Sorry to ask but really really need help, anyone with knowledge of statement banding/hours/funding

[alfiemama]

OK had a review of Alfie's statement yesterday and it was agreed to definitely up to band d but a proposal of band e to be put to the board. Currently band c.

Head has called us this morning to say Alfie only gets funding for 15 hours and she funds the extra 2 hours and wants to take them back(cost cutting etc) as she has to pay for Leis £650 a term. So she is basically saying if we get band E we will get 25 hours but if we get band D we will only get an additional 2.5 hours a week. Therefore we went through the grief of the past month for an extra half an hour a day!!!!!!!

I must point out, she says pot of money now and not hours that they are allocated.

On Alfie's old statement though it clearly states he should get a minimum of 17 hours 1-1 in a maximum small team of 6. Additional therapy of SALT and OT and a specialist teacher input of a minimum 3 hours per term (I am presuming this is the LEIS)

I do know he was on ESAP funding at first for 15 hours and then once we got the final statement it was upped to 17 hours.

Has anyone got any ideas/thoughts on this? Is someone trying to pull the wool over our eyes? I wonder why she never mentioned this yesterday

It may all be above board, but seems rather strange to me.

Really would appreciate help and advice

Sorry can't help, just bumping for you.

Aw thanks hun

Is there an alternative school for him to go to, or how long will it be before he goes on to the next level of school.

oops sorry we dont do hun on here do we

Thanks Lucinda, really would like to avoid this, as in general they are very supportive. Sorry he is 6 in yr1 as repeated reception.

bumping if thats ok

Similar experience but basically head is saying that she wants you to fight the LEA with her. My head said something similar so I called my case officer and said how important it was that she get the extra hours. They then asked the school to provide additional information about hours that needed to be covered. They then gave her the funding that she needed.

This money isn't easy to come by you have to fight for it and remember the school doesn't have that much power compared to parents with the LEA. The school will always ask for more money but the LEA will only grant it if the parents kick up a fuss. Or that's how it works in my area. We started off with 9 hours and after four years have 28.

Good luck

Thanks daisysue2, we have kicked up a fuss yesterday at the review and think, well hope we will get the band E funding, but feel like the head is trying to claw back 2hours from us, which to be fair is ok (not great but hey ho) on the band E but if we get the band D and the board reject the E proposal, it is only an additional 4.5 hours a week, so if she takes back the mysterious 2 hours, that she says she funds (even though statement says 17 hours) he just wont have enough hours.

Basically she is saying she gets £4.5k for Alfie's band c she has to pay for 17 hours TA
but she has been only paying for 15 hours as she has to pay LEIS £650 for their support, so she is saying she has covered Alfies additional 2 hours a week out of the school funds.

There is a magic number which makes it better for the school on statements. It's normally around 22/25 hours. Then they get much more funding for that child from the LEA up to that figure they have to provide that out of their own budget. As you say they go from one banding to the next. Is it a special school or mainstream as I only have experience of mainstream as I know special school work in a completely different way and can basically do what they want with the funding.

alfiemama Banding documents for Lancashire here

Basically, the core of the issue is your DS's statement. It says he should get "he should get a minimum of 17 hours 1-1 in a maximum small team of 6." So what does that actually mean? It means that he can be taught in a group of up to 6 for 17 hours per week with a TA.

It seems that the school is being allocated 4.5k for alfie, which perhaps would equate to 17 hours per week of TA support (£6.96 x 17 x 38 = £4496.15). But, in order to either access the support for alfie given by LEIC, or perhaps for their part in recruiting the TA or some other service LEIC have given them for Alfie, they have had to pay £650. If they take that amount off of the £4500, that only leaves them £101.32 per week to meet his needs, so 15 hours at £6.75 per hour. I obviously am guessing because I don't know TA rates for your area.

Its mainstream Daisy.
It just feels unjust to now try and take 2 hours off us.

Band D
Alfie on now 17 hours, so should get additional 4.5 taking him to 21.5 but minus her 2hours = 19.5

Band E
Alfie gets 17 hours, plus additional 9 taking him to 26 hours minus her 2 hours = 24

Its really peeing me off now, why do we always have to fight for our kids. I'm 9 months pregnant and really could do without this, the head knows this, as so how uncomfortable at the meeting I was yesterday. They are messing with the wrong ones here lol.

Thanks Lougle, that sounds bob on.

However Alfie is on his own in the afternoon with no TA, hence our little hissy fit. Also this is based on old statement which was prior to dx, he has now been fully dx with mid range asd and was agreed by all parties that he needs much more support to be given by TA/Banding/SALT/OT/LEIS. The Salt explained that Alfie is very complexed and his problem is a very serious one, which will take lots of work on his own and in small groups, all of this will surely take time which needs to be accounted for.

I'm hearing you and believe me I spend hours fighting for my daughter and setting the right tone to all my letters, phone calls etc. It's a nightmare. But girl in my DDs school is far worse than her but gets fewer hours because parents didn't fight for it. As you get more dxs it makes it easier to push your point.

