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SN children

Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on special needs.

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Original poster

You are all so right

42 replies

working9while5 · 20/01/2011 16:45

I can't really post as I wish I could here, but something has happened in a professional context that has made me yet again realise the extent of corruption in The System and how it disadvantages children and young people with disabilities.

I am raising this with the very highest level of management and will see if I can take it further. I wanted to tell you this because sometimes there are voices in the system shouting out for your kids but they are not well received by those with more power. Sometimes people will appear to tow the party line while fighting the injustice where you cannot see. Unfortunately, it may not make a difference. Just wanted to say it, somehow.

OP posts:

StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 16:48

working Thank you for this. I was fortunate just recently to share a room with some retired LA professionals who have been charged with setting up a free school.

It was like being on another planet.

Original poster

working9while5 · 20/01/2011 16:49

I want to go to that planet!

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StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 16:52

Well they might need a SLT!? They just have an EAL professional currently.

ReclaimingMyInnerPeachy · 20/01/2011 16:52

Thank you working.

Sometimes I think I want to scream more becuase I used to be in the system IYSWIM: I remember all the idiots bosses from then and think- shite, they have an influence on my child's lifetime?

it's good to know some people try

StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 16:53

It must be bad though for you to have posted that. Poor you.

Original poster

working9while5 · 20/01/2011 16:54

It is bad. I requested a written response to my initial concern but was told I could have a meeting instead.

And here it goes, my first ever .

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gotchababe · 20/01/2011 16:56

Thank you, I know there are those that fight. There are a lot very tunnel visioned and uneducated in Disability. A lot of high powered people with no concept what so ever in the fights and brick walls we as parents have to endure. Assessments after assessment, meeting after meeting. This all takes up resourses that could be put to better use.

StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 16:59

I dunno why but that really made me LOL!

I think what you implied on that other thread is asbolutely right that because children with additional needs are becoming so devalued, their 'servants' (forgive the word but you know what I mean) are also becoming undervalued.

God help us all!

Original poster

working9while5 · 20/01/2011 17:05

Not only undervalued but underskilled. Clueless, in fact.

I was at a special interest group the other day. We were talking about working through others. Someone asked a professional who was strongly advocating for whole class intervention if she really believed it would take the place of individual and intensive input.

She responded that she is an independent therapist for that very reason: that she couldn't do the whole class stuff (which is the most effective approach to limited resources e.g. does the best for the most) without constant intensive input with individuals who inform her training etc.

This is being lost. Yet some "servants" don't even realise it. They begin to believe. They don't see how they are being deskilled and will be rationalised.

Who will lose out in the end? Yes, the kids. The adults they will be. Society, for not helping them be who they can be.

OP posts:

gotchababe · 20/01/2011 18:15

Children with Special/Complex Needs do not stand any chance in this present day system. There are individuals and Local Authorities making wrong decisions on a Childs future without any understanding or knowledge in certain aspects of Disabilities and lifelong medical issues. Outwith the ticked boxes so to speak,the child has to fit in. No grey areas accountable. The policy the 'child always comes first' These kids will definitely lose out in todays society because the Specialism just not there.

auntevil · 20/01/2011 18:40

I've always found it strange that those who are the most professional, and work in specialised areas (SALT, OT etc) are often the most ignored when deciding the future course for the education/diagnosis/treatment. Yet those that may have had little specialised training in SN/SEN, such as teachers, GPs, LA employees etc are given at least equal credence if not in some cases more in the decision making.
When did society stop being run by people and started to be run by accountants?

Disclaimer: DH is an accountant, and sometimes i have to remind him too that it is not only about cutting costs and economising, but getting the right result first off, not false economies.

ReclaimingMyInnerPeachy · 20/01/2011 19:00

Ther eis specialism out there- am doing an MA in ASD and lots of TAs etc there too- but many of us cannot find jobs.

