Its a pulling my hair out day

[coff33pot]

Well for me it is anyway. My ds has been doing well but in these last 3 days he has gone from bad to worse.

Monday fine, Tuesday morning ok but afternoon not so amicable and was charging around school not being compliant with the teachers and I had to go and get him out from under a table. Wednesday he had his first appointment with EP. EP said he did unbelievably well in his tests and the tests she did was for a 6/7yr old and ds is 5. He was well behaved that day but I think it was because 1) I had prepared him that he was seeing someone different and she had some special work for him to do. 2) He had that 1 to 1 attention with someone who wanted to listed to him and he loved it.

When he got home he became stressed and tired which no doubt was due to him fighting with his behaviour all day to stay "good". Had a good morning but the afternoon he just point blank refused to do anything and refused to go out to play in the small courtyard they have him playing in with a couple play partners he chooses.

TODAY :( Goes to school unkeen.....drags his heels all the way, not misbehaving but I had that feeling it was going to be one of those days. Funny how you sense the build up isnt it.

Well by 1.30 I get the dreaded phone call (I jump with dread every time the phone rings nowadays) I got to come up to school as ds is creating havoc and they consider him a danger to children today. GREAT

I go up there and my ds is locked in the HT office with the HT. Fighting with her by grabbing paperclips to unpick the lock. She let me in and it took a good 30 mins to calm him down. Trying to talk to him was as difficult as it can be when he was on full meltdown. HT wasnt helping by trying to talk to me about his behaviour which only escalated ds behaviour further as he obviously didnt like her telling me about it and I do wish she waited and left me by myself to sort him out.

He had apparently been like this all day. Did some writing and then didnt want to do anymore so TA went and got the HT and by the time she got back he had baracaded himself in so they couldnt get to him and went under the table. This was in the morning! why o why cant they phone you at that point and then I could go up and calm him down instead of leaving things get harder and harder till the point of no return? :(

I dont know where I am going on this thread to be honest I guess I am just taking the day out on the keyboard instead of breaking a cup or too :o

Its just the fact that for the first time I couldnt calm my son down like I normally do. Along with the "he is just being naughty look ppl were wearing" Another TA came out of the door the same time as I went in and the look I got was you could have just pulled me out of a pile of dung. She doesnt look after my ds thank god but it angers me that she can pass opinion even if it is a look.

I then took him home and fought an amazing battle not to lose it with my ds and yell because the volcano inside me was huge.

I gave him no snack and no tv on as told him it wasnt time for him to be home from school and he had to wait till 3.30. He was not impressed shall we say but I had to try and instill some sort of "getting off school is not so much fun" senario. Because his last words at school was good I can go home now.

I needed to take him home as there was no way I was going to be able to leave him there but if they had called me well before this things might have been very different.

Ok rant over

Definitely a and chocolate night for you. Rant/vent all you need.

So sorry you've had such a horrible day - you're absolutely right, they do need to learn to read the signs and intervene or call you sooner.

Could you perhaps create a passport/guide for your ds that would tell them what to look for and at what point they need to call?

My ds's EP says he is an angel in their sessions as well, but they have worked out its because they are in a quiet room with very little sensory distraction, he has 1-1 with her and she allows him to get up from his chair and move around as much as he feels he needs to. As you said, he also feels valued and listened to as opposed to being viewed as the naughty child.

I think part of this outburst was due to ds breaking a little girls model. The HT stated to him it was an unkind thing to do and that the little girl is now refusing to play with him anymore. This got his back up and the HT said he really didnt see that he had done anything wrong. When I talked to ds about the model breaking and how he felt (whilst he was calm sharing the puppys dog bed with the puppy :o) And he simply said Mum she was making me a model chair and I sat on it you sit on chairs you know!

I think tbh he didnt react to upsetting her because in his eyes he has just sat on a chair and didnt know what the fuss was about. But became irational and defensive when he was told the litle girl wouldnt play with him.

According to the HT she just states he seems to just dig himself deeper and deeper in trouble and explodes because he cant see a way out.

