ADHD child and Beaver cub scouts...some advice please?

[RMCW]

Hello.

I hope I am posting in the right section!!! Sorry if I'm not. I am an assistant beaver cub scout leader and last week a boy came for his 1st session with us and I would like some advice.

His mother/carer told us that he was awaiting a dx for ADHD from school and that he has been physically bullying children at school.

During the session (at which his mother/carer stayed) he would not make eye contact, would not do as asked, would not sit down and would not participate in the session - we were acting out the story of "Where the wild things are".

Despite being told repeatedly not to sit on the piled up chairs he kept doing so. ditto going into the kitchen. Ditto anything else we asked tbh His mother/carer did nothing. He also ran out of the building at one point which really scared me. His mother/carer just said "oh, he will just run home"

I tried to get him to look at me when I spoke to him and I tried to include him in what we were doing but he just seemed like he didnt want to be there When I read the story he actually looked frightened

I suppose my question is; Is there ANYTHING I can do to help him settle? Is there anything I shouldnt do?

We cannot give him 1-1 attention as we have 14 other 6-8 year olds to look after too.

I do not want to tell this mother/carer that he cant come...I would like to think that perhaps we could help him, but perhaps that is a pipe dream?

Any advice gratefully received....

Ummm. This is really hard. Here are my first thoughts.....

First of all, ignore all the behaviour that you can safely ignore. Certainly don't worry about whether or not he makes eye contact or 'looks' engaged.

If he doesn't want to engage but is safe then just ignore him / gently coax him - but don't force him to engagne.

If he is doing something dangerous, then obviously you have to stop it immediatley.

If he is hurting or bullying other kids you have to stop it immediatley.

As for all the constant movement, there is not much you can do for it. At school kids often have fidget toys and wobble cushions to sit on so they can sit vaguely still....

If he, and the other kids, are safe then you should do everything you can to keep him in the troop. Beavers is sooooo good......

Can the parent stay and help with him for a while until he settles or help with the group while keeping her son safe?

RMCW - get on to your county special needs advisor pronto.

Oops that posted too soon!

They'll be able to give you some more guidance. There are some general resources on Scoutbase which can also help. Agree that the parent needs to help out until you're all confident that it's working for everyone.

One of my Beavers has ADHD and other behavioural issues. We've worked out what he likes, what he doesn't - loud noises being right up there!, how to reinforce what's appropriate behaviour.

He does go 'freeform' at times but we've a quiet area where he can go if it's getting too much or if I notice he's getting agitated. I won't say it's been easy but he's come on so much and joins in with so much more as time goes on.

He has 1-1 at school and Beavers is the only activity he manages without it so we're going to do everything we can to keep him with us!

At our cubs there have been a couple of children with Aspergers or ADHD who have funding at school and have managed to get funding for the same helper to come to cubs. This was organised through the HM of the school.

The only thing I can really say is to be cautious how you handle the situation where he runs out of the building. It's all nice and good for the mum to say "oh he'll just run home" but she is not there and he runs out of the meeting, YOU are responsible for his safety, and it will land on your head if something happens to him.

I'm baffled about the mum's attitude towards this, as my DS2 is ASD & ADHD, and is a continual runner. I would NEVER just leave him at a meeting like that and expect them to be solely responsible for him, due to this alone. It's a huge huge safety concern.

I think this is something you need to address with the mum. You cannot accept responsibility for him during these meetings with that just hanging there. She may think it's fine, but in reality he could easily be injured or lost when he runs off.

The other behaviours you can work through gradually, but this particular thing (the running off) is a MAJOR problem that needs to be confronted and sorted.

Hi.

Thanks for your replies.

The group leader has talked to the scout SN advisor, but it wasnt much help tbh. They just said that if he gets physically or verbaly abusive he has to leave and if he runs off we are not allowed to follow him....apparently if we are chsing him and he runs into a road we would be liable.

I really dont think I can allow a 6 year old child out on his own in the dark!!!

sigh.....oh dear...

Thanks for the advice....will talk to the leader about making him a "safe space".

And changing the door handle so that a 6 year old can't open it?

hello i run a navy training corp unit woth my husn4 and we do get this problem firstly its good the parent was honest with you that her DS is ADHD (many dont bother to tell us)secondly you will obviously have to explain your situation ie : not enough staff for 1-1 and would she please help to control his behaviour much of which if safe you have to ignore but obviously the kitchen and running away you cant handle so can she please help and stay, im presuming you asked her to fill ouut a medical form when her DS came did she put on there any medication? if she did/or even if she didnt id ask is it not possible to space the drugs so his behaviour is better during the club , we have found that works wonders plus make sure if at break time when you have tuc that hes not gorging on sugar and orange juice as we find when parents arnt around and given a pound or so to spend if all staff arnt informed they will sell the DC all sorts that adds to their behaviour lastly for his own safety if she refuses all of the above id contact yr HQ and ask if legally you can ask them to leave of course you dont want to but you have to think of the DC safety first and formost HTH

indigo Great idea but we have no money available for such alterations. We only charge parents £7 per month for "subs" and some of them think thats too much!!! I have just organised a trip and we have managed to do it FOC - as most of our stuff is - but we get lots of moaning when we have to charge

betty He is not an meds yet as he is still awaiting a dx and tbh his mum/carer was no use at all last week....could it be that he will better is she is not there? We dont do tuck at beavers, thank god!

We cannot tolerate verbal or physical abuse and will not do so...if he does that then he is out. Same for any of the other children.

Unforunately, one of the boys he bullies at school has also just joined the group...sigh...his parents have (understandably) asked us to keep them apart but how do we do that in group games?????

sigh....

It will be easier for you to control him when his Mum is not there, in that you will just treat him the same as you treat the other kids, and you won't expect help from the Mum.

His behaviour may or may not change. I wouldn't expect it to, but it is possible...

You don't have to keep the kids apart in group games, you just have to make sure that he doesn't get a chance to bully the other kid...

Do you not have any money spare for the building? What if the gutter was leaking or the window broken or whatever - how would you pay for that?

Look at if there are any grants you can apply for. I know some people here get a 1:1 for beavers paid for by some grant - but I don't know what.....

Will look into it indigo

District might pay up if we beg!

Hi RCMW

My ds is in Beavers and they are great with him. It took about a term for him to get settled though and during that time I helped out most sessions as an 'extra' parent helper. Not helping directly with his little group normally, but it meant I was there to explain how to handle him and if things did kick off. I then progressed to waiting in the lobby, and then in the car.

A very structured session helps, with a minute-by minute planned programme and a plan B for 'filler' activities. Even a couple of minutes hanging around trying to 'be good' whilst swapping over can be problematic. For my ds, knowing what will happen next, and what he has to do, is very helpful.

I suspect the running away is a fight or flight response, and I think the door handle and safe space suggestions are good ones. We also have some Scouts assisting the leaders (I think this counts towards a badge!) and if you could borrow one, perhaps they could act as a peer support for this child. The other useful assistants are Duke of Edinb. award teenagers, as they have to do so many sessions of community work for their awards.

I still help out more than most parents though as it lets me see what's happening, and gives a bit of a thank-you for the extra help ds's had.

Oh and 'social stories' are officially for dc with autistic spectrum disorders, but can help ADHD kids a lot too. YOu basically write a fun descriptive story about what happens at beavers, including plenty of detail about what the child needs to do, and ask the mother to go through it daily with them until it sinks in.

thanks maria will try the story idea