Has anyone's child successfully been statemented despite achieving well academically? (long)

[moosemama]

Well, having just typed out a massive post - twice, then tried unsuccessfully to cut it down, I ended up cutting and pasting it into a Word document and filing it as notes for what is currently going on with ds1 and school. It was effectively was a furious brain dump that none of you really need to know all the detailed ins and outs of in order to advise me on what I need to know.

It is still ridiculously long, so I apologise in advance and thank anyone who manages to get to the end.

Basically, I have been up since 3 am and dh joined me at 5 am, unable to sleep because of an incident at ds1's school yesterday where he was told off for getting upset at a change in timetable which cancelled his beloved ICT lesson (for the third week in a row and the second time this week). They didn't break it to him gently or in advance, when it came to ICT time they just sort of said 'right, no ICT today, we are going in the hall to do singing instead'.

Ds got very upset, his teacher was off sick - again (she's not done a full week for the last half a term) and the lady taking the class told him off for being silly - he got more upset and she shouted at him, then another teacher who has nothing to do with him got involved, shouted at him and threatened to make him do extra work in her class unless he stopped crying - he was hyperventilating fgs!

The school know he has a verbal dx of ASD and that he needs advance notice of timetable changes. Not only that, they are supposed to be carrying out a programme to improve his negative associations with school and boost his low self-esteem at the moment.

We have been assured by both the head and other parents who know her, that his teacher next year is very experienced and also has experience of children with ASD in her class. She is also quite strict and will not stand for the awful behaviour of the bullies in his class who his current teacher has been unable to control (even during lessons). BUT we are no longer willing to leave it chance and feel we have to apply for Statutory Assessment at this point as his daily life at school is being seriously compromised, as is mental and even physical health.

The thing is, ds's achievement is high. He is just going into year 4 and is at level 3a for Reading and 3b for Literacy and Numeracy. I'm concerned that they won't see his problems as serious enough to warrant additional support. That said, he has for the first time ever not progressed at least two subsets this year, as he was at level 3c when he came out of year 2 and has only progressed to 3b. He has always progressed well in previous years and I can't help thinking this is the start of a downward slide, as he struggles to cope with the type of work they do in class in the Juniors, despite doing really well in tests and assessments. Apparently he tested at 3a across the board but his teacher's assessments lowered his grade due to the poor quality of his classwork.

He does have problems with self-management/organisation and we did think he might have poor fine-motor skills resulting in terrible handwriting and presentation, but having looked at his books from year 2 last night, we realised that his handwriting was lovely in year 2 and has seriously deteriorated this year, so we are thinking that the issue is not fine motor skills but more to do with a completely disrupted year.

He struggles to organise himself and this causes him a lot of problems at school. He cannot remember to bring things home or hand them in, despite taking a daily checklist and my writing lists in his home/school diary on a daily basis and despite having a lot of knowledge, he doesn't seem able to organise it properly to inform his classwork.

Obviously social and communication issues are also at the fore, both with his peer group and interaction with teachers.

Other than that, we have been told that he struggles to concentrate in class and invariably fails to complete tasks, as he spends a lot of time staring into space rather than starting the work and then rushes to get it all done in the last 5 minutes.

So, what are our chances of him actually getting a statement for these problems? I know they probably seem minor to a lot of people, but they are seriously affecting him and I feel that he is on a downward slide academically now as well and this slide is likely to gather pace as the workload increases and gets harder.

I have heard people say that unless the child is X number of years behind academically they won't get a statement. I know this is not 'allowed', as its a blanket policy, but am aware that it does happen. Are we likely to come up against this sort of attitude and if so, how do we deal with it?

Also, if we apply, get turned down, appeal then get turned down, can we re-apply or is that it? I ask because he currently has a verbal dx of ASD, but will not be getting his Multi Dip assessment until around April 2011, so other than the verbal dx given by the Paed we saw initially (who has now discharged him to the Multi-Dip team) and the GP who saw him for anxiety, we have no support from any health or educational professionals and no paperwork or reports to back up our claim.

Again, thanks to anyone who made it this far.

I havent read everything you have typed as am in a rush but wanted to say i was actually in a similar position.