I do warn them in the mornings that "ds is having an iffy morning so dont push him" what I mean is if he wont write then DONT insist! And try saying ok lets have a walk around the block to clear our heads and perhaps have a go at something else. But they dont seem to take the hint. We have started a home book which is good for me as I can spot patterns in behaviour so why cant they? And what I do see repeatedly is "ds started doint beautiful maths/writing but after a few minutes refused to do more so called HT who intervened and persuaded him to do more" This seems to be the constant case and when this has happened by the afternoon the reports are he was unable to concentrate/distracting and not compliant.

ds is 1 to 1 and has been for a few months now as he cannot cope and is disruptive in the main classroom. I am all for encouragement but forcing a child that is having a bad day is going to end up with bad consequences. He feels he is cornered and then runs for it.

The EP has to see him again as she only did the 1 to 1 with him and it took all afternoon as she found him intriguing was her words. In other words he was in his element that someone was taking notice of him. And yes it was in the library which is the place he always runs to to hide under the table as it is quiet. If someone comes to get him he starts kicking the table. Again I have said why dont you let him have his time out in the library and stay outside, just let him think things over THIS would be the point to phone me as THIS is the time he needs me to interpret how he is feeling and calm it down.

The EP has referred him to CAMHS and we are waiting for an appointment. She obviously can see he needs help as she hasnt even finished her appointments inorder to make an assessment yet let alone refer him there.

We have a long road ahead

Have the inclusion team been in yet? In our area the school can bring them in for advice and support for any child that is awaiting assessment/dx.

I called ours myself and asked for advice, they said either I could get a referral via the GP or the school could call them in themselves. I got the GP referral, showed the school and told them I intended to bring them in myself and voila - within a week the school had brought them in to observe him!

They've been great at advising about things like, where to sit him and how to organise his workspace and minimise distractions around his desk, along with any sensory issues that might be affecting him.

They also said that a safe/time-out space is one of the most useful tools for helping children with ASD cope with the classroom environment. It sounds like your ds runs when he gets into overload and what they need to work on is getting him there before it reaches crisis point so that he can have some calming time and then perhaps come back and try again. Would a social story around him telling the teacher/1-1 that he's had enough calmly and politely asking to go somewhere quiet for five minutes help?

As you said, pushing him to do more work when he clearly can't cope is counterproductive and involving the HT every time is making him feel like he is being cornered and punished, so needs to escape.

If this is happening a lot in the afternoons, would there perhaps be any chance of flexi-schooling so that he works at home with you in the afternoons? Might be worth asking if you are in a position to do it.

As for them saying he's been non-compliant. I get so mad when my ds's teacher says he has been defiant or non-compliant, 99.9% of the time they have completely misread the situation and failed to understand what he's trying to communicate.

You're right, its a long hard road.

i really feel for you we have enough of a struggle on our hands day to day just living but its the teachers and TA's ive had the trouble with they all say they know all about AS and ASD but do they do they really get it? i dont think they do, most days you feel your banging your head against a brick wallwhat your DS said about the model chair seems perfectly logical to me but we live with that qwerky logic its literal and we seems to be the only ones who get it and i for one love my DS all the more for all his funny qwerks or foibols its what makes him so special and i know im sure i spak for all of us if thats not too rude but i certainly wouldnt want them any other way

Thank you Moosemama you have come up with some great suggestions there :)

I dont know what the inclusion team is to be honest. This is the first time I have been down this road my other two Cs had no issues apart from the norm of bullying etc.

So far 1) Reception teacher says she is recommending he be listed as SN due to behavioural issues.

2. Matters got worse and a behavioural therapist was called in January. He mainly oversaw ds and quoted his behaviour as "challenging" asked some private questions that why am I not taking ds to clubs or inviting ppl to tea and why doesnt he go out to play on his own. HELLO how many ppl leta 5 year old out in the street on their own! and clubs down here are for age 6 upwards. He agreed 1 to 1 was the best course of action and said he would discuss with HT of putting certain things in place and maybe coming again in March.

3. EP called in and that was just this wednesday so that is how far we have got.

It was plainly suggested (in a very clever way) that it might be how I am bringing him up. And of course I knew this was coming. If I had been a younger mum with first child I would probably burst into tears and thought it was my fault but seeing as my eldest is 21 and middle ds 9 and they have grown up just fine with no childhood issues due to MY bringing them up AND the fact that this school knows them and taught them I found it more insulting than upsetting.

