I think this has gone on long enough now

[annmar]

DD2 is 19mths. She has never slept through.
One stint of 3 or 4 hours followed by several 1 hour naps is a good night.

If I can stop breastfeeding her during the night will this stop her waking up?

We both need more sleep, but I'm not really prepared to go through the trauma of stopping feeding if it won't have any effect on her ability to sleep.

How do I know if she's waking up for a comfort suck or if she really needs something more? Last night she fed for over an hour, then woke up 10mins later and had another half an hour of milk.

I'm really struggling for ideas, I don't want to go down the regimented routine route as neither DH nor I are any good at sticking to routines.

Any suggestions gratefully accepted. TIA

It's probably no help to you, but stopping bf DS at about 21 months had no impact at all on his rubbish sleeping.

About the comfort versus need thing, I think needing milk at night is a bit unlikely at this age - she may well be taking a lot of milk, but with a bit of rejigging she could take it in the day and go for longer without at night, without suffering. Whether that will get her to sleep better or not is another question though...

Thanks.

I have a feeling that the problem at the moment is teething/nasty cold.

I might try to cut back gradually and see if it has any effect.

I agree with CK. My DD's sleep didn't improve massively when I stopped BFing (it did a little) but she was much easier to settle and I did end up getting more sleep. (we co-slept) At 19 months I doubt she needs to feed rather she wants the comfort, which you could give her in a different way ie cuddle if it makes it easier for you.

Does she settle herself to sleep from awake?
Often the problem can be that baby needs the suck reflex to settle to sleep.

If DH takes her to bed she will eventually fall asleep.

If she wakes up before midnight, she will fall asleep just laid on my knee.

When she wakes up after midnight, she starts to scream and pull at my clothes for milk.

I know its habit, just not sure I want to go through a week or so of sleepless nights, if she's still not going to sleep through.

Not necessarily any need for sleepless nights
I'd suggest trying to introduce a bath/feed/bed/story routine.
You could still stay with her while she slept and then use gradual withdrawal once she was used to the routine?
Also, you say you're not hot on routine, but it's the same things in the same order that matter, not necessarily at the same time so it doesn't have to be too restrictive.

(FWIW, my 7 month old was waking every two-three hours for a feed until I introduced this routine, he now sleeps 6-6!!)

We do more or less the same thing each night.

I think I'm struggling, because although DD1 was a bad sleeper, she wasn't this bad and just sorted herself out eventually.

All I can add really is sympathy, DS is very much the same. I just feed him when he needs fed and usually it's fine but when he's teething it's really incessant and I get sore and tired and grumpy and sick of it and then I feel like I have to do something to sort it out and then I feel crap for keeping back the one thing he wants when he feels rotten and it's all just pants. Then it passes off and he settles down and I can tolerate it again.

I too am worried that if I stop BFs I'll then have no way of comforting him and we'll all actually get less sleep!

If you work out the answers, let me know

Does she fall asleep in her cot/bed alone?

She mostly falls asleep in her bed with DH sat at the other side of the room.

We moved her into a bed recently because she managed to fall out of the cot a couple of times.

She likes the bed, just not keen on sleep.

Iatemakkapakka thats exactly how I feel.

Molars/canines are hell. That all-night-boobfest is what I had every night for 5 monhts unless DS was medicated for the teething pain. On pain-free nights in between he'd "only" wake up 2-3 times. Night weaning stops some kids waking up, not others.

DS is now 21 months and he's learning to self sooth. He'll roll over in his sleep and ask for milk and I'll say "shh, sleepy time" and sometimes by the time DH or I get to the bedroom he's asleep again. I have started saying "no milk, your tummy is full of milk, roll over and let mummy rub your back." It works sometimes, other times he gets upset and I let him latch on, but he comfort sucks and then holds the nipple so I pull him off and then he's happy to roll over again and go to sleep.

He has a big wee around 11pm and that always wakes him up and then he has a good feed after that. Now he tosses and turns for a good 20 minutes after that feed with me intermittently rubbing his back. After I'm in bed when he wakes up he comes in with us; if anything it's because his cot is side-car style and so before I get in bed I nurse him with him lying in his cot and by the time I come to bed it's time for the other boob, which we both fall asleep during.

I plan to night wean gently at 24 months by telling him that the boobies are sleepy and he can have milk in the morning. His speech and understanding are quite advanced, so I think in 3 months time he'll be okay with this. He will still probably wake up a fair bit, and probably still want me rather than DH, but he'll get there when he's ready.

ches: you sound so accepting and calm, it gives me hope

annmar: it's lovely to know I'm not the only one (sorry!)

annmar I don't know if you'll see this post but I wanted to add that recently DS has started to grasp the concept of "all gone" in relation to food, drinks etc. I have been trying this with breasts in the last couple of days and he does seem to be slightly more accepting of me telling him the milk's "all gone" than he was of me telling him he'd had enough now and could he please just stop sucking and go to sleep! Don't know if it'll help you - he's still displeased but it's less of a sustained fight I think