DS had no formal written DX in 2006 when we first applied for a statement. He had huge behavioural issues which everyone agreed were related to his informal dx of autism BUT he was achieving well in school and had no academic issues except his behaviour was preventing him from accessing the curriculum. When i fist applied for a statement it was refused immediately due to DSs academic ability. (no mention of the 4 exclusions in 3 months at age 6!)
We had to go to tribunal and point out the blanket policy of not issuing statements for behaviour was illegal and we were granted an assessment. This was in Sept 2006. between spet 2006 and oct 2008 basically ds was excluded from 2 schools and placed in a pupil referral unit and the LEA kept drip feeding us statement hours, starting at 8 hours and eventually in July 2008 we got a full time statement and offered a place in special school but this offer was not made till we had a formal diagnosis!

Duritzfan I haven't read all the posts in between but do not be fobbed off. A boy at my son's school has just got a Statement in Year 10.

Hi Moosemama,

Am very sorry to read how things have been for your son recently (though I have to say I am not altogether surprised. This is the sort of thing that tends to happen when the childs needs at school are not met by school). Your son's problems are in no way minor issues.

Many LEA's do work during the six weeks holidays (the one I am in certainly does).

I would personally put in your request asap for this document www.ipsea.org.uk have model letters you can use. You will need to give the LEA six weeks to reply to your letter. You will also need to write to the Chief Education Officer at your LEA.

Do not worry yourself unduly about paperwork or a lack of; that is down to the LEA to sort out.

My DS2 is now 13 and has recently been statemented for EBD. He achieved well at primary and finished with all level 5s, although he was always on SA+ for his behavioural issues. He has really made no progress since, as his volatile behaviour got him excluded so many times and finally permananently from his second secondary school.

We have fought long and hard for a statement to detail a school and are finally looking at residential special schools for him out of county, as there is no provision where we are for children his age who are both able and exhibit such challenging behaviour. If he is with children with who are less able, he will both exploit the other children and also refuse to do any work at his ability level.

Don't give up is all I can say. Your LEA will probably try every which way to get you to agree for them to spend the least possible, but you know what you want and what's best for your DS.

Thank you for your response bonkerz, do you think they deliberately strung things out until he had a formal dx? I am so sorry it took them so long to give your ds the support he needs.

Its appalling how people have to go to tribunals to point out these blanket policies, when the LEAs blatantly already know what they are doing is illegal. They are obviously just spinning things out and making it as hard as possible to save themselves money. I find it so shocking that these people, who are supposed to be responsible for supporting ALL children in reaching their potential and getting the best education possible, play so many games and make people jump through hoops just to get what their children are already legally entitled to. Its a disgrace.

Hi Attila. Thanks for replying - you have been very patient and offered me lots of very helpful advice and support over the past 12 months, so again - thank you.

So, its worth sending the letter anyway, even though its the holidays then. I've read most of the ISPEA site today (read it lots of times in the past actually, but wanted to make sure I was up to date) and am drafting a letter to send based on their proforma. I will work on it with dh over the weekend and hopefully it will go in the post on Monday. Do I have to send a separate letter to the CEO of the LEA then? I must have missed that somehow. See - I'm getting in a muddle already - boy what a ditz.

ByTheSea, thank you for sharing your experience with me. So sorry you had to go through such a hard fight to get help for your ds. I hope you find him somewhere fantastic really soon.

That's interesting LeoniDelt, thank you.

I had wondered if I should getting in touch with some sort of parental support scheme to see what they can offer in the way of support. My health visitor told me that the local ASD Assessment Unit has parental befrienders who have been through it all before, can offer advice and support and will attend meetings with you if you want them to, but she wasn't sure whether or not you can access them prior to assessment. She was supposed to call me back and let me know, but we keep having conversations with each other's answermachines instead.

Good luck with the Tribunal. I hope your daughter gets the support she needs.

I don't really understand why the system requires the LEA to assess children who have already been through a NHS assessment and have a diagnosis. Surely the NHS diagnosis should be good enough and they should just contact the relevant professionals to ask for guidance on the kind of support the child needs. It seems like such a waste of time and money to me, two government funded insitutions both carrying out assessments when surely it would save money and be more effective if they just collaborated/communicated with each other properly.

