I really don't want to do controlled crying. But would it be kinder than this?

[BertieBotts]

OK have tried to write this post lots, but can't think how to write it properly. Sorry if it is disjointed.

DS is 15 months. He has always co-slept with me, when he was tiny he used to sleep on me/next to me on the sofa until I went to bed, when he started to crawl I would let him play and then bring him up to bed when he seemed tired, all was fine, until I mentioned this to some friends and they seemed shocked that he didn't have a set "bedtime", so I thought this must be a problem and started trying to "fix" it - which I think was when it all went wrong because he has never been that settled since then, although it might be a coincidence, I don't know.

Anyway so he had a half hearted bedtime, as in, some nights he would go down early evening, some nights he would not. Breastfeeding to sleep stopped working (he would move around constantly while feeding and not relax, or he would feed calmly and seem to be falling asleep then -PING- suddenly be wide awake and manic.) so I started taking him out for a walk in his pram, which served a dual purpose of getting me away from twattish XP's comments that we should just shut him in a room and leave him to cry, and also it made DS go to sleep. I would leave him in the pushchair until he woke and then take him upstairs, all sleepy, and feed him and he would stay asleep.

This worked well for ages, to the point where despite never having particular "nap times" (that I noticed anyway) if ever we were out and DS fell asleep after 6ish, if he woke while we were out he would cry inconsolably until I could get him home and feed him in bed.

I have no idea when it stopped working, but more recently he would sometimes go to bed early in the evening and sometimes stay up until me and XP went to bed, then I would feed him and he would either go to sleep, or he would have a little play in his cot (sidecar) for about 20 minutes and then come to me for some milk and go to sleep. He tends to unlatch and roll away from me to sleep, so we co-sleep but not cuddled up any more.

Anyway, I split from XP about 7 weeks ago and it seems that without XP coming to bed, DS doesn't know or have that signal that it is time to go to bed, because even when I go to bed he will do the -PING- wide awake and manic thing, and crawl around making excited noises, or hit me, or stand holding onto the headboard kicking me in the head, or kneel up with his arms in the air and drop suddenly onto me - I know he is only little and just playing, ie not being intentionally violent. But it is so frustrating to spend ages settling him and then him be wide awake.

I tried staying in the room with him and pretending to be asleep and he just drove me mad doing that and also crawling off the bed and getting into everything (some things in the room which are within his reach and can't be moved) I tried moving him back into a lying down position whenever he got up to crawl off or stand up, but he is so strong that I found it difficult to keep him there for any period of time, and also I got frustrated and put him down a bit roughly, (not rough enough to hurt him) which he thought was hilarious and woke him up even more, so I just started bringing him down to the kitchen and putting him in his play pen while I read a book or went on the internet, and he would play for a bit and then get fed up and cry, so I would take him back upstairs and feed him and he would go to sleep (if he didn't it would be back down to playpen etc etc)

This worked for a week or two and then stopped working, but he would fall asleep in his pushchair, but it seems everything I do works (sort of) for a while and then he gets wise to it and fights that as well, and he gets so worked up and exhausted, and I can't do anything with him at all, so he ends up shunted between the pushchair and the playpen and the bed, I have taken him out for a walk three times tonight, twice past midnight, and it's cold (I put him in his cosy toes and sleeping bag and a hat and took the hat and cosytoes off when we got in) and probably not even safe to be wandering the streets at midnight trying to get him to sleep. It is ridiculous! And I am starting to think, with all the stress of him fighting sleep, whether controlled crying or something like that would actually be kinder, I just don't know what to do I don't really want to do CC, I don't even know if it would work on him - but maybe I don't really understand how it works. Also he has never slept in his cot or in his room (the only one with 4 sides on is in there, I can make it up as a low bed as well) and I don't know if he would understand that when I put him in there, he is supposed to lie down and go to sleep.

Aaaaargh, I just have no idea what to do, I have run out of ideas. I tried the No Cry Sleep Solution and did the daytime routine as my main way of doing things, it worked really well, but I had to get it 100% right and I am rubbish at routines so that did not work. But I can't help thinking if I had someone to help me do the routine in the day it would get him into a pattern that would be easier to keep up. As it is if he goes to sleep late, we end up sleeping in late and I can't seem to sort it properly.

Controlled crying worked for me. It was the absolute hardest thing to do (had to send DH out to his mothers while I was doing it as he would give in) but I needed to do it for my sanity.