Give the case worker a call and tell them you need the hours and when will you get them. They do tend to do nothing if you don't. Just one phone call to start the ball rolling.

Maybe ask for the wording to be changed to say 28 hours of access to 1-1 with 17 hours in groups of no more than six. That way he would be covered throughout the day but wouldn't lose his small groups. I'm not saying they will give it to you but you need to start somewhere.

Just keep pushing one goal at a time. Good luck.

As a parent it really should not be your problem who funds what.

Your son should be assessed, the results of the assessment should determine the amount of hours your son needs & agreed in a statement in order to access the curriculum.

Your only debate should be about weather or not you believe the assessment is correct & if the amount of hours recommended meets his needs.

What band it is in (whatever that means) or whos budget it comes from is irrelevant to you.

Don't let them tie you up in their internal politics & system, its an excuse for stalling & delaying implimenting the additional support.

Absolutely agree Anonandlikeit. They should say right we will give you 25-26 hours of a Teaching assistants time and thats its. I would rather pay £650 a year for Leis (out of DLA ) and let Alfie have more quality teaching and support time, why should he have to fund for the teaching assistant to receive training, which in essence is what he is doing.

Unforunately there is no minimum sn or dx specific training that a TA must have BUT the school MUST meet your childs needs & the head must do that by providing suitable support.
If the head is not able to do that with exisitng trained staff then the head is accountable & your ds's allocated support hours should not use to train the TA.

Wrong on many many levels, again its not about the budget its about the head not managing effectively.

One of the governors should have responsibility for the schools SEN policy, have you ahd a word with them?

The head has just emailed to say basically, she understands our concerns but at the end of day she has to balance her books.

In Alfie's statement this is what it says with regard to Leis

The specialist teacher input should be for a minimum of 3 hours per term and should include.

3a attendance and contribution at target setting and review meetings.

3b advice to Alfie's TA as to the appropriate strategies and resource of Alfie's needs.

3c Advice to ensure that individual programmes are in place

3d a written report at Alfie's review

3e Access to TA time to support the school in providing for Alfie. This should be used to carry out the individual programme as identified. Following advice from specialist teacher and other relevant professionals.

3f This will involve working with Alfie either individually or in a small group (max 6 pupils) on a daily basis for a min of 17 hours per week.

Then it says further on about funding
Band c. The support which is detailed above can be providedfrom this budget and the schools own resources.

The level of funding is sufficient to allow for a flexible mix of individual, group and whole class support to meet Alfie's changing needs.

Obv this is not the whole statement

Alfiemama, I don't want to cause you more stress, but read that again. NOWHERE does it say that alfie has to have 17 hours 1:1.

He has to have 17 hours of support either individually or in a small group of max 6 children.

So, he could, theoretically, be put in a group with 6 children who all have some ESAP funding, and the funds pooled to provide 1 TA who spends time with them for 17 hours.

Or, he could be put with a child who has, say, band c funding, giving 17 hours, and 1 TA giving them both 1:2 support.

Do you see? As long as your DS is getting 17 hours per week in a group of 6 or less, even if the whole class gets some time in small groups with a TA, and as long as he is getting at least a portion of each day in a group of 6 or less, they are fulfilling the statement.

Also, nothing there says that the school has to use the whole funding allocation on Alfie - if they can provide the statement provision without using all the money, they can, and they can then use any other money as they please.

Thanks Lougle, hmmm I see what you mean, didn't realise about the funds being pooled though.
Lets just hope the new statement would be worded differently if he is moved up a banding.
Do you think we should keep quiet until we receive the statement? Do they send a proposed again like last time and then you have so long to respond?

Also Lougle, if we end up on band d and do end up with an additional 4.5 hours and the head takes the 2 hours back, so we then end up with 30 mins extra a day, (clearly not enough according to the professionals) who do we fight this with and how?

You can't, unless the statement is worded to specifically state provision of 21.5 hours 1:1. If it is specified that he receives 21.5 hours 1:1 support, then he has to get it.

If it is worded to say that they provide the funding for up to, access to, a mixture of 1:1, small group and whole class, etc - that gives the head the wriggle room to restrict it because she has to pay LEIC £650.

However, you can take the whole thing to the first tier tribunal - if it is an Annual Review.

The wording "changing needs" is a way that they wriggle out of the statement being more specified. You need to get this wording removed. Yes you will have 15 days to make comments or ask for changes.

Thanks Lougle and Wasuup. They are sneaky grrrrr.
I think I will wait now until we receive proposed statement but really we need to get the wording changed. I am see child physc next week, who has helped us loads, so she may be able to help us.

But if I have to I will certainly take this to a tribunal.

Thanks for all your help and advice ladies.

Oh and another thought, they will probably not change it to soley 1-1 as Alfie's main problems are social, so they need to work with him in small groups. Its never easy it?