The more I find out about it the more farcical it all seems.

We aren't Brum, but not a million miles away. Think south.

I had a look at the PP website with dh a few weeks ago and he said he was going to give them a call, but its all gone a bit crazy round here since then and he hasn't got around to it.

Bless him, its not his fault. He's been working full-time and doing the lion's share of the housework and cooking as well as I have my leg in a cast at the moment (hence lots of time for mnetting). I was hoping I would have it removed last Tuesday, but no - another 4 weeks till I will be cast free - and its soooo hot and itchy aargh! Fortunately its one of the funky aircasts, so I can undo it and have a good scratch when dh isn't looking - if he sees me doing it I really a good telling off.

Just trawled my way through the big pile of letters that the dses brought home this afternoon and discovered that they aren't going to even open the SENCO position until next Autumn and in the meantime the Head will be acting SENCO. This could be very good for us, as we have already agreed a good plan of support for ds with him and now he will be directly responsible for making sure it actually happens.

Put in the blinking statement request now. They have 26 weeks to decide if the child needs one. So in 6 months time if he's doing ok, they'll say no and you'll accept it. If he's doing badly, you'll be desperate for the statement by that stage.

Oh and the rubbish and poorly teacher may well have to go part-time and non-teaching but will probably have job security. So she may well end up as the SENCO for want of another suitable slot for her.

Thanks maria, we have decided to send off the request this week. At least while they are deciding we will have direct access to the Head to make sure he is getting the support he needs - he's been very good up till now, so fingers crossed.

I have asked and she is not going to be the new SENCO. I was suspicious as she has been going on a lot of training courses recently. She has been shifted to the Nursery so she only has to do 2.5 hrs a day. She's been tried in every other year in the school, including Reception when my ds2 was there and lots of the children in that class fell behind and had to have additional help to catch up in year 1. I do have sympathy for her - she suffers from depression and it must be really hard for her, but it makes me so mad that she can just keep on teaching and messing up childrens' education year after year like that.

We got a Statement for ds just for behavioural/ social reasons when he was 4. It started off with 50% 1:1 TA hours ad eventually became full time. He didn't have any diagnosis at all at 4 and the eventual dxs of ADHD and autism did strengthen our case for upping the hours (especially the very very high ADOS score, for some reason) but the Statement was needed because of the needs iykwim - the name given to those needs was kind of irrelevant. I am aware that that LAs don't always act like that; that's how it should be though.

From the Code of Practice, LAs know that a child can be statemented for any one (or a combination) of 4 categories: cognition and learning, commnication and interaction, sensory/ physical or social/emotional/behavioural. Only the first category implies an actual academic difficulty you could have any of the other three and still be perfectly academically able, as my ds is.

Good luck - I think it is worth having a meeting with the head and informing them of your intentions but asking what can be put in place to make sure that next year goes better cos, even if you get a Statement, it will take minimum 6 months and the school should be making an effort before then.

Duritzfan

Just to add to tribunalgoer's point: "It will get extra time in exams"

You don't need a statement to get extra time - often dx paperwork or EP report is fine. Extra time doesn't cost anything so it's much easier to get. Things like scribes/use of laptop is harder. You'd get much, much more with a (good) statement, so I would say again it is worth applying.

moosemama

My stat assessment started about this time last year. I think the school wrote their Advice in the early days of the autumn term but still got it in by the deadline, but we had some appointments with paed and EP throughout the summer break. The LA keep working throughout the summer break, so it's no reason to delay things.

Right, just had to hobble to the library with the gang and am now sat with my leg in the air again, lol.

Thanks to everyone that's replied while I've been gone.

Tribunalgoer, I pretty much do what you advise in meetings already. I'm always extra polite and make sure I thank them for their time etc. My problem is that I seem to go a blank when they start asking me questions - even when I take myself a prompt sheet I end up just staring at the words while they make no sense. I also have the ridiculous habit of saying things like "I suppose you can't do x because such and such would make it difficult for you", rather than saying "ds needs you to do x" or "we want you to do x for ds". I'm always the same, trying to make things easier for the other person, only in this context is not appropriate or what my child needs me to do. Its pathetic really - a woman of my advanced years being so crap with authority, but its a fact. I definitely need to toughen up.

