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How can I stop him touching people?

21 replies

aloha · 29/08/2005 18:32

Ds is nearly four, intelligent but dyspraxic with some sensory issues. He seems young for his years socially and can be very impulsive. We currently have a problem with his constantly touching people, which can take the form of slapping or patting though this afternoon he deliberately ran into a man sitting down drinking hot tea, which was potentially dangerous. This but is very disconcerting for people, and of course, other children hate it (their parents aren't crazy about it either, I imagine). He will usually just go up to an adult or child and slap them - almost never hard enough to hurt them. He seems to have enough control not to hurt, but not enough to resist the impulse to touch or slap. It's becoming a bit of a nightmare atm, as he does it so frequently. He is worse when tired, hungry or thirsty (though he rarely tells us he is thirsty, we just have to guess from his behaviour!). We have come home early from two activities today (just the park and the Somerset House fountains) because he won't stop doing it. He lost an ice cream this pm because of it as well, and was distraught (he hit a little girl - just went up to her and slapped her arm). He is quite obsessed with touching people - he will also go up and cuddle fairly random women and pet and kiss babies.
Don't really know why he is doing this and totally at a loss to know how to stop it. We've told him over and over again not to touch people he doesn't know. He is taken home and watched like a hawk. We are SHATTERED! I expect this flurry of hitting/patting is a phase (he has always done this to some extent) but what should we do?

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batters · 29/08/2005 18:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

aloha · 29/08/2005 18:47

Thanks - I know this is a bad time to post.

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jayzmummy · 29/08/2005 19:00

aloha...I posted a couple of weeks about the same thing.
Our problem is that J is slapping so hard that it bloody hurts. He snuggles up to you and you tink you are having a precious hug when all of a sudden whack!!!
He is slapping strangers now and I worry so much about it.
We have been trying to use social stories etc but not having much sucess so far.
Just be firm and stick to your guns...slapping = time out/loss of treats etc.

aloha · 29/08/2005 19:01

it's tiring having to watch them every second, isn't it?

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jayzmummy · 29/08/2005 19:02

knackering....make sure you get some time out for yourself.

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 19:39

ds1 does this- the only way I've managed it is to stop it before it happens (although he's fast). If we walk past people on the street and he looks a bit grabby I hold both hands. Haven't found any other way although I'm guessing social stories would work well with your ds.

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 19:40

jm- ds1 does that- cuddle then pinch. or close up smile then pinch. His teachers are wise to it now.

macwoozy · 29/08/2005 20:02

My ASD ds does this too, slapping, hitting, pinching, growling(!) at total strangers and it has spoilt many days out. His school wondered if it was his way of gaining attention. Last week he walked past a child who was crying and just pushed him with no warning. I've tried punishments/rewards to encourage him not to do this, but he's so impulsive, I don't think he's capable of thinking about the consequences. aloha I'm afraid I have no advice but I do understand how stressful this can be.

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 20:05

think its unlikely to be attention seeking (schools thinking along NT lines again!). ds1 laughs at anyone crying (stands in front of them holding his ears laughing and jumping up and down).

jayzmummy · 29/08/2005 20:37

Im so sure its a sensory thing.
I remember a while back there was some info posted here about the chemical "buzz" that children get when they hit their heads.
J whacked me earlier today and I went through the routine of "No" etc but he sat there laughing at me and saying "but its nice".
I wonder if the "buzz" he gets when he his hitting his head off the wall is so nice that he feels he wants to share the feeling????

I wish we could get it under control because he thumped DH yesterday in the eye and now everyone keeps asking DH if I was the one who gave him the nice black eye he has....sounds horrid when DH explains that J did it...I can just imagine the neighbours warning their children to stay away

aloha · 29/08/2005 20:42

Oh bloody hell! I tend to wonder if ds is so impulsive still (think the idea of dyspraxia as brain immaturity really feels right) that I'm not sure he will find it easy to control this.
Jimjams, once again, I remove my metaphorical hat and wave it in your direction - I know I shouldn't feel mortified, but I do. He is so heart rending when he pleads 'Oh mummy, please, I'm so sorry, I've learned my lesson. I will never, ever do it again" - and ten minutes later he's slapping/pushing/running into someone else (or kissing or hugging). I really can't work out why he's doing it as the consequences (extreme parental crossness/going home/no ice cream) are so severe.
I think I'd be in a loony bin if I were you Jimjams. And finding it pleasantly restful

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aloha · 29/08/2005 20:44

jayzmummy - yes, I also think it must be some kind of sensory thing.....but what?!
Ds is very, very verbal and will make all the promises under the sun but won't/can't keep them.
Tell me more about social stories though.

