Please or to access all these features

SN children

Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on special needs.

This is what SLT input I propose for DS' statement. Could I make it any better?

20 replies

nappyaddict · 12/01/2011 12:02

LA have proposed:

"X should have access to groups, that are run by the Speech and Language Therapist, in line with his clinical needs, as determined by the Speech and Language Therapy Service."

I am proposing:

"X will attend either the minimum of 6 language group sessions per term, that are run by a qualified and registered speech and language therapist and are appropiate for his communication and educational needs or an equal amount of direct time with a qualified and registered speech and language therapist, should the language group become less frequent or become unsuitable for X's communcation and educational needs. The minimum amount of direct speech and language therapy may be supplemented by additional work with a qualified and registered speech and language therapist or other appropriate worker in line with his evolving communication and educational needs as determined by the Speech and Language Therapy Service.

Any preparation, assessments, reporting, consultation, reviews, liason with parents and teaching staff and consolidation speech and language therapy work carried out by non-SALT Qualified and Registered teaching staff (ie. Teachers or Teaching Assistants) will be additional to the 6 hours direct therapy by a Qualified and Registered speech and language therapist."

OP posts:
nappyaddict · 12/01/2011 15:45

In response Dudley LA have suggested:

"When groups are organised by the Speech and Language Therapist and/or Speech and Language Teaching Assistant that are appropriate for T-J's language or speech sound development levels and age, he will be included."

OP posts:
working9while5 · 12/01/2011 17:12

The second one is less than the first! Angry

X will have a minimum of fortnightly face to face therapy contacts with a registered Speech and Language therapist with expertise in the treatment of [diagnosis] per term, with additional contacts for assessment, intervention planning, review, preparation, liaison with school staff and parents per term to be determined by the Speech and Language Therapy Service. The content of therapy sessions will be determined by clinical need, as determined by the Speech and Language Therapist. In addition, a member of X's school staff will attend these sessions in order to receive specialist training in how to deliver X's specific programme between SALT contacts and act as a point of contact between the SALT and other members of staff. This member of staff will support others working with X to integrate X's specific individualised SALT targets into social and academic activities across the school day. The school will provide evidence that in between SALT contacts, a trained member of staff is carrying over therapeutic work within the school environment on a (twice etc) weekly basis."

You don't need to say qualified, as you can't be registered without qualification!

negligentmummy · 12/01/2011 17:40

gosh 9-5 wish you'd written dds statement...

nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 18:28

Just realised I copied in an old suggestion from me and not my most recent.

"X will receive a minimum of 3 hours speech and language therapy with a registered speech and language therapist with expertise in the treatment of Autism Spectrum Disorder each term. If language group sessions are appropiate for his communication and educational needs he will attend a minimum of 6 language group sessions per term, that are run by a registered speech and language therapist. Should the language group become less frequent or become unsuitable for X's communcation and educational needs he will receive an equal amount of direct contact with a registered speech and language therapist. These could be 1:1 or group sessions and will make up a minimum of 3 hours contact. The minimum amount of 3 hours speech and language therapy may be supplemented by additional work with a registered speech and language therapist or other appropriate worker in line with his evolving communication and educational needs as determined by the Speech and Language Therapy Service.

Any preparation, assessments, reporting, intervention planning, consultation, reviews, liason with parents and teaching staff and consolidation speech and language therapy work carried out by non-SALT Qualified and Registered teaching staff (ie. Teachers or Teaching Assistants) will be additional to the minimum of 3 hours direct therapy by a registered speech and language therapist."

working9while5 Your suggestion was quite a bit different to mine. Can I ask which bits of mine don't work, why and why your alternative suggestions will be better?

OP posts:
nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 18:36

BTW DS is at special school where the whole school day is based around using the Derbyshire language scheme, not sure if that makes a difference?

