ago when she pushed him on a glass table.She creams baby go away, she also has made no go areas in the house where they can't entre.it has become impossible to keep them apart.the situation is very very dangerous.

i contacted the LEA to provide her a school with full time boarding ficility.

i was told that LEA will continue giving her same school and i should seek help from Social services regarding rest of problems with my daughter.

I called SS to do an assessment, give her a school with 52 weeks boarding and arrange somewhere where she could stay as it has become impossible to keep her at home due to very aggressive and dangerous behavior towards babies.
I was told by Social worker they can't take or arrage anywhere to take her, there is no such thing we do to take children from their parents home. when i told them about the risks to babies lives, social worker said" even normal children hit other children".
i was shocked as the kids are too small, she is not normal child and and hitting is not normal.
I was very emotional and said" if you do not help me and provide her accomodation, i am going to abondon her and leave the country with my 2 babies to save them from their sister.I was never serious and only wanted them to arrange somewherefor her to stay.

the social worker left and later phoned me,I have started section 47 inquiry of child protection act against you as you said you were going to leave your daughter behind and fly away from the country, she also said she will involve, professionals, her teacher and police.

I have been ttold about section 20 of the child act 1989 where if you can't cope with a child you can volentarily give them to authority.
in this case rather than providing me any help and assesstant i am being prosecuted.
i have not commited any crime but being punished only why i asked SS to help me out with my violent child.

Ok.. i need to know what should i do in this situation, what would be the outcome of this section 47 inquiry?
will appreciate your kind advice

you shoudl go and take someone for support. Its hard going but basicly the SW will have done a report and this should be shared with you before hand. The other proffessional wil have done reports aswell and they will go round and ask for feedback from everyone. You will be given time to talk. Try and stay calm and dont shout.

Please could you answer my earlier questions?

current boarding school does not have weekend and holidays respite, its only week days.

i found 2 schools under cambian group who are willing to take my daughter for 52 weeks but ss does not want to pay for it.

my husband works on saturdays and i am all alone with my daughter and two babies.
today she was too violent and i called the police, they noted it and said will tell social services about it.however they said it does not come under domestic violence.

thanks for the advice

Hello Kakool - a child protection conference (which is what I am assuming they mean when you say "child protection meeting") is basically lots of people and you sitting round a table to look at the issues within the family. Certainly from what you say it sounds like the other children are at risk from your DD and your DD is at risk of the effects of being in full time care for 52 weeks a year. The people attending will be you, social worker, possibly a representative from the police, a health visitor and school nurse for your DD and other children, representatives from schools or nurseries (or reports from each) as well as an Independant Chairperson. The Chair will not know your case so will rely on what he/she hears with regard to decision making.
The possiblity is that they are looking at a child protection plan because your daughter is at risk of harming the other children - this could well work in your favour as if they identify the babies as being at risk they have to make a plan to deal with this. Removing the babies would not be an option because your DD is at school for the majority of the time. They will look at minimising the risk when your DD has contact with them and help you to find ways of keeping everyone safe.
They may also do a plan for your daughter to look at her needs in all this. Please don't feel threatened by all this because from what you've posted it sounds like you badly need the support. A child protection plan for all the children wouldn't be a reflection on you or your parenting but a recognition of the challenges you are facing as a family and how best those challenges can be met.

Am not a social worker but am a health visitor so occasionally sit in on these meetings. Take someone with you as well if you want and need to - you can bring your solicitor if you want to - nobody will be fazed oer mind and she can concentrate on the details while you deal with the emotional stuff.

Hope it works out well for all of you and this is the start of positive support.

tbh i dont know if it would work in your favour as SS are not likely to pay more money for a 52 week boarding school but more liekly to suggest you voluteer to put her into fostecare (section 20) which is cheaper for them in most cases. I would guess they would keep her in boarding school 5 days a week
Would that be something you would consider?
Did they say of the meeting was for all children? If so they will also invite all proffessionals involved with the younger children too.

actually I dont wish to be unhelpful or upsetting, but i think you need to know more from ss about what is going on, because from what you have told us the purpose of the meeting will not be to discuss the welfare of your babies with regard to dd1, nor the welfare of dd1 with regard to 52 week care, but to assess the welfare of all your children with regard to YOUR care of them. please make sure you know what the meeting is about so you have plenty of time to plan.