Great huh?

auntevil · 20/01/2011 19:17

This is part of my point about false economy Reclaiming. The higher the specialism/qualification and experience, the more expensive the staff but the better outcomes for the DCs concerned. False economy being that they could afford cheaper, that could suffice 90% of the DCs.
Even with the massive amount of evidence to support early intervention as having the greatest effect on outcomes, still cost implications apply. What about the 'cost' to support a failed DC throughout adulthood?
Its all short termism. None of the authorities that could make a difference seem to want to look at the long term effect on their penny pinching antics.

ReclaimingMyInnerPeachy · 20/01/2011 19:23

I often think if they merged childrens services with asult you;ld get more joined up thinking tbh for exactly those reasons AE.

StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 19:27

It isn't just that child and adult are seperate.

The problem I think is 'education'.

That is synonomous with 'child'.

Adult services don't want to be responsible for education, and whilst developmental disabilities (but also some other) are dx by the nhs, the treatment is actually delivered (or not) by 'education'.

I think SLTs are in a tricky place too, because some of what they deliver is education, and some is health. It's very strange. It's so fragmented.

Thecarrotcake · 20/01/2011 19:31

I personally have come across 4 wonderful professionals .. They actually care and go to the ends of the earth to help, are totally frustrated with the system and worn down.

I hang on to those moments in our SN life.. Because they are sadly outweighed :(

ds was talking about one prof to another not long ago and where I had been professional in my opinion .. Ds was ds and announced " someone gave him the wrong job!"!

What can you say?

I agree AE and peachy and thank you working.

ReclaimingMyInnerPeachy · 20/01/2011 19:32

It does nd to be mixed all in but they won;t, too protective over separate areas.

the SLTs here are employed by ehalth and seem to stay fairly true to that, they visit schools but that's about it- just for ease of delivery.

c0rn5i1k123 · 20/01/2011 19:47

working9while5 your post is scary.

StartingAfresh · 20/01/2011 19:50

Yes it is. It is very scary.

justaboutmaintainingorder · 20/01/2011 19:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

StartingAfresh · 21/01/2011 19:51

Hope you're alright working. It isn't like you to post anything negative really. You always seem to have hope where we sometimes fail to see it.

TheTimeTravellersWife · 21/01/2011 22:15

I find it astonishing that the LA SEN Officers are not qualified in ANYTHING! They do not have a teaching qualification, no SENCO experience, they do no need to have a degree or any qualifications; they are just tick box pen pushers with far too much power!

They seem to have no comprehension that their actions will have far reaching impacts on disabled children's life chances.

I came across the job description for a SEN Team manager and it was full of crap about needing to be a good negotiator and being able to work in partnership with parents, schools and professionals! Oh yeh?!!

daisy5678 · 21/01/2011 22:21

I have met some great professionals and some terrible ones. But even the ones that care are so disheartened by the system, and they were even before the cuts.

These are very bad times for any children's services, and very very dark times to be the parent of a child who needs those services.

Agnesdipesto · 21/01/2011 22:28

Yes TTTW I have similar concerns I am still not clear how said pen pusher was able to overturn all the written evidence submitted for statutory assessment recommending specialist education for my son and replace it with her own opinion 'that mainstream was enough'. On repeated pressing for written reasons (when she realised we were not going to go away) we finally got out of her that she had had some 'oral advice' on those lines from autism outreach - so as long as they had a quick chat around the water cooler then it was obviously ok to override the legal process and DS's rights and ignore those with specialist qualifications. However it always seemed to me rather like letting the cleaner decide what operation was appropriate rather than the surgeon.

WetAugust · 21/01/2011 22:28

I find it astonishing that the LA SEN Officers are not qualified in ANYTHING! They do not have a teaching qualification, no SENCO experience, they do no need to have a degree or any qualifications

A bit too much of a generalisation.

The Case Officer may have no educational background and be a pure administrator BUT they all the decisions are actually made by their Line Managers - the Education Officer. The Education Officers I've met are ex teachers, Headmistresses etc.

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