Tribunal advice

[almostfalling]

I’ve posted before just hoping for a bit more advice. DS is in yr6 due to go to main stream secondary school he has full time 1:1 support and a EHCP. We have become concerned that he’s not going to manage mainstream So we called an early EHCP review which was last month and requested a tribunal which is scheduled for September.
We asked LA to consult with two independent schools we have visited and liked, they have gone to panel and panel said no. Can we appeal this decision?

The la had not done any consults yet as they are waiting for EHCP to be amended. Once it’s amended they will consult.

we are not sure what to do we haven’t found any maintained Sen schools that are suitable so we don’t know where to go from here. there are potentially schools out of area but none of them will let us visit without a consultation and we don’t really want ds to have to do around two hours a day commuting.

I’m concerned by the time LA consult schools may be closing for summer and we may not have any answers for the tribunal. so really not sure what to do.

If you are going to Tribunal, you are already appealing. Since you are unhappy with the placement and your hearing is September, your appeal to SENDIST presumably includes section I (and hopefully B&F as well). Are the independent schools wholly independent or section 41 independents? If wholly independent, you will need an offer of a place. If the school won’t say yes/no until they receive a formal consult from the LA and the LA won’t consult, you can ask SENDIST to direct them to consult.

The outcome of the AR can feed into the appeal process.

It isn’t that the EHCP is amended and only then placements are consulted. The LA is trying to confuse you.

The maximum recommended travel time for secondary is typically considered 1hr15. If DS isn’t able to travel that long, it will help you to have evidence of that.

Thank you so would I wait until the tribunal meeting to ask sendist to ask them to consult or do I do it now? Yes it’s a wholly independent school. It’s just section I being appealed through the tribunal.

@scoopofmintchocchipicecreamcan I ask the independent to read his EHCP without involving the LA? So they could make a decision without needing councils permission?

It is a good idea to appeal B&F as well as I. That is because section I is the logical conclusion of B&F. B + F = I. Also, it is likely B&F need improving, anyway. And while they shouldn’t, LAs regularly write B&F to fit a placement. If you want to widen the appeal, you can submit a SEND7.

No, you wouldn’t wait until the final hearing. If you need the LA to consult and they won’t, submit a SEND7.

You can approach the school outside the LA formally consulting. Sometimes independent schools will offer (or not!) a place on this basis. Sometimes they say they want the LA to formally consult.

@scoopofmintchocchipicecreamthank you. We had an early EHCP review which covered sections b and F that’s still being amended. So I need to submit a send 7 to ask sendist to ask LA To consult?
thank you I will speak to the school too.

Even though you had the early AR, you still should appeal B&F. The outcome of the early AR can feed into the appeal process.

Yes, you should submit a SEND7 to request SENDIST directs the LA to consult. Don’t forget to seek the LA’s views first.

@scoopofmintchocchipicecreamby views do you mean reasons why panel said no?

I will ask, sendias said it’s probably because they haven’t consulted with any other schools yet.

No, before you submit a SEND7, you have to seek the LA’s views about the request you are going to make and include those views (or the fact they didn’t reply) on the SEND7 form. So not asking about why the panel declined.

Thanks should we mention both independent schools in the form or just one of them? We do prefer one but would be happy with either

Btw I know you do this for a lot of people. It’s really good of you. I genuinely am grateful for your help.

A wholly independent school can cherry pick which children they want or not with or without an EHCP. They have to say YES they will take the child without that it’s game over no one can force it. Equally if you can fit their jellyfish mould / they won’t flex the contract / school place can end.

waiting for amendments to B and F - yes classic BS of LA delay tactics. Have you seen the Ipsea timeline on AR they have a good table.

Have you checked how many hrs the senior school is for 1 to 1 vs the school he is in now? Any difference can be an issue especially if you need more hrs.

Yes your EHCP isn’t up to scratch hence B and F is wrong / being amended so even if you sent it to schools via email from yourself the person reading it / senco is not seeing a true reflection of your child. As the needs won’t be listed.

Has your current senco helped you? They should be.
Equally if your in year 6 they have messed up all the transition year reviews and I bet I can guess which LA your in! Surrey?

You are welcome.

If the schools won’t decide whether to offer a place or not until formally consulted, only you can decide whether to ask SENDIST to direct the LA to consult with one or both.

The risk of consulting with both is that they both reply with a positive consult/offer of a place and the LA runs with your second choice. Then, if you wanted to pursue the first choice, you would need to show the LA’s preferred choice/the second one you requested can’t meet needs &/or isn’t unreasonable public expenditure, which you may or may not be able to do. So you should only request both if you would genuinely be happy with both.

The risk of only asking for one of the wholly independent schools to be consulted is that they say no and by the time that happens it may well be close to your HD and there is a risk the case won’t be ready to be heard (or that you proceed to ask SENDIST to just name a type of placement, which I would try to avoid).

If/when the LA has sent a consult, you should contact the schools to ensure they have complete picture. If you decide to request to amend the grounds of appeal and include B&F in the appeal, you can share the working document. It is worth also doing this with any other schools you think the LA may have consulted with. Just because they say they haven’t consulted any doesn’t mean they haven’t.

@scoopofmintchocchipicecream we did a parental response to the La declining consultation with independent schools. La still said no so we are going to do the send7. My concern is time is not on our side. We have to notify La give them time to respond then send the form. Tribunal are supposed to reply within 15 days, if they do take that long (or longer) that takes us to the last week of school so I’m not confident we will get a response in time . Our deadline to get our bundle in is July 27th so if we don’t know if the independent has said yes we can’t name them. Which then leaves us without a school to name. I’ve looked at a couple of Sen schools but wasn’t happy with them and other Sen schools (out of area) have declined visits until consultation and the la (as far as I am being told) aren’t consulting yet. The sen officer said we will know what’s happening when we get their response to tribunal on 14th July. Again this is last week of school.
if we can’t name a school I’m considering asking for a delay to hearing date. Do you know if that puts us to back of the queue (currently a 14m wait in our area) or would we get an earlier date? Thanks
ive tried to get a phone call appointment with ipsea for advice but there’s never any available!

Most SEND7s that require a response (not all do) are taking longer than 15 days to hear back from.

Many schools will have someone who can be contacted over the summer.

Sometimes it delays the hearing, because the case isn’t ready to be heard, but it is sometimes possible to state your preference after the final evidence deadline. Similarly, it is likely to delay the hearing, but the same applies after the deadline for the LA sending the bundle. The hearing being vacated and relisted is unlikely to mean a 14 month wait in your situation.

If you want to speak to IPSEA, have you tried the call-in helpline? Don’t forget SOSSEN too.