I did say that earlier in post, they will want to know why you cant protect the younger ones tbh. Clearly school are doing ok because you said she is only aggressive at home now, so they will ask.
It is about you, and knowing ss as i do, they will not fund 52 weeks boarding school when foster care is cheaper.

Actually Lisa - I agree with the issue around funding 52 weeks school placement a year. The liklihood is that agreeing to foster care would be cheaper and I suppose it will be an issue that kakool may need to make a decision about

It would be better if they could support her in a different way. On the other hand a foster placement has to be preferable to 52 weeks of what is basically an institutional system - even one as nice as boarding schools are now.

In the meantime they are all at risk including the OP and her DD and that needs discussion to see where they go from here - it might well work in your favour OP but perhaps you need to go with definite ideas in mind about how you want THEM to support YOU. I have seen SS bend over backwards for families over the years (and also seen them not bother too). Certainly if you make enough noise they will listen - doesn't always mean you will get what you want. Problem is that SWs themselves don't have the funding - they have to make a case for it to the powers that be and with experience they learn what to ask for and what not to bother with because it will be refused.

Thing is kakool - what do YOU want from the authorities in the way of support? Can you write this down and take it with you to this meeting and get feedback with regard to that? Definitely take somebody with you.

hi
sw said the meeting is for aal children.
she said its about risk of my daughter being abondoned and being ignored and the safety of the babies.

i told her i am going to visit 2 schools next weak which are 52 weak boarding schools.she mentioned section 20 as well.
she said we are looking for an alternitive school but will need to speak to current boarding school first.
i said i don't mind if you have a school in your mind,i will take it.

actually my first choice is a 52 weaks boarding school but as this is not they may give her, my last option will be section 20 as at present i am going through hardest times of my life.
do you think if they they apply section 20, can i later take them to tribunal for a 52 weaks boarding school?

ok they dont have to go to court for section 20 but be aware if you then pull out of it and they feel your daughter is at risk, they will apply for her to be kept in LA care.

They cant stop you looking at schools. Im pretty sure you cant take them to tribunal to fund a boarding school that is down to the education dept.

Can I just ask, why you would prefer a 52 week board rather than the family environment? My girls both are affected by Autism, so i know its hard work. BUT if I couldnt care for them i would want them with a family they can form a strong bond with and someone who can help with the social skills they struggle with.

Why does she think your daughter is being ignored? Did she say that the new school they were looking into was a boarding school?

That poor girl. Admit it, you just want rid of her, you don't care where she goes do you ?

You want her out of your hair and away from your precious babies,you haven't even tried to accomodate her, I hope ss move that chid as far away from you as possible to a family who at least WANT her. How do you sleep at night exactly ?

Okay well putting the cat amongst the pigeons, I am a social worker and have been watching this thread with great interest.

Children Services can only take a case to a child protection conference if there is concerns that your child/ren is at risk of significant risk of harm and is under 4 different categories, physical, emotional, sexual and neglect.

From reading your original post and your subsequent post I would say they are looking at emotional and neglect. They do not have to take it to conference for a section 20, and in reality if your daughter is settled in her current school and it does not offer a 52 week placement, I would carefully consider the impact upon her in terms of inconsistency in placement and changing schools just to accomodate a 52 week placement.

Due to her level of needs I would presume that it would be an independent foster placement which could cost the LA around 2-4000 pounds a week. I would also want to examine your level of attachment to you DD and whether it is her needs or yours that you are trying to meet by placing her in residential school for 52 weeks, regardless of her needs she still needs her mother and frequent contact with her siblings. Social Services will and can provide you with support during the holidays so that her needs can be met and yours and the other siblings within the confines of the home enviroment, but it sounds to me like your not up for that at all.

Please dont think I am getting at you, I have a son that has complex needs and I am fighting for 38 week residential, but that is only because LA schools cant meet his needs. So I do understand the hard work and strains that a child with complex needs places on a family.

Oh and the social worker must share the report with you prior to the initial child protection conference and certainly to gain your views also and record them.

MrsCrumble your comments are not helpful. Have you actually read the OP and rest of the thread. This is a family who are going through hell.

wondering if they will place little ones order physically too? :(
tbh without wanting to be unkind, i would suggest she was looking at thelittle ones needs and her own needs above that of her older daugther.

