Have your say! Autism and education.

[woolytree]

Hi Ladies,

A relative of mine is doing research, for civil service, on the Educational needs of Autistic children in mainstream schools. She would like to know;

What are the main problems you come across?
Any positive points???
Any suggestions?

Short and sweet please ladies....not a rant post.

Thanks.

Dd1 is at MS and has AS, dd2 is starting in september and has ASD/severe speech delay.

Problems:

lack of training (staff have had no training or very little and some don't realy know what ASD is.

Safety, our school tends to leave gates open (the school is on a main road), dd2 has no sense of danger. School are working towards keeping them shut (how hard can it be?).

Bullying, i think this is a problem for most ASD children.

Positives:

Structure and routine, both dd's (as for most ASD children) thrive on structure and routine, our school does this well (better than i could do at home) and often use pictures and scheduals in the classroom.

Unable to distinguish between bad behaviour and asd.

Nowhere quiet for kids to retreat to - even the class room is mostly too noisy

They are so busy 'controlling' their behaviour that they don't actually teach them anything

DS's secondary has been fantastic with him.
But
It's a big school, over 1,500, and they have a lot of supply cover for one reason or another. Over the last couple of years (Y9 and Y10) the worst incidents of meltdown and rage from him have been when cover either hasn't stuck to the rules for him or just not known.
The other problem that has recently surfaced is that one or two teachers are accepting very average work from him, when he is capable of much more. But now I'm onto that, his days of coasting are over.
Teachers and I email a lot, they know he has good support if I know what's needed.

DS1 spent 4 terms in mainstream.

He should never have been there.

Main problems were lack of space for him, isolation from all children, lack of trained staff, no locked doors in school so he needed an adult with him at every minute of the day in case he escaped, inappropriate curriculum (yes he still follows the national curriculum at his SLD school but it adapted to ensure that every moment that can be used to encourage communication and behaviour is utitlised - he doesn't need a curriculum that focusses on academics), no chance to join in school activities such as plays and he wasn't allowed to go on school trips unless I went (despite him having full 1:1) . Finally from my point of view he was kept very part time in reception (things like 2 hours a day twice a week) which meant I was constantly having to pick him up and drop him off, also if a TA was off sick I might have his school day cancelled 10 minutes before I was due to leave.

I could go on, but you get the idea :o

No positives at all in his case.

Agree that mainstream really doesn't work for some, and secondary has been a much better experience for DS than primary was.
Mine's been on a couple of residential trips, in Y8 and Y9. They did him his own risk assessment and asked my my opinion of it.
Three days, with teachers who really wanted to make it work for him and everyone else.

Thanks all keep em coming and Ill pass it all on! :) .....however my DD, ASD, starts school in two weeks....now Im scared!

If there is any knowledge of ASD then at best it is a very stereotypical view.

SENCos and teachers believe if they have experience of 1 ASD child they are knowledgeable of ASD. It was infuriating when the SENCo who was great with ds was useless with dd because she isn't ds's clone.

Schools tend to see the difficulties but don't see the talents. Ds is pretty much non verbal but mathematically able and primary never grasped that.

Autism Outreach is bandied about as though it is a cure all. One visit occasionally to teach staff how to use visual timetables (suspect that's the limit in lots of cases) when staff neither understand the benefits (if needed) nor have the willingness to use them is NOT a cure all

'my DD, ASD, starts school in two weeks....now Im scared!'

Well, not all of us teachers are prone to stereotyping ASD behaviour, or feeling that parents are interfering.

My school has been good so far, DD only dx this week and we have already met with senco, have an inclusion teacher on board to advise, just waiting for full report of needs in sept.

Im aware, as is my relative, of the lack of provision/understanding across different areas. I suggested a campaign of understanding and training.....possibly with the help of NAS and its members may lead to a more uniformed approach in MS schools, of course aimed at providing for the individual needs of ASD children. Even so a work in progress and hopefully we can make a difference....we'll see.

.....With or without statement or dx!....especially as it takes so long to get dx!...in my experience.

Almost all my gripes come back to not being unable to see beyond the label which means different things in different contexts.