The SALT has quoted this to me:

"The Royal College of Speech and Language Therapists adopts a position of supporting evidence based and collaborative practice in the delivery of speech therapy, where this often means working through others and not one-to-one. Support is delivered through the people who know the child or young person best and who spend most time with them (i.e. their parents/carers and school staff)?.

She has given this as a reason for choosing teachers to deliver the speech and language therapy programme as opposed to a registered SALT.

OP posts:
SantasMooningArse · 13/01/2011 18:58

Agree with 9-5

Now, what that initial one completely fails to cover is any mention of supervision or assessment: you want that clarified. DS3 for example is assessed every 6 weeks, and the SLA who delivers his SLT is directly supervised by a SLT.

For us that has worked well.

nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 19:07

In a different point we have got:

X will have access to Speech and Language Therapy, in order to develop a specialised individual programme in language and communication and to provide therapy input. Advice and suggested activities must be integrated into the teaching and learning within the curriculum. This provision will include:.

o A minimum of termly reviews by an SLT to update targets (minimum of 3 hours per academic year)
o Time for the SLT to liaise with and train teaching staff, jointly plan and discuss new targets (2 h)
o Time for the SLT to write programmes and reports to update parents and all staff involved on targets and strategies to be used, and prepare therapy materials (2 h)
o Time for the SLT to liaise with parents, obtain information about communication needs at home, and explain relevant strategies to parents (2h).
o This provision will be regularly reviewed and monitored by the Speech and Language Therapist.

OP posts:
working9while5 · 13/01/2011 19:11

Collaborative practice is hugely important. I am having massive issues with this in a setting I am doing some work in at the moment who expect me to withdraw students to a room on my own and do "magic wand" therapy" once a fortnight.

Carryover is the key. In every setting I have ever worked, the key to good SLT provision is a team based approach. The HLTA I work with in my SLI unit basically makes my intervention work. To give you an example, I work in that setting once a week. On Monday, we were working with a student on curriculum vocabulary. The HLTA had gone to the subject teacher for a list of relevant vocabulary and ask for key information and had prepared visuals and definitions according to a specification I had sent her and laminated these.

In the session, we both went through the key words and presented different ways of learning and remembering the information, putting it into sentences etc. I would demonstrate the teaching strategy for a bit and she would record responses. Then she would present one so I could watch responses, say, and then I would say: "maybe we need to try it like this" and tweak it, or we would accept that as a strategy (she is highly trained, so really most of the time we work it out together). Then we - or rather the student! - did some precision teachingy type stuff based on the targets. I had done some training on this with the HLTA but she was unsure about certain aspects of the presentation of materials, so we did some troubleshooting around this. Then we repeated the process for all 15 words and took data at the end of the session. We then discussed the session and what needed to be in the plans for the week (when I am not in) and how she could tweak etc. She repeated the info for me and wrote it down and I checked it.

This HLTA works with this student every day in at least one lesson. She also works with him for 15 minutes at "tutorial" and at 15 minutes towards the end of the day.

She sees him at break and is the contact person with all teachers, co-ordinating key word collection and assignments etc and she sets homework based on our plans. She also ensures that other support staff who support him in lesson use the same strategies (which I check by observing once a term).

Yes, I could just see him on my own. But he would have one hour of SLT a week instead of one hour of SLT and up to 10 hours of carryover (this is for a very severe impairment in a specialist setting so might not be appropriate for all students with SLCN).

To be honest, I truly believe that in some respects she is better than me at this stage because she has more time with them but has been trained very carefully by me so she will sometimes point out things and ask why x is happening leading to an important adjustment to target. She reports everything to me, it's brilliant.

Contrast this with another setting where basically I am dumped in a room and left to "get on with it" without even access to a student's timetable or a list of their teachers. I'm not seen as part of the school community, requests for meetings are ignored, emails trying to set up training aren't responded to for months. The fact I am registered and qualified doesn't in and of itself enable me to meet the students needs.. I need to know and be able to impact upon the communication environment and make my intervention functional and meaningful, which I just can't do if there is no team working.