I dont know what the CAMHS outcome will be and from other posts I have learnt that nothing is a quick process. And as they havent contacted me yet this road is just beginning.

All I know is that ds needs more help than I can give him by just merely protecting him. But at the moment this lioness is going to start roaring because her cub is so unhappy :(

My GP said that there was nothing he could do and I would have to await the EP outcome so I cant see him helping with these inclusion ppl. Then again you dont have a personal GP anymore so I might just go through them all lol.

The social stories sound good :) do you or anyone know where I can pick up some ideas for these stories? :)

And yes Bailyandtinks I most certainly wouldnt want to swap my little imp for the world :)

Despite the downs the ups are hilarious and wonderful. His innocence and forthrightness is a funny mix but I love it :)

I just got an obsessional gun thing that is causing issues at the mo. One round of Ben 10 and thats it he thinks he can kill the world and this has gone on for 12 months!

This has been overshaddowed tonite because he has got it into his head that a tornado is coming and he doesnt like it. Where he has got this from I dont know its very windy outside but we certainly havent discussed tornados. Hence that is why he is curled up with the puppy in its bed at the moment as he doesnt want it blown away :o

ah yes, ben 10. DS is not impressed that he's only allowed nick junior and cbeebies at 7, but I was fed up with the gun thing too.

I think all LEAs have an Inclusion Team. In our area they are called the Schools Specialist Inclusion Service and they cover all sorts of SENs, with each team handling a different area. My ds is working with the CLD (Communication and Language) and ASD team. They should also have a behavioural team.

Is he not on the SN register already? He should be on School Action Plus if an Educational Psychologist and Behavioural Therapist have been involved. His reception teacher is most definitely not qualified to diagnose behavioural problems or otherwise.

It sounds like the school SENCO hasn't had much contact with you. They should be having regular meetings with you and his teacher and your ds should have an IEP (Individual Education Plan) to help them set him some targets that they can then monitor and assess to see if he is making any progress. This is a useful site for basic advice about what should be happening and what your school should be doing.

As for the behavioural therapist (not even sure what one of those is to be honest). My my ds didn't do playdates or clubs, because he couldn't handle them, he was also overwhelmed by birthday parties etc. I was asked the same thing a few times, but I knew my instincts were right and he got a dx of ASD at the age of 8, after years of me asking the school repeatedly and being told he didn't have a problem.

Don't be fobbed off by them pulling the 'its your parenting' card. I think a lot of us have had that one thrown at us at some point. Its not about you, they are just trying to wriggle out of their responsibilties.

Its good that your inner lion is starting to roar - you are going to need that. You'll also need a large pair of butt kicking boots - which are also handy for kicking down doors.

Your GP is talking bollocks (excuse my language, but he/she is). Your GP can refer you to a paediatrician, preferably a developmental paediatrician and that's the route we took, because we knew the school would be worse than useless. I would definitely go back and see a different GP and be firm about wanting a referral. I asked the receptionist if anyone had a special interest in paediatric special needs and was lucky that one of our GPs has a child with SNs herself.

An alternative, if you could afford it, would be to go private. I know others on here have done that to speed up the process, but then some have problems getting the school to accept the dx and its very costly.

There is a book on Amazon about social stories here. Actually there are two by Carol Gray, her old one is the cheapest, the new one is obviously the updated version. They are basically a bit like comic strips that explain what's happens in certain situations, what people will do or say and what the appropriate behaviour or response would be. Children often respond really well to them. You can find them online by googling as well.

Sorry, I know its a lot to take in. Any questions, just holler and I'll do my best to help.

@ mariamagdalena

Almost everything is out with ds at the mo apart from peppa pig and spongebob. Every time he turns the channel or his dad does it he asks the question is this a killing film or is there killing in it.

School is obsessively asking me and my dh what we let our son watch. He watched ben 10 for a while till guns became an issue and he did watch an old cowboy film with his grandad (john wayne) and that was it! I dont watch tv (proof i am here lol) and dh is home from the shop late so films are on from 11pm and they are well tucked up in bed.

It didnt help at school when a ta asked what dvds ds watches and proudly announced "I want Atilla the Hun!" :o THIS was spotted on the tv in about 2.5 secs of viewing when the cat walked over the sky remote! wild face looks good I want it! HOW do you explain to ppl its all in your childs head and his imagination is doing the storytelling hmmm?

