Night weaning gone wrong?

[Faithless04]

I am absolutely at my wits end so please no comments saying to just do nothing.

I have a 6 (nearly 7) month old who doesn’t sleep. Last week I reached my limit and decided to night wean him. He had been waking every hour and wouldn’t go back to sleep until I breastfed him. However, this was just resulting in him obviously being over fed and being sick after every feed and waking up more because he was uncomfortable. Last Thursday I decided I was going to stop feeding him at night (between 8pm - 5am) as he was doing well with solids and having lots of feeds in the day. For reference, he is in age 12-18 month clothes so he is not being deprived in any way.

The first night went so much better than I imagined. He slept from 8 until 10:30ish and when he woke, I was able to get him back to sleep without much crying. It took about two/three hours but he only really fussed and I just held his hands/rocked him/cuddled him and he eventually fell asleep. After that initial period on the first night, he still woke every hour but I was able to go to him and put his dummy back in and he went straight back to sleep.

The second night, he woke at 10 and 2:30 but I was able to just replace dummy and he went straight back to sleep. I was very happy. Both days he woke at 5am and I fed him at this time.

Around the 3rd and 4th night it was a bit more difficult to settle him when he woke. By the 5th night he was back to the way he was at first, he was screaming again to be fed. I tried to persist but he woke every hour again. I fed him at 2am thinking he must have been hungry but if anything that made it worse and he was more unhappy afterwards.

Tonight is night 7, I’ve tried Calpol, bonjela, feeding him whenever he wants and it’s by far the worst night. He’s been sick loads, we’re both drenched. He’s also woke maybe 10 times? And this is all before 1am. I don’t know what to do. I am seriously having very dark thoughts. I cannot keep going in this way. I cannot listen to the screaming any more. I don’t know how I get it so wrong. I want to be responsive to his needs but is it really helping him to be feeding him every 20/30 minutes and him being so full he’s in pain and being sick constantly.

Please someone give me some advice. What could be causing this to have gone so well and made so much progress to just suddenly go back to square minus 1?!

ETA: he has had bottles before and still does have them if I go out in the daytime. They don’t seem to make any difference to his waking though I haven’t tried bottles at night since night weaning.

Aw OP. Hello there. It can be so hard...the exhaustion, the screaming, the confusion. I hear you.

Firstly it will all pass. I have 3 DC. It always passes eventually.

Secondly the extremely frequent waking, the constantly wanting to breastfeed etc is normal and common. I know that doesn't help you in the moment but hopefully may provide some reassurance that this is normal infant behaviour - it's nothing that you have done that is causing this.

The downside of it not being caused by you means that as parents we have limited ability to change / influence infant sleep safely. The BASIS website by Durham university has lots of evidence based info about infant sleep which might be helpful to read.

All that being said, the vomiting/posseting that you are describing, how often is that happening and how long has it been happening with that frequency? It sounds like reflux. My DC3 was the only one of mine that was refluxy and although it had stopped by around 6 months he remains our worst sleeper of the three. Anecdotally I've spoken to other mums who have had similar experiences so I wonder if there's a link there in terms of stomach discomfort. You say your baby is doing well with solids, that is great, however it can often cause tummy pain at night, again that could be a culprit potentially. My DC3 likewise has been worst affected by this and they're not even a huge solids eater get at 10 months but we've had many truly awful nights with what has appeared to be tummy pain.

Finally even if I can do nothing to make your baby sleep better I just hope you can take some comfort in being heard. And you WILL all get through it and it WILL pass.