Direct involvement from an SLT in a regular capacity is important. I said fortnightly because you said 6 a term and a term is usually around 12 weeks but sometimes more.. but if I were a parent, I would consider it would be best to have ongoing regular input rather than a 6 week "programme" and then a break IMO. They may not find this feasible. I said that other contacts might be necessary on top of this, because they really will if statutory obligations are to be met.

Direct contact is good but in and of itself it won't really maximise results. You need both ideally. I would not settle for direct therapy without a training component, personally.

nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 19:18

So what you are saying is I shouldn't settle for the SALT to not have direct contact with DS and for the therapy to be solely delivered by his teacher and teaching assistants but I also don't want it to only be delivered by them (which is what SALT and LA are trying to get me to agree to)

OP posts:
working9while5 · 13/01/2011 19:22

I've just seen that he's in a special school which is structured around language and communication.. this is going to make things harder for you with reference to your request.

Do you have a specific reason to think that it's not enough, that he needs something additional to or different from what he's getting? What would you like the SALT to do with him in these sessions?

nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 19:24

Also DS doesn't have a 1:1 teaching assistant so I'm not sure if a teaching assistant attending his SALT sessions would be possible. His class has 1 teacher and 3 teaching assistants but I think if 1 came out of the classroom it would mess up the class ratios?

OP posts:
nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 19:29

My main concern is that he doesn't get any direct contact with the SALT. It's all delivered by his teacher and teaching assistants. And I think you are saying ideally he should get both? Direct contact from SALT with no input from a teacher or teaching assistant is not really any good but direct contact from SALT is important even if the teacher and teaching assistant really know what they are doing with regards to language and communication?

OP posts:
working9while5 · 13/01/2011 20:17

I think yes, personally.. but only in so far as it is to make productive adjustments to a target.

If your son's targets are all based on the Derbyshire Language Scheme and the setting are proficient in operating it and adjusting it, then I can see why the statement would suggest that only termly visits were necessary as it might be unlikely that there would be adjustments necessary that the school can't take care of. The DLS is highly structured so that if a target is achieved, the next step is quite obvious iyswim and staff who are well trained in using it may very well be more creative in personalising it and delivering it than a "stranger" SALT, which the SALT will inevitably be relative to staff in the classroom.

On the other hand, I know that thanks to the tireless campaigning of a parent of a child with DS in our area, there is now a unit for children with learning disabilities attached to a school with weekly SLT input and I will say that special schools are not my specialist remit so I don't know enough of the research basis for SLT intervention with groups of students in these settings. I suspect that a creative, evidence-minded therapist could offer something to the setting and your son.. but the value of direct input or increased input will be somewhat dependent on the particular SALT who is doing the work. I was told as a newly qualified therapist by a colleague on the Special Needs team that she wouldn't advise me on how to differentiate for a Y5 boy at P3 in mainstream because "any Band 5 therapist should be able to do it." She was a bit of a dinosaur but now there is a very enthusiastic therapist who uses more modern techniques. Unfortunately you can't ask for a good therapist Smile

I have done therapy in special schools and been faced with the ratio issues you describe but there are ways round it.. the SALT could "push in" to classroom activities and offer intervention alongside an assistant, either individually (while other children are engaged with the others but in the same room) or in pairs or small groups as it sounds like they are suggesting.

If there has been a tremendous amount of training done on groups with the school, they are unlikely to accept a request for a SALT to be present at all sessions I think. Though I would still ask as I know colleagues of mine do offer ongoing weekly groups to children with complex special needs so again it can be very area dependent.

Sorry if this is no help!

nappyaddict · 13/01/2011 21:10

working9while5

"If there has been a tremendous amount of training done on groups with the school, they are unlikely to accept a request for a SALT to be present at all sessions I think."