There's a little boy in ds2's class whose family don't have a tv and are highly/strictly religious and very careful about what he's exposed to. He has never seen any 'killing films or programmes' yet he loves to spend playtime dashing around shooting everyone in sight and 'killing them dead'.

I think its just a boy thing to be honest. I read somewhere that its more prevalent in boys who have a higher testosterone level and in boys who are going through the testosterone surge between the ages of four and five.

Ds2 was a late bloomer, as well as being seriously ill when he was 4 and 1/2 and he appeared to get his surge at about 5 and 3/4. My previously calm laid back boy turned into a hyperactive karate kicking whirlwind. He is now 6 and 1/2 and has settled right down again.

@ moosemama

The HT is the SENCO need I say more

In all fairness to the HT she probably has placed him on and IEP but up till 10 days ago I was in the "there is nothing wrong with my son" world. She did actually mention a plan of sorts being put into place but I was so foggy with it all because I was denying he needed help. (familys telling you he will grow out of it/dh saying just naughty/friends saying its normal)

Which after a serious battle with the brain and being honest with myself I knew that my son was struggling and she was trying to help.

I just wish she would put her "understanding concerned nods" and her "yes that is an excellent idea we will try this in school" promises when I try to help in how to calm and control ds before explosion into place!

Next week is a new week and I have a feeling I need to get in there AGAIN and see exactly who has and what has been put into place for ds.

Ah! I see.

If your ds has been placed on the SEN register, he should defintely be on SA+ and have an IEP and you should be involved in the drawing up and regular reviewing of that IEP. At the very least, you should have a copy of it, but by rights you should have been involved in the process.

We've all been through the denial stage, in my case not helped by teacher after teacher telling me he was fine, until he crashed and burned on entering junior school.

As you say, next week is a brand new week. Perhaps sit down for half an hour and write out some very specific questions about what they've done so far, what they intend to do and if they are following the process set out on that direct gov site I linked to.

It might be best to ask for a meeting with the senco and his teacher and take along your partner/dh or a friend who can back you up. Its also useful to have two people there as you tend to remember the bits each other forgets.

Try and have a good weekend. Your ds sounds lovely curling up with the pup. What puppy do you have? [nosey emoticon] I am a BIG dog lover and have two dogs myself.

Yes I am definately going to have a meeting. My dh is more onboard with the issue now and came with we when we saw the EP on Wednesday. I think this helped as it opened his eyes more and he also was encourage to input info.

I have not had a copy of any plan so that is the first on my list :)

DS is now in bed snoring away. Picture this for a giggle...........Dogs bed IN ds bed and both are curled up in it! Only way I would get him to go bed because this suspected tornado might still blow the puppy away :o I am slowly prising arms and legs out of it to slide him into his own bed. Its funny but makes a lovely picture :)

The pup is 6 months old now a Jack Russel called Toby. We bought it for ds so he had something for himself to look after. The responsibility made him feel better in himself that and Toby likes tearing around the house too so they wear each other out! He is a beautiful natured dog has to be bless it seeing as he lives in a madhouse with 5 cats! All great fun here! :)

Oh JRT puppies are unbelievably cute. I bet the cats were bigger than him when you got him weren't they!

Mine would tower over him, I have a huge shaggy great lurcher and a belgian shepherd x border collie.

My dad had a beautiful sweet natured JRT - she lived until she was 19 and never so much as growled in her entire life. I think JRTs get a lot of undeserved bad press, all the one's I've ever known were absolute sweeties.

Ah, your ds and the dog both in his basket on ds's bed, that is just too cute!

Right, I must crawl off to bed now.

Good luck next week and like I said, any questions just yell and I'll do my best.

Night.

Goodnight sweet dreams and thanks! :)

just a silly thought but perhaps they have mentioned the cyclone/tornado in australia atm in class or assembley that would upset and worry my ds too , bless their cotton socks sounds so cute all snuggly with the dog aww

@ baileyandtinks

You could be right! They might well have discussed it in school. They have been learning about parts of the world at the mo through fruit lables so it is a possibility. He was the same yesterday but better today now the horrible wind has died down here. On top of it last night we had the fear that the child catcher was coming..............