Calpol sometimes makes my baby sick up.
each night is different with a baby , mines now 16 months and still not night weaned but as he’s older we give some cows milk in a bottle before bed and then sips of water throughout the night if he needs and then that really helps him only go onto the boob for a few mins a night if that. It’s happened kind of gradually and without really trying so I’m hoping he’ll soon just wean himself off boob completely .
it’s hard because being on the boob soothes them no matter what the problem is, it can help them to fart too if they have an uncomfortable stomach. Weaning often can make their tummies sensitive at night- they’re trying so many new foods and it’s all new to their digestive system. Try to do new foods around breakfast time so that they are having things they’re used to at dinner time and it’s all had time to digest fully (or still just milk at six months I can’t remember if it’s one food meal a day at that age)

The crying and all the vomiting sounds like reflux…stomach acid climbing back up and causing awful trapped wind, burning and tummy ache. You could try propping the head end of the cot up with a book under each of the two legs (doesn’t have to be a thick book!). Try winding him really gently and high up on your shoulder, gentle taps on his back, but do it for ages, 20 minutes is what I was advised. If he’s lying on his back you could try pushing his feet up towards his tummy, bending his legs, this helps release wind. Also bicycling his legs will help.

Finally you can get a supplement/medicine from the doctor, I can’t remember it’s name, that helps thicken the milk in his stomach so the contents are less likely to escape.

Consider what he’s eating before bedtime, are any of the foods gas-producing? Did he have dairy? Could there be an intolerance? Dairy intolerance is known to cause wind and tummy ache.

i hope some of these tips help, an unhappy baby and exhausted mummy is no fun at all.

Hey thanks all of you for your responses. I really appreciate the time you’ve taken to read and respond to my melt down here.

So he is actually DC3 for me and yes they have all been reflux-y. However, whilst they are vomiting frequently they don’t seem to be in pain or discomfort. This baby wasn’t sick as much as a newborn but seemed to be more frequent from about 4 months, I only started solids from 6 months so I don’t think it’s related to that. I did give DC2 thickeners but it made things worse overall so I’m reluctant to do that again. Honestly, I really don’t think he’s in pain I just think he only knows how to go back to sleep with a boob in his mouth but then is way too full. I have tried picking him up to wind him after a feed but then this wakes him up more and he is crying to be fed again to put himself back to sleep and the cycle continues. DC1 had this issue too which was why I tried the night weaning. With her it took two nights and she slept 12+ hours ever since. I know they’re all different so was probably silly of me to expect the same or similar. I have been offering sips of water but he is very angry when he realises it is water and not milk.

I will take the advice of being more careful with what solids he has before bed. I have been giving him simplified versions of whatever we’re having for our dinner so it probably has been that he’s eaten the most late in the day. Thank you for that.

I want to do the right thing and respond to his needs. If it was helping to just feed him back to sleep I would do that but it seems to make him more and more angry. The times I am able to resettle him without milk, he seems to sleep much more comfortably and for longer stretches. But I don’t think my sanity can withstand endless hours of resettling each night. The fact he is DC3 and it’s the summer holidays also means I am like a zombie in the daytime with the older two.

Thank you for listening to me, it really does help to be heard.

I'm sorry I'm like a zombie myself with the sleep deprivation so totally get that, so forgive me if I missed this bit, do you have a partner who can help at night? My DH splits the load with me to some degree or frankly I wouldn't cope. Yes this does involve some prolonged periods of baby crying but as a general rule I don't breastfeed more often than two hourly, he will get him in between. He often cries after a breastfeed anyway and I physically cannot cope or safely stay awake with him without my DH's help. I find psychologically it helps me too that we are in a similar boat and we support each other with the awful night work. He also tries a couple of night feeds a week but our baby really still isn't keen on a bottle so they're not very successful but again they do buy me an extra hour of sleep. You will know that even a snatched hour here or there can be so precious! Occasionally I nap on the weekends or have a slight lay in after I've fed the baby if I'm really feeling broken, perhaps you could do?

You could consider visiting the GP and trialling medication for the reflux. But that could bring it's own side effects potentially and I hear you when you say you don't think it's pain related.

He’s way too young for night weaning firstly, bless him, and secondly, the reflux sounds terrible for him. He’s sounds like he’s in pain bless him. And obviously he’s seeking boob which is the only comfort he knows. You won’t help this situation by night weaning a baby desperate for comfort.

Crying for milk is often a pain signal for a baby. It’s how I figured out my baby had reflux and CMPA as she would cry constantly for feeding, as it comforts them and temporarily soothes discomfort.

