I need help with 7mo DS....

[Febesisachristmascracker]

DS is 7 and a half months old and is a big healthy baby. He is BF and eats 3 good size meals. I have followed BLW mainly although he eats whatever DD (2) eats so sometimes I spoon in.
He has feed on average 3 hourly during the night since birth and I have tried everything to space out feeds. After Christmas I decided enough was enough and I have put him in his own room and DH goes to him if he wakes in the night and I only feed him after 6 in the morning so around 12 hours after his bedtime feed. HV said it was fine and not to offer water as we were doing just to go in reassure and go out. We are on day 5.

The first 2 nights he only woke twice but cried for more than 30 mins. DH goes in every 15 mins.

Last night he woke 4 times. He is more clingy during the day (but that could be developmental??) He has also refused to nap in his cot for the last 5 days (since we got home after being away at Christmas and since we started the sleep training). He will nap in the car or buggy.

My DD was so much easier than this and apart from a few teething nights has slept and napped well.

Should I keep going?? Will he get the idea soon? We just bought him back downstairs after an hour of crying in his cot as he has refused to nap (DH went up to him every 10mins). He needs to nap or he gets so tired that he falls asleep in my boob at night and doesn't have a good feed which surely must effect his night time sleeping. Help me!!!!!

Help! Help!

I don't know (see the other sleep threads for my problems with 8 month old DD. I'm on 'misguided' and the new NCSS one).

BUT

12 hours seems an awfully long time to go without a drink. Are you sure he's not thirsty? Some babies just can't go this long. I always, always take a drink of water to bed with me and will usually take a drink at least once during the night. I only found out fairly recently from my mother that, until I was about 3, I woke in the night asking for a drink almost every night. I can only assume that after that I had a cup by the bed!

I think what I'm saying is that I wouldn't rule out thirst myself.

Also, we tried CC with DD and have since jacked it in. She too became clingy during the day almost immediately. Although 3 days of it did seem to break a particularly vicious cycle of hourly wakings, it only lasted a few days before it reverted to frequent wakings and I wasn't prepared to go through multiple periods of lots of wakings. I think some babies are simply too strong a personality for CC to work on them.

Finally, was CC advised for daytime naps as well as at night? As far as I know the normal advice is to just use it at night and use tried and tested methods to get the baby to nap in the day. If you want to continue CC at night, I would use the car or buggy to get naps out of him during the day whilst you're doing it. An overtired baby never sleeps well.

If you fancy joining us on NCSS there's lots of moral support cranking up for a shot at that!

Sorry, that should have said 'multiple persions of lots of crying.

12 hours is far too long to go without a drink IMO. I couldn't go that long myself without a drink or a snack TBH.

When mine were that age they would have had a feed at 11pm, and then again at 5 or 6 am. I would consider that to be a much more "normal" pattern for such a young child.

Jeez. See how tired I am 'multiple periods of lots of wakings'...

Oh, and like LittleFrogs, I was going to ask about a dreamfeed?

Hi, I would second what Confused says about CC being a bit hit and miss for daytime naps. We had no joy with it, so I have reverted to rocking DS to sleep for naps.

CC did help us with tackling the hourly wakes at night, but we haven't used it for dropping night feeds - at almost 10mo, DS still feeds at least once, and often twice between the hours you mention.

I personally would offer your DS at least one good feed in the night - choose the time that you think will suit you best, and then send in DH for the other ones if you are set on dropping them.

Hi Febesisachristmascracker,

It may well be that your DS simply doesn't take enough milk during the day at the moment and genuinely needs the night feeds for food and/or fluids. Babies of that age can go for 12 hours but only if they take in enough solids AND enough milk and water during the day.

Has he always seemed to feed more at night? How long are the breastfeeds during the day? How often and when do you breastfeed during the day? I wonder if perhaps he isn't getting enough milk during the day and that is why he is needing it at night. It might just need a bit of time to transition DS and your body onto taking/providing more milk during the day.

I would definitely offer water at night though - I'm another who like lots of water, and so what if it is comfort? I think it's better to continue to offer water at night whilst you're trying to get the milk feeds sorted out, if this is the issue.

