Not out of the woods yet, but...

[jamandjerusalem]

DS slept for 12 hours last night! I can't believe it.

He's 2.1, been averaging 10 hours, multiple wakings in the night, getting up at 5-5.30am, terrible grump in the day.

Thanks to advice on here, we limited his day naps over the past two days from 2 hours down to 1.25-1.5. I also gave him snacks before bed last night.

Woo hoo! Long may it continue

J&J - very jealous indeed! sounds like we have very similar nights with our lo's - so what did you change exactly? DS did managed 10 hours straight last night which was a first in months - up at 5am but not complaining as best in ages.

Ok, here's how ideal day for DS now looks:

7.30-8ish - big breakfast, followed by activity with lots of running around and energy burning.

12 - lunch, hopefully activities of morning will have worked up good appetite

1 - nap for 1.25-1.5 hours. Wake DS up by 3pm absolute latest, DS not happy, bribe with promise of exciting afternoon activity.

2.30/3ish - snack, then more running around and vigorous exercise (DS sounding like a red setter or something)

5/5.30ish - tea time - something filling, carb-y (mashed potato or something)

5.45/6ish - up to DS room, quiet time with books low key activities.

6.30 - start running bath, more quiet play, into bath 6.45 ish.

7 - into DS's room, pyjamas, milk, low sugar snack - moon biscuits or something - then 2 books. LOTS of reminding DS what happens next, nearly time to sleep, going in cot soon. Last book with DS lying down in cot. Lights out, maybe a story in the dark. Leave him.

Long and faffy bedtime routine (and much earlier than we had been doing) but prior to doing this DS hadn't wound down enough and was yodelling for sometimes an hour before falling asleep 8.30-9. Then up 5.30 was just not enough sleep. This routine seems to send him off straight away, or 30 mins max.

Oh, and the other thing is no TV at any time of day, as I read it can reduce melatonin (sleep hormone) levels by 30%.

Obviously all kids are different, but after much research and tinkering here and there, this finally worked. Although it could be a fluke! Pray for me tonight/tomorrow morning.

And I'm anticipating DS dropping the daytime nap at some point soon, but on balance I'd rather he got a full nights' sleep than napped. Although I'll really miss this lovely break

Hope you find something that works for you and your DS x

J&J - how did you get on last night?

I can't work out what to change with DS here - 4.30am this morning.

He has btw 1 hr and 1.5 each lunchtime at around 12-2.30 depending on how tired he is.

He is pretty full on all day long - not one for sitting quietly and watching tv.

Bedtime rountine starts at 6pm and he is normally asleep about 7.15/30 and as a general rule settles down quite quickly other than the other week when he went mad having got back from holiday and was in hinsight really unsettled.

But these early mornings have been going on for over a year now - do you think his wake up time is so ingrained in him now that it will be impossible to change?

Not as brilliant last night, but not too awful. Took him half an hour to go off to sleep, but was gone by 8ish. He then woke and grumbled on two occasions before we even went to bed - maybe 10 and then 10.45 - but we left him as he wasn't really crying.

DH and I both woke at 5am and were pinned to the bed with anxiety, watching the clock and hoping DS wouldn't wake. Think we must've both gone back off around 5.45/6ish, and DS finally woke at 6.30am. So 10.5 hours - not as great as the night before but not too awful. (He'd only had an hour and a quarter nap that day, but was a bit wired as DH came in from work after bath and took over from me.)

Hmm, I'm not sure what to suggest Broms. I'm for you seeing what time you wrote your post. Sounds like a year might well be a very ingrained habit... have you tried wake-to-sleep?

PS Have you ever tried cutting out the daytime nap altogether? I have a friend who did this for a few weeks, it made the nightime sleep better and her DD naturally started napping in the day again a month or so later.

Also, there's another thread somewhere in 'Sleep' where someone talks about a tip in the Ferber book where you work out what the average length of night time sleep is for your DS and work it back from when you want them to wake. So for you if your DS sleeps 10 hours and you want him up at 7am, you put him down at 9pm. Then, when he's been waking at 7am for a bit, you gradually, 15 minutes every few days, make the bedtime earlier and earlier until you are happy with the amount of sleep they get. I am a bit about this as no matter what time my DS goes down it tends to have no bearing on his waking time (and in fact sometimes making it worse) but you have to go with what might work for your DS I suppose.

Thanks for the advice - my DS same as yours - no matter what time you put them down they wake the same time (or earlier....) - wake to sleep has never worked for us - his wake up times really vary from 4am to 5.15am so its hard to know when to do it. Dropping the nap could be worth another try - its just so hard when the day is so long (for both of us). I think I am going to try a later bedtime for 2 weeks at 8pm and see if anything changes. Going to wait til my DH gets back from business trips as don't want to be doing it all on my own in the morning and in the evening though. 15 hour day with DS might send me over the edge!