I would certainly go into the meeting with idea on how to support you having your daughter home, and this does not include sending her off to boarding school. They will want to see that you want her, because to be honest from your posts its quite hard to see that.
If you truely dont think you can have her home at all, just say it. Better for her to be in a place she is wanted than be somewhere she is not wanted because of her behaviour.

And MrsCrumble your comments are not helpful at all but can understand why you would say that tbh.

op i sobviously at the end of her tether and this must have been going on for ages - i am sure that right now she most probably doesnt want her eldest dd around - please dont judge!

the difficulty is that having expressed that to the sw, they are calling a conference NOT just about the older dd and her impact on babies, but about the mother and her possible neglect of older dd AND babies.

... and this is why it needs to go to a CP conference. I just hope the right solution can be found to help everyone and the OP does not feel increasingly persecuted when she is already struggling.

'So I do understand the hard work and strains that a child with complex needs places on a family'

This is a challenging thread for many of us, because we find it hard to comprehend why the OP seems to be so desperate to have her child place away from her and it is possible to read it as both inhumane and a cop out.

But the reality is that some people just cannot do it, and the reality is that the number of people who can't will increase in this climate.

This does not mean that the OP is less of a human/mother etc. and I pity the poor girl who is 'put up with' and 'resented' for just being who she is.

It sounds as if Saturdays when your husband is working and you are alone with all 3 children is the real crisis time for you. Am I right?

In which case would an extra adult in the home make all the difference? There are lots of adult mental health & special needs support workers, (so trained in restraint, sympathetic to your plight etc) around. Could you hire someone like this one day week to be in the home with you?

Or alternatively could you hire a childminder or mother's help that day wach week to be in charge of the babies care (feeds, changing etc) so that YOU can focus on giving your daughter some love and attention? The childminder is my preference as your babies get your attention the rest of the week and you'd still be around if needed for them. However I don't know if you can restrain your eldest alone.

In your shoes the extra adult in my home for that day my partner isn't around to help is what I'd be begging them for! That way the eldest would get some "Mum" time with you - which no matter her disability she needs to be emotionally healthy. She may even be acting up because she misses you. The babies are also safe. Win, win and SO much cheaper than the other suggestions I've seen on this thread.

At this stage of the game I'd be begging for the solution I've suggested above.

I have to say why can't your DP sort out his work so that he IS around to help you at weekends? This is really serious and I don't feel he's taking sufficient notice of your issues. I do understand the issues it causes - I'm a lone parent myself currently unable to work cos of my kid but such are the sacrifices we make make.

Well, I think the main thing is to get the SW to share their report with you as far in advance of this meeting as possible so you have time to plan what you want to say. Their assessments are bound to be subjective - not their fault, this sort of situation can be read in so many ways - and there's no point wasting emotional energy now trying to guess what their angle is going to be.

It strikes me that Social Services are (as is so often the case due to their budget constraints) taking the short-term view here and this meeting is your opportunity to push them to think more long-term. Where do they see your daughter ideally living in 5 years time? In 20 years time? Surely the best (and cheapest, incidentally) solution is for her to be at home for as much as possible of her childhood and then independent or supported living as an adult? This is simply NOT possible while her only way of responding to frustrations is violence, and as you have clearly not been able to help her find another way this is only going to get worse while she is at home. She needs to learn other outlets and ways of handling things and if the best way to do that is a 24 hour curriculum in residential then that is both a care need and an educational need for her (never mind the rest of the family) and should be set against the shorter-term displacement issues. I don't think you are saying: "I want her in residential care for good", I think you are saying "I want her in residential care until they can teach her not to beat her siblings up."

Now, I'm sure that the SWs will come up with other suggestions as to how this could be done, and I'm sure they will be largely budget-driven as a residential placement will be hugely expensive. And possibly the compromise outcome from this meeting would be that they will put whatever extra support they think will work in place, with the proviso that if it doesn't work then in 3 months or whatever they will revisit the residential option. If this compromise is offered I would go with it. a) it establishes, on file, that the primary problem is managing your daughter's behaviour, not your care of her & b) this is (at least local to me) the way Social Services works - they can't get budget for the expensive option till the cheap option has been tried and failed.

