Your ASD DC's behaviour towards siblings

[tiredmummyoftwo]

DS almost 5.4 has been behaving like big bully with DD (NT, 3). Some of you may remember DS was diagnosed with childhood autism at the age of 2.5. Well, he has improved a lot since the time of diagnosis to the extent that if he did not have his behavioural problems, he would come across as somebody with speech delay. When I say behavioural problems, it does not mean he has severe tantrum or meltdowns, in fact he has not had a tantrum since the age of 2.8. He cries if he does not want to do something, but will follow the instructions. By behavioural problem I mean some of his actions like if he is sitting on a carpet with other kids he thinks kicking the boy sitting in front of him is funny (he does not kick hard), if he is swimming and somebody sitting by the pool, he will take mouthful of water and spit at them. Or he will run away and continuously look back to see if your chasing him in a place where he is not supposed to like on the road. Recently he has also taken to pushing other kids if he does not want to share a toy. We have been doing big consequences with him like if he spits at the swimming pool, we leave immediately, so he does not get to swim (he loves swimming).

We try to take away whatever he is doing at the time to punish him for his behaviour, but his behaviour with DD is getting extreme. For example, he does not want to go to school every morning, but he knows he will have to, so he will say one screaming no and run to DD and start screaming right on her face until she starts crying and then will quite happily walk to the car. I tried putting DD in the car before him but he will do that in the car if he does not get the chance to make her cry in the house. Sometimes he will go and push her or kick her for no reason to see her cry. He will change the DVD DD's watching for no reason just to make her upset. He does love her as well, so if he does not see her for a bit, he will ask to play with her and give her a hug when he sees her. It seems that he is the boss with DD and he wants to make her do everything he wants her to do. Obviously that does not happen, as DD has a mind of her own.

Any suggestions any body about how to deal with this? Thanks in advance.

ohhhh.....I really feel for you. I have had a similar situation with mine 2(both 1 year younger than yours), the older being with ASD.

Consequences does not always work for us as DS doesnt often understand why is he being removed from the situation. However when pushes/hits his brother he goes in timeout and oh boy does he understands it, he screams but at least after the time out he will run into giving him a kiss and hug (promted to do so sometimes as in the anger mode he forgets). I am afraid but a good behaviour modification is the only answer. You stop the behaviour with 2 verbal prompts followed by a physical promps (redirection) until the behaviour fades. And the behaviouralist I saw the other week said that if I kept consistency with that I will have an angel at xmas...really looking forward to that!

In the school setting, I have been told is a sensory seeking issue, tactile (need to touch the next person) and this can be extinguished either by same steps above (if teacher is patient enough) or engaging him with a favourite toy to keep still and stop disturbing others. Same with the shouting to your DD, sensory seeking as he knows the predicted output (crying).

The pushing/hitting/not willingness to share I have been told is that the ASD person wants to stay in control hence everything that you make not on their terms is tearing them apart.

I sent off my DS to school this morning almost in tears and felt really bad for it but I see the approach working and I am not giving up although had a few tears myself in the car on the way back with some chanting 'its for his own good, for his own good, own good'!

thank you blueshark. Unfortunately, time out does not work for us, we still give time out, but he seems to sit through them no problem although protesting and if DD is near him will push her more. Our ABA consultant suggested to remove DD from the situation without giving him eye contact. We do most of the time (it's not always possible to remove DD who would not leave her fav TV programme for example), he says sorry and then does it again. Problem is we know if DD could sit through it once he would not do it again, but obviously she is too young to understand that. We are not sure it's sensory seeking though, he covers up his ears as he hates the sound of her crying other times. It's more like he has fun making her cry. He does not have much sensory issues, not that we are aware of and this hitting or pushing other kids has only started recently, so is his behaviour with DD. I am going to try the two prompts and then physical prompt suggestion from today, hopefully it will work, praying for it to work.

good luck x

Oh goodness, this was such a huge problem for us until just recently. DS2 (5) hurt DD (2) constantly - so constantly that I began to worry that she would bare the scares of an abused child. He pinched her, hit her, bit her, punched her. Even my presence wouldn't necessarily prevent it, such was his determination. I was close to a breakdown because it really was utterly relentless. Yet, like your son, TMof2, he also seemed to love her.

About 6 weeks ago we bought a dog because we noticed how much calmer and less violent he was around animals, and now the violence has reduced from tens of times a day to tens of times a month. Within the same timeframe, violence towards his teachers reduced significantly, too. Records report 43 times one morning, but now it tends to be 4 - 8 times a day-ish. I'm not saying that's the solution for you, by any means. That's just our story, that's all. But I so sympathise - it's apalling to see someone you love as much as one child being hurt by someone you love as much as the other child.

I really don't have much advice - I don't think I dealt with it particularly expertly myself, but I just had to post and empathise.

I just want to add that (I've changed my name from Lagaanisace) although I used to be eaten up with the worry that it would affect DD psychologically, now it's eased off I can look at things more objectively and I realise that she's fine. In fact, she's great. She was obviously hurt and upset a lot as it happened, but she's surrounded by so much love and I really think that the hardship coupled with lots of love has actually helped her to be a resilient, happy little girl.

Thanks chocolatespread (how do you change name on MN?), we also sometimes worry about DD's psychological well being, but she is becoming more resillient too. DS loves dog, but getting a dog is not an option for us ( I think both set of grandparents will abandon us). DS does not show any violence towards anybodyelse except DD, yes he pushes other kids, but it stops at that and it's only when he does not want to share. He still has not learnt that or say no I am not giving it. So I think we have to push that more. We are more worried because he does not have sense of danger, so when he pushes DD off the sofa, he does not understand how dangerous his actions are. However, I do think DS will stop paying any attention to the world if we get him a dog including DD. He is besotted with our neighbours dogs.

You change your name by going to 'mymumsnet' and then changing you profile.

In our case, the violence was towards DD and his 2 TAs, but not really towards anyone else so it's similar to your DS. One thing his TA said today at a meeting with the SENCO and Ed Psych is that she takes a step back, holds both hands up and says' "no!", and then swiftly moves on to something else. I think I will try to teach that to DS1 (7) and DD as she gets older, for when he is violent. Personally I find DS2's behaviour really hard to modify, but I maybe can alter his siblings' reactions to it. Just an idea I had.

Thank you chocolatespread, changed the name (somebody the other day commented that she was reading a post on MN who talks about similar things like me ). Yes, if we could alter DD's reactions to his actions, it would stop, but no matter how much I explain to her about hanging in there, she can't. She tries her best though. The problem is that I am worried if we can't nip the problem in the bud, it will escalate towards other people. We are just starting our half term, so I am dreading the week as DH is away and I have both of them on my own.

Oh, goodness, half terms are tough, aren't they? And it's so hard to get anything done because you simply have to referee for the younger sibling and keep the situation monitored. During the holidays, our house ends up looking as though we've had burglars.

"It seems that he is the boss with DD and he wants to make her do everything he wants her to do. Obviously that does not happen, as DD has a mind of her own."

This rang such a bell with me - DS doesn't know how to be a brother to DD, so what he does is "parent" her. Some aspects of it are lovely in that he looks out for her and is protective of her, but she finds it frustrating as she sees it as being bossed around by 3 people instead of two.

I think that your situation should improve as your yonger child gets older and you are able to explain why your DS does what he does.

I think that everything that you are doing is right, but I do feel for you with the holidays coming up as its blooming hard work.