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Jimjams · 29/08/2005 20:58

definitely sensory- when ds1 has had gluten so all his channels are screwed he whacks the crap out of his head. Massive bruising.

touching people- Lucy Blackman who wrote the most amazing book ever (for me as she's so like ds1) used to have to touch people before she could see them- she described it as an extension of her visual world and uncontrollable. Sensory issues in autism and dyspraxia are similar (see stella waterhouse's book for lomg explanations) so could be something similar. when ds3 is asleep I'll look for an excerpt.

loony bin would be fine with alcohol. met a long lost friend today - saw her practivcally daily when ds1 was 0-2 (and we moved). Seen her once since until today. ds1 was pretty good today and dh was with us so easier but she said if it was her she wouldn't go out she'd stay at home and hide. I know what she means...

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 20:59

social stories

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 21:02

social stories on personal space- could be adapted adding piccies is good too.

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 21:36

OK the words of Lucy Blackman- from Lucy's Story

"In the same way I had not quite distinguished the difference between seeing and touching other people. If my hand reached to another person, the movement that I made was a kind of extension to my sight, like a feely-touchy eye. This made me look very odd to strangers, because where someone else would give covert glances I would carress or poke.......

There are more embarrassing applications of touch0sight. Occasionallly I would grab a wrist, a finger, or some other bit attaqched to someone else's body and examine it by touch or smell or vision. Holes like mouths or ears fascinated me, but, though I can remember opening someone's mouth to look inside, I do not think that I realised that I was constructed the same way...."

She's non-verbal btw- but can write a book and take a regular English degree (she's 33 now). Amazing.

Jimjams · 29/08/2005 21:36

ds1 grabs hands etc- and I've written on here a lot about making people scream to see inside their mouths. He is so like Lucy Blackman.

aloha · 29/08/2005 22:03

I can really see from your descriptions of ds1 why you can relate so strongly to this book. This is all very interesting (though, frankly, a bit depressingly intereresting iyswim).
I think I will do a social story for ds - he lives for books and stories - so he will be fascinated, especially if he is the 'hero' of the story.
I think I need to play around with it a bit and print it out to read in exactly the same way every time - he has a phenomenal memory for stories and can spot a word out of place!
Thanks for all this.
And I agree that for ds touch is an extension of sight - and very important as a way for him to make sense of the world. He also has poor depth perception and this is also part of it.

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Jimjams · 29/08/2005 22:59

Lucy Blackman says lots about depth perception as well - a lot of her problems were to do with depth perception. Again like ds1 who couldn't walk from carpet to wood,

"I was less hesiitant about moving down slopes, and remembered then that when we had walked after school the previous year, sometimes my feet had hit the ground while my sight had told me I still had several inches in hand. No wonder I had psyched myself up by bouncing around".

I don't find it depressing- tbh- I find it inspiring (along with Roz Blackburn- who despite being verbal is more severely autistic than ds1 or Lucy Blackburn). Despite the severity of her disability (she does not live independently) she is able to express herself extremely well and describe her world. It's been a godsend to me- as her behaviours so often mirror ds1's - and she can explain why he's behaving like that (eg why he sometimes cannot walk under trees- again its depth perception). If ds1 can ever express himself in this way (I think its unlikely that will happen) I would be overjoyed. It's a real gift- even if your world is still veyr limited you can begin to communicate your problems and needs.

Lucy's mother is great as well- very human- spends half the book being cross (just like me) and bullying Lucy into doing things (Roz Blackburn also spoke about the importance of that). It makes me feel less awful when I have to do it (daily!) Also the things that she did- pounding the streets for massivley long walks - are the things we do as well- and it just so happens that they helped Lucy learn language (seriously!) so its given some validity to something that ds1 also enjoys.

I want to write a thank you to Lucy Blackman- am not sure how to- via the publishers I guess.

aloha · 29/08/2005 23:50

ah, long walks are something ds does not do! Or short walks, if he has anything to do with it. He tires really easily and then we have the problems associated with being tired. He has poor muscle tone and is very - overly - flexible. Thank God for buggy boards.
Will definitely do the social stories. I think they will suit him and we definitely have nothing to lose.
I can see how these books help you get inside ds's mind. I keep having to tell myself to stop asking ds why he has done something as I'm sure at his age he really has no idea.
And yes, you could definitely write to her via her publisher.

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Saker · 30/08/2005 13:51

Aloha

Ds2 has the same problems with controlling his behaviour. Yesterday we had some friends to stay and Ds2 kept pushing her on the trampoline. In spite of threats to remove him he continued. When I did make him get off he was distraught, won't do it anymore. As soon as he is allowed back on then he does it again.

Why? He loves the trampoline, he was loving being able to play with his brother and this girl and being part of things. It's so difficult because the things that motivate other children like rewards and punishment just do nothing for him.

He can slip his hand into other peoples inappropriately although I wonder if that is because he mixes them up with me. And he has run up to completely strange children and pushed them. Again though I wonder if he thinks they are his brother who plays rough with him. He seems to have a lot of problems with recognising people.

Sorry none of it is much help except to say it does sound familiar. Another favourite with DS2 which I think must be sensory is scrabbling around in mud and dirt with sticks, dipping hands in mud and water and stamping in any pools of water that he can find, urine, soft drinks, sick he would merrily have a splash in any of it.

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