I'm not a CC fan, especially at this age. Thinking about it from DSs point of view, he's used to waking in the night and getting a lovely feed and snuggle with mummy, but now he is left to cry and given no milk or water. Poor thing! This is the age where the 'separation anxiety' can start to kick in during the day anyhow, and I'm sure the CC doesn't help as it dents his trust in you. I think offering water and sorting out whether there is a genuine need for milk/water needs to come first.

Thankyou so much for replying everyone.

I agree about the water. It was my instinct to offer water so I will continue to offer from tonight.

Confused I think DS has a strong personality which is why CC doesn't seem particulary success. I ended up taking him for a walk in the buggy to get him to nap today so I will continue to do that if thats what he needs.

Isitme I'll see how tonight goes and then offer a night feed (maybe dreamfeed time). Good idea.

Oboe He normally has a really good BF at 6ish, breakfast at 8.30, BF 10.30, Lunch 12, BF 2, dinner 5 and BF 6.30. I have found since I cut out the night feeds he is feeding much better during the day. When he was feeding 2 hourly at night he was hardly feeding in the day.

Thanks so much for all your input. I was feeling really shit last night and it seems unnatural to not be going in to him. I have been really unwell the past few months and in hospital etc so felt that I needed to sort his sleeping for my healths sake. He is a big healthy boy and doesn't need night feeds but does seem to need comfort from me. I think I will
a) continue to send in DH to offer water during nights
b) Not stress about the day naps and use buggy or car if needed,
c) if in another few nights he is still waking lots offer a dreamfeed and see if that makes a difference

Confused I'll check out the other thread thanks!!

I just wanted to say you're not alone.

My 8mth DS is also still waking 2-3 times in the night for a bf. We're kind of mixed blw plus some spoon feeding. He only bfs 2 or 3 times in the day but has 3 meals plus water.

I think he's still needing his feeds and normally will go back to sleep after pretty much straight away. My DH works shifts so hasn't been able to help consistently and DS won't settle if its him going into him on the odd occassion he can.

I bought the baby whisperer book and am now wondering whether to try and increase the milk feeds in the day and try the pick up / put down method to settle him - he's rubbish at getting himself off to sleep.

This continued waking has came as a complete shock to me as my 10yr old DD has always been a great sleeper but I did cc with her which was easier as there was no one else to wake up other than us.

I think 12hrs is too long at that age to go without a drink. Plus he could be teething perhaps?

How was last night Feb? We actually had a good night here (DS has been teething FOREVER), with just a quick resettle around 10ish and then one feed at 3ish. Awake for day at 6.30am. Woohoo!

From reading the Richard Ferber book about controlled crying, he doesn't actually recommend using the technique for dropping night feeds, so I haven't tried that. It did work for us when we needed DS to learn to settle himself to sleep so that he could cope without us going to him every hour.

He was very clingy during the day for a little while (think 1-3 days), which is something Ferber mentions as a possibility.

I appreciate that you wouldn't try CC without being absolutely desperate, as I have been there too! It's not something anybody does lightly. I would say perhaps try some other techniques which are recommended for dropping night feeds? Your a) is one of them, and the NCSS thread confused mentioned will probably have other ideas.

We managed to go from 3 to 2 night feeds by gradually increasing the gaps between feeds.

So if your DS wakes at 10, 1, 4 and 7 for feeds, on the first night you could try rocking/comforting him before feeding him at 10.30/2/5.30/7 (i.e. increasing the gaps between feeds from 3 to 3.5 hours). The next night you could try for gaps of 4 hours and that would get you to 11/3/7, i.e. only two night feeds. DH helped me with this when he had a few days leave, and although it was hard work, it did work out for us.

Last night went really well. DS woke at 9 but DH went up to him and he fell asleep straight away. He then slept until 4am and dh went in and he resettled straight away. He woke at 5.30 so I feed him and he slept with us until 8!!

Maybe he is getting the picture. It is so much nicer not having him cry. I think he must have only cried for a total of 2 mins last night!!

I hope this is the start of things to come.

Glad to hear that it sounds as if things are getting better. If he's clingy during the day, just give him lots of cuddles and 1 to 1, and it should settle quite quickly.

Hope tonight goes as well for you.