The language group is always run by a SALT. This term it is appropiate for DS so he is attending but the SALT changes the focus of it each term so next term it might not be appropiate for DS to go to.

This is where my concern lies. So this term he is going to get regular contact with the SALT but next term and the term after he may get no direct contact with her at all.

If staff are very well trained in the Derbyshire Language Scheme do you think it is OK for that to completely replace direct contact with the SALT or do you still think there should be some direct contact with the SALT to compliment what the teachers and teaching assistants are doing on a daily basis within the curriculum?

OP posts:
working9while5 · 14/01/2011 10:40

I'll be honest, I don't really know. I'd like to think that it would be best for your son to have contact with the SALT but I don't know enough about your situation or the people involved etc and that might not be true.

I suppose, thinking that way, what you should be looking for is building in an assurance that he is making equal amounts of progress in each condition e.g. whether the SALT is giving him a group or his targets are being delivered collaboratively.

What about something like:

X will attend a minimum of 18 language group sessions this academic year. At least one block of these (6 sessions) should be run by a qualified and registered speech and language therapist and be appropiate for X's communication and educational needs. X should access a minimum of 12 additional language group sessions (or 2 blocks) devised by a qualified and registered speech and language therapist and determined to be appropriate to his communication and educcational needs to be delivered by an adequately trained member of X's school staff. Progress should be reviewed after 6 school-delivered sessions by the SALT. Should progress in the school-delivered group be equivalent to progress in the SALT-delivered group, the SALT should review and update targets for a subsequent group and provide staff training where necessary to meet these targets. Should progress in the school-delivered group be less than the SLT-delivered group, the SALT should include X in another language group to provide dynamic assessment of the target. The minimum amount of direct speech and language therapy may be supplemented by additional work with a qualified and registered speech and language therapist or other appropriate worker in line with his evolving communication and educational needs as determined by the Speech and Language Therapy Service."

This would give you more information for annual review as it should become clear which was most appropriate (as IMO, it might be either). It also asks the SALT service to prove their contention that working through others is as effective. The Health Professions Council says that we must be sure that the therapy that others deliver on our behalf is good and adequate training has been delivered (though this rarely gets picked up on in real life!). If the school-delivered sessions are more effective, you will still be doing well because the SALT still has to devise and train them to deliver them and offer individualised targets??

Just brainstorming!

working9while5 · 14/01/2011 10:41

Ps dynamic assessment is big news in learning disability literature!

nappyaddict · 14/01/2011 15:23

working9while5 The teacher/teaching assistants don't do any specific language work as such it is just constantly delivered in the way they talk to the children throughout the day and deliver the curriculum. The only language groups delivered in school are by SALT IYSWIM.

OP posts:
nappyaddict · 24/01/2011 16:36

It appears I actually got this wrong and teaching staff do run language groups as well which has made me happier.

We have between us come up with:

When groups are organised by the Speech and Language therapist and/or Speech and Language Therapy Assistant, that are appropiate for X's language or speech sound development levels and age, he will be included. This will be a minimum of 6 hours per academic year. This will be in addition to the three termly reviews and provision specified in (u). In addition, X will attend language groups run by school staff (when language groups run by the Speech and Language therapist and/or Speech and Language Therapy Assistant are not appropiate for Toby-Jack's language or speech sound development levels and age.)

I can't decide whether to include the bit in brackets. Basically he attends language groups run by school staff anyway and SALT ones are on top. I'm not sure if the bit in brackets makes it sound like he will only attend school groups if he doesn't go to SALT ones?

OP posts:
mariamagdalena · 28/01/2011 19:15

I'd suggest leaving out the bits in brackets. I think you're right that it makes it sounds like 'instead of' rather than 'as well as'. Plus maybe a les specific bit about the language programme the school use and how it's delivered (so that, if they try to dump this aspect of provision in future cost cutting, it's in his statement)

nappyaddict · 03/02/2011 16:25

What sort of thing do you mean :)

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page