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SN children

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Original poster

I need advice to stop this happening again please help!!!

18 replies

TheLadyEvenstar · 06/10/2010 10:42

I have just had a call from the school, he has been excluded for fighting - which is so so unlike him. they explained the other child got right up in his face. Now while I don't agree with what he has done, I can NOW understand why he has but desperatly need to find other ways for him to express his fear/anger etc without lashing out. Which until now has been secluded to home only.

OP posts:

asdx2 · 06/10/2010 10:54

I don't think it will be something you can fix easily tbh. It took years to teach ds to remove himself from a situation instead of lashing out.I watched him obsessively, worked out that his shoulders rising and deep breathing preceded an attack and then initially took him to a chill out space and then prompted and he went himself. Now he recognises the signs himself and goes unprompted.He is rewarded for going to chill.
At school he has a get out card and he has ft 1 to 1 support so he shows the card and leaves. On the one occasion he was riled by a child grabbing his bag he knocked his chair over and slammed the door but he didn't touch the child so was rewarded for going to chill even without showing the card.The child in question was punished for trying to provoke a situation that could have had disastrous consequences (he could have badly harmed him)

auntevil · 06/10/2010 11:05

TLE - you say fighting - that takes 2 - what happened to the other child? were they excluded? How long is he being excluded for? I know that the policy at our MS school is that fighting is not tolerated and both parties are excluded for the rest of the day. Try to get an agreement with school as asdx2 said, but make sure that your DS is not being singled out for punishment. I saw your post in AIBU. How are the school dealing with dx?

imahappycamper · 06/10/2010 11:06

Oh dear, been there. School is a different matter from home. Has he got a Statement? Does the school put anything in place to help him? How long is the exclusion for?
I hate exclusions. It always seems it punishes me more than my DS, who is glad to have time off school.

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 06/10/2010 23:53

Ok had another call and basically there are 2 versions of what happened.

Version 1

DS1 was working with his group and Child A came over to his table, DS1 told him to get lost and Child A lashed out at DS1. DS1 hit back.

Version 2

Child A walked to DS1's table DS1 told him to get lost and then elbowed him and punched him - they got into a fight.

Both have been excluded, I have a meeting at school at 10am and will be told then how long the exclusion is for.

There is no statement and the school have said they will give DS1 a "Get out" card but don't want him using it as an excuse so are trying to decide what to do.

And yes I feel I am being punished as well....bad of me I know

OP posts:

auntevil · 07/10/2010 15:14

Let us know how it all went. Sounds to me like whichever version of events happened, your DS did not go looking for a fight. Child A went to your DS. It's an important detail. your DS was confronted with a situation not of his choosing. Regardless of the final event, the school is aware that your DS finds these situations difficult.
Sorry - must dash - school pick up.

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 16:39

i am back and I have to admit while I will defend DS1 I will not be delibratly lied to.

Apparently what happened is

Child A walked to the table where DS1 was working with a group of children to see what he was meant to be doing. DS1 told him 2get lost shithead" and obviously Child A took offence. DS1 slapped him he slapped ds1 they started fighting and were then seperated and put in 2 seperate rooms to write a statement.The other 2 children who were close by were also taken at the same time seperated and wrote statements. Child A,B, and C all matched on events.DS1s layed the blame on Child A and made himself the victim.

During the meeting DS1 was asked to tell us what had happened and he slipped up big time. He said "Child A walked past me and I slapped him so he slapped me back".

The problem I have is I know he 90% has got ASD and he does for definate have ODD but how do I deal with it? he knows right from wrong, he knows I detest fighting and rudeness, he knows I will not tolerate either - so what do i do????

OP posts:

auntevil · 07/10/2010 17:01

How did the school deal with it? Have they offered up any strategies to help him deal with confrontational situations? Are they looking to support you with pursuing a statement? how are they going to make sure this event is not repeated for all concerned in school?
as far as when you get him home - it's the same as how you would deal with the situation if it were another of your DCs i suppose. Only you know what kind of sanctions will make the event less likely to happen again.
How does your DS feel about the situation - or does he not really understand what the fuss is all about?