My DH had found Chitty Chitty Bang Bang on the TV for my ds and dd to watch while I was at shop. hmmmmm of course there is a grotty child catcher in it that catches the kids in a net remember? Of course he went in a panick and said he catches naughty children is it real? of course my ds (bless her but not thinking) said only if you are naughty.........

Of course with him not doing so well at school and them constantly going on to him about bad behaviour he has it in his head he cant be good so yep you got it the child catcher was coming! IT was a long night :o

Oh poor ds. The child catcher still scares me and I'm 40!

Poor little mite thinking he is naughty thanks to his incompetent school.

The wind hasn't died down at all here and my two year old has been asking 'what was that noise' about every five minutes since it started on Thursday. Aaaaarrgh! Can't take the dogs for a walk either as the daft mutts freak out in the wind.

coff33

I get the feeling that even if proper based support was in place (i.e a Statement and I would settle for nothing less than that now for him. You will need to apply for it however from the LEA) this school would not want to help your son.

I guess no-one at school has ever mentioned the word statement to you either.

If there is no IEP in place I'd be asking them some tough questions. I would also be asking them where he is on the SEN register; if he is on School Action Plus. If he is not then again I would be asking why that is because he should be.

Your GP is hopeless - I would change GP practice forthwith. A GP can and should refer your DS to a developmental paediatrician.

IPSEA's website is very good at the whole minefield that is the statementing process and it would not do any harm to get that ball rolling

www.ipsea.org.uk

You are your child's best - and only - advocate. You are truly best placed to fight his battles re education for him because no-one else actually will do that for him.

Let us know how you get on.

Thanks Attila for all this good info :)

The school did mention a statement. The sentence was as follows in the middle of the car park I might add:

"Unless we have the funding and your ds is statemented with behaviour issues we will not be able to have him here"

THAT was the explanation of statementing And that was the first time I was told about what they had decided for my son.

This quite honestly got my back up (protective mother syndrome) And the sentence she made was amist a whole 3 weeks of ds has done this and ds has done that and ds is NON COMPIANT/STUBBORN/AND BADLY BEHAVED endless phone calls asking will you collect your son only to find when I got there he was calm as can be in another class and couldnt understand why I was taking him home. I did the WRONG thing of losing it and telling her to back off and leave him and me alone and that she had enough ppl seeing him without my agreement. I want it stopped!

Wrong I know but by this time my ds was scared to go school and point blank told me this was too much for him (he had overheard teachers saying this so used their words)

I should have then gone in and demanded to know what she was on about but didnt as Xmas hols started and I had calmed him down enough to go back school. He had had a great two weeks by then and I had assumed it was because ppl were leaving him alone.

Then on week 3 I got this letter to meet with them and that an EP can call and visit him the following wed. First instinct was irritation because an appt had obviously already been made wether I go up to talk with her or not and second because I didnt want my son pressured anymore.

After this I found this site that night and came on here and a couple other ppl here really helped me come to terms with a few things. I knew there was something wrong going on with ds but was battling with admiting it. Thanks to the ppl on here I went up calm and the meeting went well and she even agreed to put a few ideas of mine in place and I did agree to the EP assessing him. I must have frightened the hell out of the HT in the car park with "the look" :) because she said she will continue 1 to 1 with ds even if they didnt get funding and that she wont give up on him. (the way it has been lately I think this was said to shut me up in how they have treated ds. It didnt I let it all go with the EP lol but in a less irate manner.

The EP when she came was supportive and did explain statmenting to me in a correct manner and it was she who explained exactly what she was here to do. So the school are on there way to pushing for a statement. She was also going back to get CAMHS to phone me to have ds assessed with them. But a full EP assesment has not been done because she has to see him again a couple of times.

It has all seemed to be done inside out and back to front or it could be me as I said in another post because I wasnt listening as all I could see was my ds getting more and more upset about school along with my own refusal that he needed help.

I am going on Tuesday to ask her exactly what they have laid out for ds and to ask her about IEP and SA+ and if IEP in place a copy of it??

The way they have dealt during the school hours with ds is crap for want of a better word. Yes he is 1 to 1 but being pushed too hard, left in a state far too long before I am called and totally missread wrong with regards to his actions. The sooner his needs are recognised the sooner my ds just might get the help and understanding he needs (not holding my breath tho lol)