Learning to roll - sleep gone to pot

[AngelDog]

I think I know the answer to this, but please reassure me, someone.

DS is 6 months old and has never been a wonderful sleeper, but not as bad as many. He was recently starting to self-settle a bit for daytime naps. A couple of weeks ago he started seriously fighting his swaddle (and escaping), so I now put him in a sleeping bag (or just a vest if very hot).

He has been working hard on trying to roll, which he managed for the first time today.

He now seems to be unable to get to sleep by being rocked (my usual method for naps) and will only feed to sleep - unless he's overtired in which case frantic jiggling/bouncing is the only thing to (eventually) work. He refuses to sleep in the pushchair any more. He will sleep in the sling, but often for only about 15 mins.

Today he only had one decent nap, instead of the 3 he needs. The last 2 nights I've put him to bed, he's woken up and has been awake and hyper for the next couple of hours. I'm pretty sure overtiredness is the culprit here. For some reason, once he's eventually gone to sleep in the evening he's not too bad for the rest of the night, just waking a bit more often than usual.

This is probably just his brain working so hard on rolling that it's too busy to sleep, isn't it?

Any experience of how soon this sort of thing will pass would be appreciated.

Bump. My DS is the same at the moment. Daytime
naps not affected but wakes every 2hrs at night, with a lovely 1-2hr unsettled period around 2am when I end up walking him around the bedroom. He seems to be trying to roll in his sleep too. I'm resigned to the fact that the crap sleep will probably go on for a few more weeks yet, but would also like to hear that maybe for some (mine, please mine!) LOs this passed quicker than expected!

Urgh. I feel for you, koeda. Having to be up for any length of time in the middle of the night is especially horrible.

It was 9.30 before I could get him to sleep this evening. Usually he's off by 6.30-7.00. In fact, I start getting ready for bed before 9.30pm.

Let's see what the night brings.

It is developmental. Will happen again (but worse) when learning to walk/talk. You will find him in his cot standing and unable to stay lying down. It will pass. Do whatever helps, you won't create bad habits. It will take a couple of weeks I'm afraid.

Don't say that, Plastic! The prospect of walking had crossed my mind, but I'd not thought about talking!

Ooh, we've had nearly a week of it, maybe there's only one to go.

when my LO was learning to roll ( and couldn't get back from her tummy!) i put a rolled up towel on side of the cot to kind of stop her trying when it was nap time, as she would get on her tummy and not be able to get back plus i was paranoid about her not breathing!!. it did work and she slept better.Also put in sleeping bag. it didn't stunt her progress at all, as gave LO plenty of roll time in day. ( now 7 months and she rolled from 4 months, so had this one early!)

i obviously didn't do this at night for safety reasons, cause in the day i went in and checked on her regularly. at night i would turn her over if she had managed to get over.

not sure if this helps.. but i didn't want to go back to rocking NO WAY!!

ooo also meant to say it went on for about 2/3 weeks and with me encouraging her to roll back she figured it out and gave up 'practising' and went back to normal..

angeldog i hope it passes soon for you. My dd is 18 weeks and has been rolling since 16 weeks but trying for a week or so before that. Like you her sleep pattern has gone to pot! Its been 3 weeks now of waking every 45 mins in the night then going to 90 mins...finally last week we got a few 3 hour stints out of her. I blamed the 4 month sleep regression and the fact she is try to crawl now too....went back to co sleeping and thought it would pass with a week or so.

Fast forward to yesterday at the doctors, the gp told me she didnt believe in the whole sleep regression thing and that over the last 3 weeks she had just developed bad habits....so last night instead of feeding her when she woke at 9pm (2 hours after being put down) i held her til she calmed down and then placed her back in the cot and shh/ patted her. She then woke only twice more in the night 11.40 and then 3.30...finally waking for the day at 7am.

So what i think im trying to say is yes it will pass but in the mean time try not to create any more bad habits which will just be another thing to undo once he is back sleeping normally. I hold my hand up to trying to do anything to get her to sleep but last night just proved that she has been "playing' me for the last few weeks.