It means that they ignore some bad behaviour (nothing terrible but calling out, talking too loudly, interrupting) that they wouldn't tolerate in a NT child. It may take longer for my DS to get that some things aren't acceptable but if you don't try he will never get it.

Expecting him to have a problem with every alteration or change in his day when he doesn't.

Having a low expectation of him academically. DS hasn't made the expected 2 sub levels progress a year and I know that in any other child there would be a great deal of concern about this in his school. With DS I get some vague comment about some things being more difficult but no guidance on how to get over that.

Allowing him to opt out of things too much and not challenging him to try harder things.

They have an expectation of what a child with AS is like and don't take into account that all AS children are different.

For context DS has mild AS and dyspraxia and has been very well supported with regard to his OT requirements. Almost all the teachers have been 100% supportive but some have been NQT's and it makes a difference in how smoothly the year goes. NQT's need more support from experienced teachers/LSA's when dealing with a SEN child.

Staff training is definitely an issue. Plenty of the staff at my DSs' school, even with the best of intentions, find working with my kids a steep learning curve.

There are lots of positives, though. The kids are known, locally (we live in a village) and very much loved.

We have also had a much more positive experience regarding DS1's giftedness than previous posters. He doesn't want to do anything different from the other kids at school, but I've had plenty of help with supporting him and extending him at home.

Our autism outreach has also been fantastic. Yes, she did show them how to use visual timetables, which were great for DS1 in Reception. She then helped them to move beyond when he rejected them again on account of making him different.

Another saying lack of training for staff

lack of a quiet room to re group in

bullying

teachers need to use the scales of justice more and listen to what the child is trying to tell them.. Rather than say is a perception issue as all the other children say something different.. They need to break things down in to easy chunks.

More trained staff on play ground duty as asc children need supporting at the most unstructured noisy chaotic times of the day.. Playtime is he'll for a lot of asc children.. Thus resulting in stressed out dc's trying to then learn for the rest of the day.

keep thinks short sweet to the point and logical.

'Goblin I know it must be so frustrating to hear US generalise and stereotype teachers, but honestly, you are in the minority.'

SM, is this a good time to own up to having a close relative who's a social worker?

ds2's mainstream primary is fantastic it has worked because
They have got to know ds2 & not made assumptions based on dx alone
He has an LSA that knows him, consistency is the key.
He is included in everything but forced to do nothing. options & choice!
They push him but also know his limitations.
His teachers expect him to learn, maybe at his level & in tiny steps but its still progress.
He is allowed & encouraged to be independant whenever able
They welcome and ask for outside support and guidance.

I must add this is a small village primary (18 per class & 5 classes in the school) I cannot imagine him having the same success in ms secondary but we will worry about that in a couple of years.

ooh, a kind of positive: DS's new school (which is good) has a lunchtime club full of structured activities for any child who needs it, run by a well trained TA. She also uses it to teach social skills.

Sounds brilliant and exactly what he needs. The problem is, is that the other ASD kids go there (as well as others) and so DS sees it as a club for 'different' kids, and he therefore hates going.

At the moment school forces him to go 2 times a week, but he really hates it. He just wants to run round in the play ground at lunchtime... Despite the club being perfect and just what he needs.

Have to say I have found more forward thinking teachers in secondary school than I have in primary.
Maybe because the chances are they have met more children with ASD I don't know.
Far more of them see his abilities rather than just the difficulties and enable him to achieve in a way that he is comfortable with.
Remember so many wasted IEP's trying to get him to speak (he can but doesn't) when in secondary he can communicate in a way that is comfortable to him be that email, SMS or a note on his desk or through his TA because they see all communication as positive.
Haven't had problems with supply staff because the school has a bank of full time cover staff and the whole school received in depth ASD training from the head of the ASD unit herself.
In primary it seems that the support given is used to get the child to fit in with the school's way of doing things. So it is the child making the adjustments rather than the school making the necessary adjustments to their way of thinking.

I'd agree with that asdx2, it's certainly been something of an uphill job in primary.
Other parents tend to bring pressure to bear more frequently in primary too, and that alters the response of some individuals and some schools to a child who doesn't conform easily.