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 17:20

How does your DS feel about the situation - or does he not really understand what the fuss is all about?

The thing is and I know this is going to sound mad.

Yes he understands 100% he can explain what happened and what he did wrong, what others did wrong etc and why I am so annoyed with him. But he also says "I don't care"

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auntevil · 07/10/2010 17:26

I can go with that , my DS at the weekend told me that it is far more fun to be naughty than good. Did the school make it clear to him what would happen if he did this again? Future consequences?

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 17:33

he is on a 3day exclusion so will be back at school on Tuesday and any further bad behaviour will be met with an appropriate punishment.

OP posts:

auntevil · 07/10/2010 20:47

3 days is a bit harsh. Does your DS feel it is a punishment or is he glad not to be at school? Only ask as boy in DS1's class hates school and is always trying to get excluded. They made his punishment staying extra after school with the threat of saturdays as well if he didn't start behaving!

Littlefish · 07/10/2010 20:51

auntevil - do you really think 3 days is harsh for telling someone to "get lost shithead" and slapping them? It sounds reasonable to me.

TLE - how are you investigating the ASD? Are the school supporting you? Have you spoken to anyone from your local autism outreach team?

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 20:55

He loves school thats the thing. He is already staying everyday after school for an extra hour and half as he won't do homework at home.

He has since going back to school on 7th of september had 12 dententions and 4 he hasn't attended.

I told the school they needed to give him a punishment that meant something rather than a 1 day exclusion because he thinks it is a joke...thats the ODD, i believe???

So they take on board what I say and have done just that.

At the end of the day and I may be very wrong but I don't think aspergers or odd give him the right to be rude, disrespectful or get away with fighting etc.

OP posts:

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 20:58

Littlefish, we haven't got a formal diagnosis yet. we only have 1 dr who said he is 80-90% sure it is ASD.

So I am not putting everything in that basket iyswim?

I know one thing though, I am not going to let anyone use this as a way for DS1 to get away with too much.

I am not on about reacting to someone upsetting or hurting him I mean like this inident, he was in the wrong big time.

Also I have not investigated it too much more as I previously stated it all became a jumbled mess reading online. Also because we don't have a formal DX I haven't contacted anyone from the outreach team.

OP posts:

auntevil · 07/10/2010 21:00

i do think it's harsh as it also punishes the parent - 3 days off work. If you take into consideration that the school must be aware that TLE's DS's behaviour is an issue that hasn't been fully addressed.
There is also a problem generally with a lack of consistency of punishment in schools. My neighbours lad (ASD) was beaten on the last day of term last year. It was so bad that they took him to A&E. The police wanted to investigate, but the HT said that they would deal with it - this was before the mum could get up there. the lad that did it was made to sit inside for the rest of lunch break. The HT didn't want to start the new term on a sour note, so that was to be it. The bruising to my neighbours lad lasted 6-8 ish weeks. Same school - you swear 3 times - you're excluded!

mariagoretti · 07/10/2010 21:12

Glad your ds likes school & sees exclusion as a punishment. My ds asked today what being expelled was, & if you got time off! Told him he'd be sitting with worksheets & boring mum everyday 9-3.10 in the tatty community centre while his friends had fun at school.

Original poster

TheLadyEvenstar · 07/10/2010 21:14

I am lucky/unlucky i don't work...whichever way you look at it tbh!! But yes there has been a lack of assistance in the past. However these 2 boys - DS1 and Child A were friends up until a few weeks ago when a "game" they played got out of hand and there has been terrible tension since.

3 Days of him off school is not going to be a walk in the park for any of us BUT I am hoping it will give DS1 time to reflect on what he did wrong.

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auntevil · 08/10/2010 12:58

I'm really glad your DS likes school and i can see that this punishment is likely to be more effective. i'm all for schools using their initiative on what is likely to have the greatest impact for the long term good. I just know a few parents that have constant exclusions for 'bad' behaviour who are AD and ASD that hate school. Any punishment given has to make the child less likely to want to repeat their behaviour - if indeed they can always control that behaviour.

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