Ok, so how do you get a baby to go to sleep? (bit long and rambly sorry!)

[pookamoo]

4 week old DD.
She is our first DC so DH and I are feeling totally clueless here! I'm sure it is the same for everyone, but we are looking for a bit of advice (actually, can anyone just tell us how to do it?!!)

I BF her and she usually drops off to sleep. She rouses slightly as I put her down... and then, her eyes ping open and she is grizzly and wide awake. We have tried warming her bedding so she doesn't go into a cold bed, but it doesn't work and she won't settle. She does get quite windy.

She'll sleep if she's being held, or at least be quiet, but when she's not being held, she grumps. She'll sleep on DH's chest or on my lap, and although I can have her in a sling in the day it doesn't work at night!

We have had a few good nights, but many more not so good. Last night she was awake from 8pm until 5am. Christmas eve it was 6am.

She hasn't let us put her down all day today apart from two "playtime" sessions on a rug. I REALLY don't want to leave her to cry, but what other options do I have? It's breaking me down, as I can't continue to function on 3 hours sleep a night.

We had a lot of feeding problems to start with, maybe that has caused it? She is very sucky but won't take a dummy although will suck DH's finger until it is raw.

Please help!!!!

(DH just said let's try her in our bed [which doesn't really seem to work anyway] when she goes to sleep we'll go in the spare room! - getting desperate here!)

I'm not sure my experience is going to help you - I co-slept with DS for the first 5 1/2 months (DH elected to sleep elsewhere so he could get some sleep because "he has to go to work you know, so needs his sleep" .

When i put DS into his cot though, I did use a hotwater bottle to warm the sheets up so he didn't notice the transition. He still feeds to sleep now, aged 1; if he won't go off, I rub his feet or his tummy (or both alternately) and that seems to help.

Good luck!

dammit, forgot to say that OF COURSE I took the hotwater bottle out again before I put DS in the cot!

Have you tried swaddling before feeding? I'd then wait until she's really quite deeply asleep before putting her down, then gently patting her and shushing as you put her down. Don't let go of her until you're sure she's asleep.

In the night I'd consider co-sleeping though - it makes life much easier as you can sleep when she feeds and she'll probably just fall asleep at the end of a feed.

I'm afraid to say that IMHO they don't have a sleep pattern as such in those first few weeks.It DOES get better though.

I spent the first few weeks with both mine sleeping over my shoulder/on my chest,and we co-slept which was good when bf as you could just put them onto the breast and doze your self.Their tummies cannot cope with too much milk at this age and they need 2-3 hourly feeds,well mine did at least.

I got vey informed about the world as watched endless bbc news 24 and those signing programmes :O

Not sure if I'm being much help,but they do gain a pattern eventually,and it becomes easier.

I co-slept too. It broke me. Then DH took babe and kept putting him in cot...taking him out of cot as he pinged awake...putting him in cot...etc....all through night.

His own room really helped as he stopped listening for me getting to bed.

Now babe sleeps from 7 until 1 is up for an hour back down until about 5.30 am

hi thumbwitch, yep, tried the hot water bottle.
just bfing her again now as she woke when she was moved all of 3 feet away from me and screamed herself into a complete tizz. looks like another long night chez pookamoo!

I think (and this is just me, mind) that 4 weeks is still very soon and it will do no harm to have her with you for most of the time and try to use your instinct a bit. With both our dds, they stayed with us through the evening (i.e. not going to 'bed' at a set time) until they were about 12 weeks. and those 12 weeks were magical, holding them and feeding them while we sat up and then we took them to our room with us and used the cot in our bedroom.

Dd1 was very good at establishing her own pattern really and soon slept through the night and we moved her into her own room at about 4 months.

Dd2 was a bit rubbish at being in her own cot and wanted human contact a bit more. We co-slept most nights and some she slept in her cot in her room. She didn't sleep through until she was 2 !!!!!!!!! but that's more to do with the type of child she is. She still used to go to bed at a decent time as soon as she was 3 months old so putting her down wasn't an issue; she just always woke in the night and needed settling.

One approach - newborns [and she is tiny although I know that you feel you have been awake for 20 years] have no routine and will do nothing for no one. Do whatever works as long as it is basically safe and sleep when she does, even if it's for 30 mins.

second - I wonder if she is not getting enough sleep [don't shoot me obviously she isn't] but unlike adults, I think the less babies sleep the more unable they are to sleep, the more tired they get the less likely they are to sleep. That was our experience.
Swaddle her, feed her, squirt milk in her bed and lie her on a top of yours.

Do ANYTHING to get her to sleep, and only count on it being for 2 hours. Then up for a bit/a feed/a look about then another 2 hours. Drive her in the car, walk her in the buggy at 2 am, anything. If she closes her eyes then sleep where you fall.

She has no interest in a day night routine yet so don't even go there.

Its farking awful,I remember it well(It is indelibly burned into my brain,and YES I did it twice) but just keep repeating the mantra "It will get better".You are tired,exhausted,sleep deprived and feeling like shite...It WILL get better.

It will get better. This is how it is for the majority of people I think.