Basically what I did was gave DS a warm bath, a feed and put him in his cot while I read him a story. Even if DS stood up in cot and messed around, I ignored him and carried on reading the story, (only a short one, Mr Men for example). Then I lay him back down, tucked him in, said night night, and left the room. When he started crying, the first time I went straight in, didnt speak to him, just lay him back down, tucked him in again and left the room. Then I allowed him to cry for 2 mins, before repeating. I then increased it by 1 min until a max of 5 mins.
After 20 mins he was asleep.

The second night, he was asleep after 10 mins, and the 3rd night he waved goodnight and went straight to sleep!

Hope you dont mind me suggesting it, but I really advise that baby should be put down to sleep in his own cot and room at the age of 15months.

Good luck, and be strong!

Hello Berite

I'm with Sukie on this one.

Poor you though, it sounds like a horrible stressful time for you, coping with the breakdown of your relationship and difficulties with your ds sleeping.

Personally I am in the Kids LOVE routine camp. I would really try to plan your week so you can have good tiring activities in the morning ie up at 7am out for a walk/park/see a friend in the morning, then lunch and down for a nap in his cot in his own bedroom. Then up and out again in the afternoon (if weather not too shite) then tea, bath and bed etc by 7pm. And I would do what Sukie suggests.

It is VERY tough, but give it a week or 2 - do not vary and see how you go. Hopefully your lo will respond after a few nights.

But at the moment it sounds hellish for you.

Hi Bertie

Sorry things are tough for you at the moment! Before trying CC why don't you try implementing a simple bedtime routine and trying to stick with it, something like bath, story and cuddles then bed, if you start this at 6pm he should be in bed by 7pm - take your time so it becomes an enjoyable time for you both.

I think LO's need consistency to understand and if you do the same things every evening he will learn that its bedtime. If he cries rather than CC you could sit by his cot and just put your hand on him and say shh very gently, then try leaving the room, if he starts crying leave him 2 minutes to see if he will settle himself but if not go back in and repeat. I would not pick him up unless he needs a nappy change or is unwell and don't take him out of his (your?) room. It will take a while as he is a bit older now but it is probably a nicer way for you than CC. It is what we did with DS when he was a lot younger (for daytime naps as bedtime wasn't a problem for us) - I think it took about a month.

I hope this helps!

totally agree with choc.

Your ds needs you to show him what bedtime is. so far it has been so changeable and inconsistent that you simply can't blame him - you haven't shown him how to do bedtime in the way that you would now like it to be.

I agree with choc also about putting in a very regular bedtime routine like warm bath, story, milk, and then into his cot in his own room.

From that point on, i would say it's up to you if you want to give CC a go, it didn't work for us and what we did in the end was tell ds very simply and clearly "I will stay with you while you go to sleep. If you get up, I will go". He soon learned that if he wanted us with him, he had to lay down and not play. He always wanted us there more than he wanted to play.

Just remember that what you're doing is showing him what you want bedtime to be. He will get it, if you're consistent enough. Good luck!

meant to add, since he's not done sleeping in his room before, I would take him out and buy him a couple of lovely things for his room and talk to him about how he's now a big enough boy to sleep in his own room etc. Do lots of talking to him about it, don't just launch it on him one evening!

On the first day, I would put him in for a nap in the room in the daytime so that once again, it is not launched on him at the end of the day - kids don't like to process new stuff at the end of the day when they're tired.

Even if the first day/night is an absolute disaster, set your alarm for 7 and get yourselves both up. It will help to start to re set his body clock, imo.

BertieBotts - are you me? I have a 14 month old dd2 and so much of your post could be written by me.

I am a routine disaster - can't do it. Never could.

At the moment dd2 is walked to sleep in her buggy for her nap.

At night I put dd1 (also a terrible sleeper) to bed and DH rocks dd2 to sleep and we put her in the buggy.

At some stage usually around 10ish she wakes crying, I pick her up and breastfeed her to sleep, she stays sleeping on me til I go to bed. Often I can get her in asleep or close enough to feed back to sleep but sometimes she does that PING thing you describe and is wide awake for ages.

I am worn out too. She wakes regularly crying the night and I breastfeed her back to sleep.

She has never slept in her big cot. I have tried to settle her in there but she goes immediately to screaming to the point of vomiting.

I have the No Cry Sleep Solution too but no idea where to begin.

I don't want to feed to sleep anymore. I don't want to co-sleep anymore.

Sorry for the rant - I wish I could help but I have no ideas.

Sorry, also meant to add that I really feel for you in your situation.

I find it hard enough dealing with this and I have support from DH. Doing on your own while dealing with the break up of your relationship must be so much harder.

I really hope you find a solution.