At end of my tether with 12 wk ds

[downbutnotout]

Can't stop crying - ds is 12wks and a worse sleeper at this stage than my dd (I didn't think this was possible). He will only sleep at night on me (either on my lap or chest) and by feeding to sleep and I find it impossible to relax and sleep properly as he slips off me no matter how I arrange us both. He won't feed lying down - I have tried and tried. Last night I tried feeding him till just asleep then putting him in cot. Result: he slept in the cot twice all night for 35 and 20 min respectively (eveyr other time it took 1-8 mins before he woke up and cried), I didn't sleep at all till I gave up at 5.20 and took him into bed with me. I am so tired my relationships with dd and dh are deteriorating and I am terrified that ds will slide off me and be hurt at night. I don't know what to do - I can't face controlled crying and there seems to be no guarantee it will work anyway.

Sorry you are suffering like this downbutnotout. It can be hell on earth when they don't sleep like this - I do remember how it felt.

He is way too young to do CC - 6 mths is the minimum for that.

I do not have any bright ideas though, I'm afraid, other than wondering how he would be if you put him to sleep on his front?

I know it is not recommended because the potential SIDS but some babies prefer it and your DS obviously likes sleeping face down on your chest.

Alternatively, could you wear a sling in bed to keep him in place, or maybe swaddle him to you with a cot sheet? You wouldn't have to worry about him falling off you then and it might help you both relax.

Hang in there though - it won't last forever, honestly it won't.

downbut, that could have been me as DS wouldn't sleep unless he was on me either. Trouble is it's a vicious circle, as he must be exhausted too, so more stressed, so needs you more iyswim. I agree with Niecie you can't do cc, but equally you can't go on like that or you'll be ill. Have you tried lying him down next to you and putting your hand on his tummy? If he cries, stay lying very very close next to him, so he can feel your warmth. Sing softly to him, keeping a gentle hand round him. Stay as calm as you can and as consistent as you can. You're there for him so it's not cc, you're just comforting him in a different way. Put earplugs in even to make it more tolerable. Agree a time with yourself and have a clock. Be determined not to pick him up in that time. It'll seem like an age, but I'd say try five minutes first time and make sure you don't pick him up, or get upset as he'll pick up on it. Stay very still and very calm, but make sure he can feel you're there for him. It's really hard, but you have to let him see that there are other ways to sleep, and that you're just as much there for him. Not sure if it'll work - it did for us when our son was about three months old. Let us know you're okay. Am sending you a hug, as I do so remember those days..

I was just reading Smee's post and suddenly thought I forgot to mention singing but then got to the bit where she suggests it too.

It worked for us - just a few whispered lullabys if you can summon the energy.

Is there anybody who can take him for a little while, take him out for a walk whilst you get a bit of sleep. Mine both calmed down in the pushchair or car. You need them out of the house though or you won't relax enough to sleep.

Thanks for the sympathy - that helps as much as anything!

I think I may have one last try at feeding lying down as he was a bit smaller when I last tried and he may find it easier now. I will also use the lullabies idea. Basically I'm not a natural co-sleeper so I find the whole thing quite difficult. I also worry about him rolling out of the bed. This parenthood lark isn't for wimps, is it?

Obviously he is comfortable and secure laying on you,but you need for your health and his eventual independence from you,to "retrain" him.

It will be a few nights of potentially no sleep and feeling at your wits end,but if you stick with it,he will get used to the "rule changes".

Its the continuity that is really important if you change your "routine" and thats the hardest bit for you.

maybe try it at the weekend when DH can help,or at least take him out during the day between feeds so you can get some rest.

IME its the security and comfort he wants,so you need to provide this in another way.As Smee suggests,try laying him down close to you,or in his Moses Basket preferably,but be prepared that you will be there for some time. Feed him,wind him,and then swaddle him,if he'll tolerate it,so he feels like he's being held securely,put him on his side,and pat his back,and shush him,sing,or talk in quiet reassuring voice.

If he cries just continue,he just wants to know you are there,and he'll be unsettled as he will be used to sleeping on you. Imagine its your 3 year old and you are teaching him something new,it'll take 2-3 nights,but it will come, he'll recognise your sleep cues that you give him, if they are the same each time.If he gets really distressed pick him up for a minute,soothe him and lay him back down asap,and start again with a pat and a shush etc.

All 3 of my DC's were different in their patterns,but this always worked eventually with them,they just need time to get used to the new pattern.

No definitely not for wimps.

The SAS and their sleep deprivation training have nothing on what new mothers have to deal with.

Good luck.