Re: whose needs are coming first here - I think the issue is that these are needs of different sizes. If the sibs are at genuine risk of serious physical harm, potentially loss of life, that has to be a bigger problem than the risk of distress to the eldest from disruption/separation. To say that the OP is doing something wrong by prioritising keeping the youngest two alive is beyond daft imo.

hi
i thank all of you taking time out to leave comments and advice.i really appreciate it, they are very useful.
i also thank MrsCrumble for her comments, thats what she made of it, its ok.
i don't need to prove anyone how much i love my daughter.
they are all precious to me.
i have looked after my daughter for over 14 years without the help of ss or any family member.
even when i went to hospital at the time of the birth of my youngest baby, i had to take her to hospital with me at 5 in the morning as there was no one to look after her.she was there for 10 hrs with my husband while i was alone at the time of ceserian.
i even didn't think of full time boarding when the LEA offered weekly boarding last year when she was excluded from her school.
you can imagine her violent bahaviour looking at LAE offering weekly boarding without parents request...
even after having 2 babies and all deficulties i kept looking after her.my younger baby is 15 months old.

its a punishment for her to be kept in a house with 2 babies she hates most in the world.
she starts to screams"baby go away" when she sees them.
making her live with them is putting too much stress on her and her behaviour is getting worse day by day.

it was a hard decision to ask for a full time boarding as i had to strike a balance between the welfare of the 2 babies and her placement at boarding.

i don't like section 20 because i do not want her to be placed with any family where she may suffer any kind of abuse, you know we read lots of stories in news papers about this.
i want her to be safe and be able to bring her home any time when i feel kids are safe to be with her.

its not only weekends but lots of holidays during the year, i have no one to help me with kids and her.
plus even when my husband is home, it doesn't matter when she hear the babies in the other room she screams sky high to show her dislikeness.
i think she will be much happier when she will not see them, she is ellergic to them.

I really hope things improve for all of you kakool. It's hard being the parent of a child with SN and trying to meet their needs as well as the rest of the family.
Don't know if you saw "Young, Autistic and Stagestruck" last year but I belong to a Facebook group run by the Mum of one of the participants. She is absolutely lovely and is a good source of support. I'll try and find a link to the group, I don't get there much but I know it's very supportive.

hi everyone,
hope u r all well.
i thought i share a good news with you as you helped me a lot in dificult times.
The authority has agreed to provide my daughter with 52 weeks boarding school.
My solicitor Leena has been dealing with them and done a good job.
she wrote them a letter describing my dificulties and the aggressive behaviour of my daughter.
there was a lady from health to do a report, she watched my daughter attacked my older baby 3 times in 30 minutes, but we rescued him.she was running arround in the room to save him from my daughter's attacks. she then phoned the SS and school to tell them that it was not safe for my daughter to be with her siblings.My daughter kept ruung in the house and trying to smash the glass doors and windows.
she no longer wants to come to the house and stands in the garden most of the time.its so deficult to make her come in the house. she finds it very hard to even bear the babies for few minutes.she has also been trying to open the front door to run from the house.

SS tried their best to get rid of me, i was offered 2 hrs respite per day,but everyone knew that how dangerous it was to keep my daughter with these 2 babies at present.

i hope she will improve in future so i can bring her home more often.

SS still want me to attend child protection meeting in 2 weeks time.don't know why these people don't understand the dificulty of a parent like me.

thanks everyone and wish you all best with everything

Excellent news kakool, hope this helps you and your DD gets the right support too.

That's great news kakool . My DS is in a 38 week placement, which I had to go to appeal for - so as your LEA agreed to your first residential placement without a fight, I can only imagine how much more severe your DD's needs must be.

I really hope it helps her, my DS's school has been so helpful for him.

Hi kakool. I'm really glad your daughter's placement has been agreed. Well done for quelling your panic about the CP conference and working with the various different people to find a solution. Think carefully about what you want from a review. Not registering or swift de-registration may be proposed but 2 weeks after a decision is quite short.

If the school falls through, you may get more help and faster if your children are still subject to a child protection plan. Should your eldest be considered 'at risk' of neglect, or of emotional abuse then there is an obligation on SS to try to ameliorate that, and finding an appropriate placement is only part of that duty. For example, facilitating safe contact with her parents, recommending family therapy, ensuring that her violent behaviour problem is treated.

The sort of questions which are relevant are, When does the placement start? Which department is paying for it? For how long is funding guaranteed? What additional therapies etc are available at the school? And is there help available to keep you all safe at home in the meanwhile? So perhaps a good idea to keep your solicitor involved for a while longer.