Good luck

How was your night angeldog? Mine was the same, 2hrly wakes then instead of a 2am walkabout I had a 5am start. I think I prefer 5am starts, but only by a small margin!

tinks27 great advice on helping them practice - the sooner he gets it the sooner I can get a little more sleep!

barbie1 I'm tempted to not feed my LO when he wakes (I already always try the dummy first just to see) but I'm so far from in the mood for rocking/walking that a feed is much easier (we co-sleep so it's easy peasy to just stick my nipple in his mouth!). Plus he does drink a fair bit before coming off himself, giving a big sigh, then promptly going back to sleep. Hmm... I'll give it another week or so. I'm still convincing myself that he'll grow out of it as soon as he can roll, not that he is treating me as an all night buffet as my mum keep saying .

koeda i know what you mean! i too went back to co sleeping, seemed the only way to get any sleep. It was only the gp convincing dh that it would be for our own good that we put dd back in her cot last night. Im a soft touch, would gladly let dd sleep with me but i guess gp did have a point because 3 wakes last night was so much better than the 6 or 7 we have been having.

I also give dd lots of tummy time in the day, it helps to tire her out

I'm in a similar boat. 20 week dd has had some rather...interesting... sleep patterns over the past couple of weeks. She too has just mastered rolling (she's been trying for ages and mastered it yesterday- go dd!!)

Last night she was down at 7pm, up for a feed at 10.15 and 2am (not too bad so far, but I know she can go longer than that at night!)... then up at 4. I gave in and fed her around 4.30 after shushing, stroking, patting, cuddling etc. Thankfully she then went back to sleep but I am knackered today. Last few nights have been similar.

I had put it down to sleep regression/ a developmental spurt, so had an "anything goes" sort of attitude. But now I'm reading about bad habits and a chill is going through me! Perhaps I shouldn't be feeding her if she wakes at dawn after only feed a couple of hours before. I akways say I'm not going to feed her, but honestly am at a loss as to what else to do, short of getting up for the day at 4am (no thanks)

It will pass..... won't it??

Luckily she is such a gorgeous funny little creature in the day that, after a big breakfast (for me- she hardly feeds in the morning...), the night doesn't seem so bad! I suppose that's what we have to focus on.

my DD is doing something similar, but her sleep has been all over the place since 13weeks really, so a bit young for the 4-month sleep regression thingy?

She is 15 weeks now and is waking at 2am or 3am and then again about 5am/6am. I too know she can do longer stretches - she was sleeping 9-5 at 8 weeks, then back to sleep until 9am!

I wondered last night if it could be becomming a habit, as she hardly drank anything, or so it seemed, at either feed before becoming sleepy again. She eventually went back to sleep until 9am, but didn't ask for food straight away, she didn't seem hungry until 9.30.
So, I was thinking about trying to settle her without boob tonight, to see if it would work, but then i also read somewhere (an't remember where) that in babies this young you should offer a feed and shouldn't try to cut out a night feed unless they choose to themselves in case it is a growth spurt and they need it

I just want my nice long sleeps back

I figure that if I've chosen to feed on demand then that's what I'm going to have to do, day or night. As tempting as it is to try not feeding too much at night (who am I to tell DS when he's really hungry or not at this young stage) I really really want to see for myself whether DS will grow through it. I wonder how long I will last!! I guess it's easier for me as I only have DS to look after plus I'm not having any future DCs so I'm not too worried about nipping potential bad habits in the bud right now as I will deal with them later if/when they do arise.

Well, not too bad last night - he woke after an hour HOWLING (but that was probably due to the overtiredess) then was up (briefly) just twice and slept right through till 7am (very unusual). He only managed a 15 min nap at lunchtime (he was in the sling) - cue meltdown later, but he's asleep on my lap at the moment.

I'm not too fussed about getting into bad habits. During the 4 month regression, DS woke 3 or 4 times a night instead of once or twice. I carried on doing what I was already doing - feeding him every time he woke. After a few weeks he spontaneously went back to one or two wakings.

I suspect there is a variety of opinions on regressions in the medical profession. I first heard about the 4 month one from a friend whose paediatrician husband was up half the night every night with their 4 month old baby. I don't think he had any doubts about its existence.