Brings back so many memories. I found out that my little one was suffering from chronic heartburn and reflux even though it didn't always present itself in the usual vomiting way. I also have a friend who experienced the same. Both children appeared to want to sleep with mother. Maybe you have thought of this already? Worth mentioning. Just to let you know, it did pass! Sounds like getting you some serious rest is the first step to coping - easier said than done I know!

Hopefully you'll be able to walk away,when he gets sleepy,and eventually you'll be able to lay him down,pat his back once or twice,and then not return to him until the next feed.

I always found if I started something "new" like this,I would say "Right,I'm going to do this for 3 nights,and its going to be hell".
If it was less than that,or you start to see an improvement its easier to deal with,if you have "set aside" this time to get things back on track again.

my ds is 11 weeks he likes being swaddled really tight and held really tight (he "preferred" Dad [grin})gradually we are "weaning" him off the degree of tightness iyswim. best of luck hon

stupid one handed typing I meant

Poor you. Could you try lying him on his side, bolstered by blankets either side? It worked for a friend with similar difficulties.

I was rubbish at the laying down latch initally, but got the hang of it later on. Agree worth retrying it.

Lots of luck. x

My DD wouldn't sleep at first either and after 3 and a half weeks, I caved in and took her into bed with me. We eventually did sleep training at 8 months and it worked.

I wasn't a natural co-sleeper either, but see if you can buy, beg, borrow, or steal one of those guards that you use for toddlers when they move up to a big bed. I had that on the outside of the bed, so knew she wouldn't fall out. And remember that as long as you stick to the co-sleeping guidelines (don't drink, take drugs or put tinies in between you), you'll be ok. I used to wake and find I hadn't moved.

I really sympathise and hope you find a solution. And agree with whoever it was who said get someone to take the DCs out for a little while. Just to give you some breathing space. Best of luck.

Thanks all - was feeling better because of the sunshine but am now dreading the night again, but can get through with your support.

Sawyer about how long did it take for your dcs to get the message (I'm hoping the answer isn't too off-putting!!)?

No,really we allowed a week,but it was 3 nights.
Obviously as they are so young they will wake up a little earlier than "expected" occasionally.

But on the whole they would respond to the "Sleep Cues" pretty quick by the 3rd night.

IME its alot easier at this age than trying to "correct" their sleeping habits at 8 months+.

Sounds like his sleeping "prompts" are BF and laying on your chest,ideal for him but not for you.Just "replace" the prompts with "new" ones,he'll soon cotton on.But you really have to be prepared to stick with it,in exactly the same way for 3-7 nights.

Don't know if this is any help, but here's what I did:

I took one side off the cot and pushed it tight up against my bed. I put a small quilt over the "join". I put a sheet over the cot mattress and as far across my bed as it would go, tucking it under the "far side" of the cot mattress. I then smoothed it over my mattress so that I could lie on it.

That way I could have dd next to me, and feed her easily, but couldn't roll onto her, and she couldn't fall anywhere IYSWIM.

It was a bit awkward feeding her on the side furthest from the cot, but I used to give her that side first, then finish lying down, on the nearest side.

It doesn't last forever. But it is really hard while you are going through it.

Hi Downbutnotout, sorry you're having such a crappy time; there are loads of good suggestions, can I add mine?

DS (21 weeks) is also a rubbish sleeper and will only sleep on his front unless in bed with me. My technique has been to shush-pat for a set time of 5 mins - sometimes just working through the howling - which almost always works. If I listen carefully to him, he usually does three 'crescendos' before he settles and the temptation is always to pick him up and then start all over again (DH always caves!) but I know now that he will eventually settle. If he's still yelling after 5 mins then I pick him up and cuddle him and double-check nappy, wind, hunger etc.

When he was wee and I was scared of squishing him we used a snugglenest which meant he could lie on his front in bed with me but not be on my soft mattress. Now he's a bit bigger he'll lie on his back while we co-sleep and I just stroke his head and shush him if he stresses out.

We've also got a very set routine at bedtime with sleep cues like the music we listen to and his special blanket. I also used to dread bedtime but it's now my favourite part of the day and I think DS would say the same!

Would like to add that it's not as though he sleeps through the night though, he's just better than he used to be! I thoroughly recommend co-sleeping if you can get your head round it. I would never have thought of doing it without MN and it's saved my life.

Have you considered an Amby Hammock? www.ambybaby.com/

Thanks all - I have managed to persuade him to feed lying down for the past few nights which feels like a major achievement and has been much more restful. Once we've got that sorted I will tackle the feeding to sleep issue. Thanks again - support really does make a difference.