Dh is better, but very anti-establishment and sometimes a bit too brash and bull-at-a-gate-ish iykwim. Mind you, he did look the Head in the eye and tell him the school's bullying policy is absolute crap and not worth the paper its written on - and the Head agreed with him! They are now implementing a school wide anti-bullying scheme starting in September and are re-writing the bullying and behaviour policies in consultation with pupils, parents, governors and relevant outside anti-bullying organisations, so it seems dh's direct approach can pay off at times.

I do keep a record of everything. My diary is full of notes about incidents that happened at school, conversations with teachers/SENCO/Head, meetings etc and I tend to write a letter detailing why I would like a meeting and what I would like to discuss, rather than just asking for a meeting. I haven't followed up all of the meetings we've had so far with a letter, as I didn't want them to say I was bombarding them, but I take your point about the paper trail and will do so from now on.

So, am I better waiting perhaps a fortnight so that there is some space within the 6 week period for the school to respond to the LEA's request for info?

We broke up yesterday and have 5 1/2 weeks off.

I'm still not completely sure what I should be asking for them to provide via the statement. My feeling is that, at the very least, he needs support with peer group interaction, social and communication skills across the board and management of stress/anxiety. He also needs to develop self-management/organisation skills so that he can become more independent and less reliant on adults to do all his thinking/planning/organisation for him. Educationally, he needs to learn how to integrate all the knowledge he has stored away into his classwork and also how to work in a more logical and organised way, but I'm not sure that's stuff for the statement or just something he will develop as he matures. How all that would translate into actual support hours or facilities required is beyond me at this point.

Hi moosemama I have to confess that I haven't read the whole of the thread but noticed some interesting bits that I thought I may be able to help with.
1] Left handedness, The left handed shop sell a mat which looks like a table mat, which shows your child what angle to place their paper/book and how to hold the pencil. It also has letter formation guides on it. I can't remember how much it cost but it has been very worthwhile for us.
I have 2 [ASD]lefties and they have both benefitted enormously from advice about turning the paper.
2] Riding a bike, firstly take the pedals and stabilisers off and see if he can walk it along, when he can do this encourage him to roll and lift his feet up a little at a time.
When he is confident doing this, put the pedals back on and go somewhere with a slight incline. Get him to put one foot on one pedal and gently start to roll down the hill and then put the other foot on the other pedal. He shouldn't need to pedal because of the slope and will already be able to balance because of the practice with out the pedals. Once he has mastered getting his feet on the pedals he will be away in no time. Remember elbow pads and a helmet.
Hope I am not teaching my granny to suck eggs and sorry for being so long.
Good luck

Hi Ineed2.

We do do the paper turning at home (and his handwriting is much better at home than it is at school). The SENCO said they have some at school, but as he was being bullied it would mark him out as different if he had one on his desk. I think I will try again for that in September though. We have problems with him holding the paper still while he writes as well, as he has sensory issues around textures coming into contact with his palms and can't stand the feel of the paper. We've sort of got around this with him making a fist and holding the paper down that way though.

He does have quite a poor grip as well though and it has been suggested that a writing slope might help with that. The poi swinging he is going to do in the holidays is good for wrist strength and flexibility, as well as coordination and I was looking at getting him a power ball in the hope of building his grip strength, but haven't seen any specifically for children.

With his bike, he has progressed over the past 12 months and is now more confident. He can balance and go at a reasonable speed now, so we just need to gradually start raising the stabilisers. He is not really bad with his gross motor/coordination, but definitely not at the same stage as his peer group.

And no, you aren't teaching granny, lol. I am always really grateful for the advice of people who have more knowledge and experience than me and have learned such a lot from people like yourself on this board, so thank you.

I have a similar thing with Dd3 she hasn't been bullied luckily but refuses to partake in anything that will make her different to anyone else. We had hoped she would continue with a triangular pencil or pencil grip but that has been dropped in year 2. She does't hold the paper still either she does it with one finger at best but I hadn't thought about it being sensory. The trouble with paper turning is that unless someone reminds them or tapes out a mark on the desk, they are unlikely to do it at school.
They seem to have so much to contend with and so little understanding.