I think go to doctors about the reflux. I’m not sure why you think he’s not in pain when he’s up half the night and vomiting?

So this is probably part of my stress. I do have a partner but I don’t think he’s very good at the nights. He does everything in the morning so I always have a lie in. The baby often wakes around 5 and he will happily get up with him and make him and girls breakfast, get them ready for the day, make their packed lunches etc. Most mornings the only thing I do is the girls’ hair, though if I’m particularly exhausted he’ll leave me sleep and do that too. He also uses his lunch break to come home and help me or if he’s got a late shift he’ll leave for an hour to do the girls’ bedtime so I can only focus on the baby. In general, he is very thoughtful and always thinks of me and how to make things better/easier for me. However, he has so little patience in the nights. He will tell me to wake him up if the baby wakes but when I do this, he is so clearly pissed off that the baby is crying and I feel this helps no one as the baby can sense this in my opinion. I have told him how unhelpful it is, I’ve pointed out that the baby has NO control over when he wakes. He is mostly frustrated because he can see the impact it’s having on me and feels like he is powerless to change it.

I understand the comments about reflux and I understand it sounds this way but when I’ve checked with GP and health visitor they don’t think it’s reflux. It’s really hard to explain without seeing it. I have had very sicky babies, I was a sicky baby too as was my dad. Maybe saying sick is the wrong word, he is also sick all day and will smile and laugh through it, it honestly does not bother him whatsoever. It’s actually as if he doesn’t notice it and there is no correlation with him being upright or on his back etc, he will just be sick. All day and night. Some babies take longer to stop this, but if it was causing him pain I am sure he’d let us know in the daytime too. I do think that when he feeds every 30mins/hour at night that he is too full and that that gives him pain which is why I was trying to reduce the night feedings. The other reason the HV and GP are not concerned is because this boy is huge. He weighs 23lbs guys, I am not starving him.

I get people have strong feelings about night weaning etc but I have said in this post I am struggling and really at my limit. I only want to do the right thing for him and me. I don’t think comments pitying him and making out as though I’m depriving him of comfort are helpful or kind. He’s never been left to cry alone and when I do think he is hungry and he’s clearly not resettling the same way he did at first, I have been feeding him.

Don't worry about those comments. I completely agree a medical issue would be an issue in daytime too not just overnight so totally understand your thinking on that. It's also really clear from your posts that you love and care for your little one. I do feel your partner should be assisting more at night by the sounds of it at least on some of those worst nights. It's good that he gets up with the kids but I'm presuming that doesn't put a dent in the lack of sleep you have compared to him? You know your baby doesn't strictly need breastfeeding every hour all night long so there's no reason for you to be the one stuck with all that settling. Maybe sit him down and have a serious conversation about it.

Thank you, honestly I really appreciate your kind responses and your advice. I’m going to do what you’ve said and speak to my partner about the nights. Do you think it’s unreasonable to say I will feed the baby maybe three times a night and otherwise we try to settle him without feeding? I don’t know if that’s too harsh too? I just don’t want to keep going as I am as I think it’s been getting worse not better when I was just following his lead. He seems so much happier when he’s had slightly more sleep.

I don't think that sounds unreasonable per se, no, but I will say I guess it does depend on your baby and I can't really say how often your baby needs feeding. In terms of a hunger/thirst/growth point of view. I guess this must vary a lot from baby to baby. I wouldn't say it was harsh to try and settle him without feeding in between either.

I don't think we have much control over their sleep though unfortunately. If you do get a chance to look at the BASIS website, there's lots of research there about infant sleep. Largely it shows that when parents do sleep training (I'm not saying you are, just in general), parents sleep better due to the lack of crying but the very few research studies that have actually wired babies up show absolutely no difference in their sleep. Which suggests the training doesn't train babies to sleep more or better, they still wake the same, the difference is just whether they cry out or not. That's lead me to believe there is very little we can do to change our baby's sleep. The only things we can do is work out how to best cope with it all really. And for me that has always meant DH helping to share the load.