I think the feeding on demand thing is difficult. I do this in theory but DS isn't very good at telling me when he's hungry. When he wakes, he is often just lying there blowing rasperries or singing, not crying for food. However, if I feed him he takes it and goes straight back to sleep. If I don't, he entertains himself for an hour or so before getting cross and upset, when he is much harder to get back to sleep. So I just offer a feed straight away. koeda, it does sound like your DS is properly hungry to me.

Thanks for sharing experiences, everyone.

Let's hope tonight sees improvements for everyone.

Anyone interested in sleep regressions can read more here, here and here.

Ah good to hear that you had a better night angeldog - maybe you're on the home stretch! For this particular phase anyway . Yup, I'm pretty sure my DS is hungry as they're nice big gulpy swallows however definitely nice to have a bit of reassurance, especially when the prolonged regularity of this phase can knock ones confidence/instincts!

AngelDog my DD has only managed a 40 minute nap since getting up at 9am this morning, and we are heading into meltdown territory now... She is soooo tired! I don't want her to sleep this late or she definitely wont sleep tonight!

The lack of naps and increased night wakings is seriously testing me at the moment.

DD is also not very good at 'demanding' food and I usually end up offering. (usually when I want her to nap so it will help her get to sleep!) Tht's also why it's just easier to feed in the night because although she's not taking much, I know it'll send her back off.

curlyLJ, you have my sympathies. Was your DD born late? Apparently developmental spurts work according to when the due date was, so if your baby was late, they'll hit the developmental spurts early, which means the sleep gets messed up sooner.

What works for me on the night wakings is having DS on a single mattress next to me That means I can feed him lying down in the night, which means I don't get so wide awake, go back to sleep faster, and if he has a long feed I can occasionally doze through it. All the benefits of co-sleeping without having a wriggly baby trying to latch on to you all night.

DS didn't wake from his last nap until 4.45pm, so I delayed bedtime as if he sleeps that late he doesn't want to go to sleep at the normal time. Result? At bedtime he was hideously overtired, screamed and refused to feed. He's since woken up twice

I suspect the neighbours have had enough of all the crying by now.

The sooner these babies get through it, the better!

AngelDog no DD was actually a week early, so that's why I'm not sure this is even the 4 month thing yet. This is probably the 3 month thing still Or do they just all blur into one??

I can't get on with feeding lying down...I don't find it particularly comfy, DD seems to take longer to feed and is harder to get back to sleep after and a couple of times I have ended up with blocked ducts and I am sure it was the awkward position I have to get my big boobs into!!

DD was so tired at bedtime she kept falling asleep while feeding and then jumping when I was gently saying her name to try and get her to carry on! Eventually she went to sleep at 7:50 and we had one short waking since. Lets hope that's it until 4am

CurlyLJ, any progress?

For anyone else who's reading this looking for reassurance, DS seems to have got over the nap-resistant spell. He first let me rock him to sleep once or twice, then dropped off in the pushchair (and without crying much!) which is a sure sign of him sleeping more easily. He's also stopped being awake and hyper after being put to bed.

He just needs a bit of help now to get the hang of going to sleep for naps quite as easily as he did before, but it is a HUGE improvement.

On the other hand, he now wakes up after every sleep cycle at night (ie every 2 hours), but I think that's a different problem.

Thanks for asking Angeldog but not much progress here... altough she did sleep through till 5am twice this week things seem to be all over the place!

Just when I thought we were back on track she has started to resist her daytime naps terribly (I barely got her to nap at all yesterday) which means it's really hard to get her to sleep at bedtime. Thankfully once she is asleep she will usually go through till 5 but last night it took 2 hours to get her to go down. She wouldn't feed properly so I put her down, she was then sreaming for 40 mins but when I picked her up we were just making eachother hot and sweaty. Eventually a little bit more boob and she was out.

It's the inconsistency that is making it hard at the moment. I would really like it if she would just settle into a bit more of a pattern. Think I am going to have to work on the daytime naps a bit more...