The tiredness is truly vomit inducing. LEARN QUICK how to sleep for short periods at odd times.

treedelivery you have summed it up! she's so overtired it's not true. I won't shoot you, it does seem to be exactly that. i think i need to read the 3 in a bed book!

not looking for a routine, i know she's too little, just tips really.
it's a good job she's so cute is all i can say!

Then your doing fab because I think it took me 6 months to realise that!!

3 weeks.

Am in denial about the actual baby care involved.

hmmmmm mine used to sleep in their bouncy chair in front of the telly but not in bed. i spent many a night on the sofa. only up to about 8 weeks i think.... good luck!

pookamoo do you co sleep?

also try swaddling. ds was swaddled until 15 months.

You do whatever it takes!! With dd1 this often meant us doing futile but lengthy car journeys, just to get some sanity. As others have said IT DOES GET BETTER! Hold that thought, and in the meantime sleep when you can, bf when you need to, get as much rest as you can in between.

Elevate your baby's head -- thick stack of books under the one side of the cot/rolled up towel under the head side of the mattress, etc. Once your baby falls asleep, don't put her down immediately but wait 5-10 min until she's in a deep sleep. It is apparently the vertical movement that wakes them up, so minimise the vertical displacement that you move her through when putting her down. We used a Fisher Price Rocker in reclined position and would put it onto the bed to transfer him, then move it onto the floor. He would also not sleep in a cot and has never self-settled. (I won't scare you with how old he is now!)

swaddle,swaddle swaddle-if you are bf to sleep wait a while and still wind till you put her down...lots of feeds on the day so they are nice and full at nighttime-dream feed at 10 andso on- i found pick up and put down really succesful...good luck!!!

have you tried a bedside cot/crib? I had exactly the same experience as you are having and it has helped enormously. I start the night by feeding to sleep lying facing the cot in bed and gently move baby into cot once she's well gone. If she stirs I try rubbing tummy in clockwise direction and singing gently. If that dosn't work after 30 minutes of continuous rubbing I feed her to sleep again. Throughout night I feed her to sleep in lying down position and sometimes I fall asleep with baby in the bed. Not ideal, but she always goes longer between feeds if she does end up in the bed with us. We are still doing this at 13 weeks and know eventually we'll have to try self settling....
Bedside cribs can be bought from an Austrian company on E-bay ( we couldn't fit a full-szie bedside cot in our bedroom).

we had same issue for weeks - our DS is now 8 weeks and goes down much much better now but I know how it feels to be up all hours with a screaming baby and feel like it will never end.

If she's windy, get her on infacol - I know some people it hasn't worked for but it does for most. It's cumulative so give it a few days to work. Raise the head of the moses basket so again she can get wind up easier.

Our DS gets overtired seriously easy and we just do anything we can to get him to sleep - if once in a while he settles himself then all the better, so rock, feed, soothe sing, try dark room and ssshhing (DS needs some light, other babies need complete blackout).

It really honestly does get easier, and now I've thrown all the books about routines etc out the window I'm tuning into DS much better now and reading his tired signs so getting him to sleep befre complete meltdown

good luck!

oh also meant to add - yes swaddling do try it. Also what kind of dummy are you trying? DS is a veyr sucky baby too and I thought he wouldn't take a dummy - then got him a cherry dummy (from boots), the teat is much rounder and looks huge but he's really taken to it and it helps calm him down enormously - especially dipped in gripe water

Going through this too at mo with dd 6.5 weeks. What has helped me is a blanket rolled up to nest her in, a hot water bottle in her bed before she gets in and best thing so far is swaddling for us. Brought a swaddling blanket from mothercare and it is great as wraps them in really tight, not like my half hearted attempts with a blanket. I use infacol for the wind and I use it before each breast night time. Dummy works for us had to really kind of hold it in to get her used to it, but its working.

Just to say as well I am dealing with it so much easier this time round as I know it is hard but it does not last forever, she is my third. Remember with ds2 only getting 1 and half hours sleep one night then having to look after him and ds1 who was only 13 months hiself. Remember thinking he would never sleep through. Now he is 2 (happened way before this) he sleeps 13 hours a night.

If you get a special swaddling blanket try to get a cotton one rather than a fleece one.

pookamoo, just wanted to say that we have been through exactly the same thing, DD is now 6 wks old. So you are not alone! I was despairing and then was advised by a bf counsellor to co-sleep - brilliant! Was worried bout it becoming a long-term habit but after week or 2 of co-sleeping, I am now able to feed DD to sleep, wait about 20 min for really deep sleep then very carefully transfer her to a bedside moses basket (warmed and with rolled up blankets to make it snug as others have also advised!). I know this is still not ideal ans she does still wake again sometimes, but for us it is real progress! So try not to worry, things will get better! In the meantime, co-sleeping may at least mean that the baby gets enough sleep and may prevent over-tiredness so help to break the cycle, if you see what I mean.

Also we are now using a vibrating bouncy chair for most of the daytime naps and for the sleep up until we go to bed and she is now able to self-settle in this - abeit it with the chair vibrating and playing a kind of white noise... again not ideal but a step in the right direction I think!

Have you tried taking her out for walks in the pram/sling during the day to encourage napping?