Will DS ever sleep without milk?!

[zm31]

I feel really embarrassed writing this but I don't know what else to do.

For background, DS is 4 and has multiple food allergies and didn't start sleeping through comfortably till about 18 months old - he had awful reflux, stomach problems etc. He shares a bedroom with DD (6) which they both want to do.

For the past 3 months or so his sleep is getting worse again. They watch TV for 20 mins with the night light on and big light off, cuddles kisses and white noise is on and it's bed time. He goes to sleep with about 5oz of oat milk in a baby bottle. Yes I know he is too old to be doing this but I've tried everything I can think off, give the bottle to santa, easter bunny, water only, choose your own big boy cup etc

It's not really too much of a problem when he was sleeping through but now he wakes up at least 3 times a night and sobs and sobs if we don't give him some more oat milk in his bottle to get him back off to sleep

I ask in the daytime why he is struggling sleeping and he says he doesn't know. Could it be night terrors?

We have tried new bedding, a weighted blanket, we always say do you want to come in our bed and he says no

It's really beginning to get to me now the broken sleep as I'm pregnant. I don't know what else to do! Any advice?

Also I should add I was wondering if anyone else has struggled with this

After a bad night or two I can't sleep myself (hence posting this now) because I feel restless waiting for him to wake again. It's so tiring

That sounds hard, but I wouldn't give him the bottle. Within a few nights of fighting about it he'll accept that doesn't happen any more. Maybe pick a good time like weekend/when you're on half term etc to see it through so lack of sleep doesn't affect it.

DC used to get like that sometimes when much younger, taking them out of the room eg to bathroom with different light and temp sometimes used to make them snap out of it, sort of come to and want to go to sleep.

I'd give sips of water and cuddles but not a bottle of oat milk.

As he’s 4, his understanding should be a bit better. If he wants milk before bed that’s fine, but it needs to be in a cup. I understand how difficult it can be, as I have a child the same
age. Getting them to do something they don’t want to do is relentless and a lot of hard work!

Drinking milk from a bottle multiple times a night has turned into a comforting habit (but very bad for his teeth!) and it will be difficult to break, but I think you will have to be consistent and put up with some tough nights until he learns to stop asking for it.

Offer comfort, go into his room and calm him
down by a cuddle. I wouldn’t suggest allowing him into your room, particularly if you’re expecting baby #2. Rather than outrightly say no to a bottle of milk, offer an alternative e.g. you can have some water if you’re thirsty. It won’t be easy but hopefully over time he will learn.

Good luck!

Screen time just before bed isn’t a good idea. I’d cut that for a start.

Aside from the allergies does he have any actual developmental issues or SEN? If not then this is simply a habit that needs to be broken.
I would be starting by throwing out all bottles and finding a sensible alternative. He can have his milk before bed but no bottles.
Is there a reason for the TV before bed. Screens before bed like that are not recommended. May not be helping.
You’re going to have to get tough. And mean it.

I'd give bottles in the night but water. The sucking is soothing so this will be a sort of compromise but also get his stomach out of the habit of wanting the milk. Hopefully he we figure out that the water is not worth waking up for. Worked with mine although more like age 2.

He is trying to recreate the routine that gets him to sleep at bedtime, its actually a reasonable request of you look at it that way. The problem is that his bedtime routine isnt sustainable in the middle of the night when he stirs.

So you need to teach him a new bedtime routine that he can use when he stirs in the middle of the night, and then probably have a shitty few nights while he gets used to it. But everytime you let him have a bottle of oat milk before going to sleep you are training his brain that it must have a bottle before any sleep is possible

I think you'll have to go through thr pain of saying no until he realises the milk isn't coming back. It's terrible for his teeth, so he needs to find a new way to fall asleep.

I managed to solve this problem accidentally OP. We went on holiday and the milk tasted different and ds didn't like it. I think he eventually accepted orange squash but then did away with the bottle altogether after a night or two. Maybe offer something that looks like his usual milk but tastes different?

Have you tried slowly watering down the milk? Might be worth a shot. I wouldn’t be a big fan of suddenly taking comfort items off kids - slow and steady definitely. I sympathise - my middle child has been a complete nightmare to get to sleep.

I have a fast metabolism and drink milk to keep me through the night. If I wake, which is not often (I have a neighbour on call who wakes me revving his engine for example) , I need something in my tum to get back to sleep. Hubby wanders to the fridge for milk several times in the night every night. We are both in our 70s😂. He may be like us, so I would focus on just what is waking him rather than what he is drinking.

If he is just a light sleeper, oat milk can be left on his night stand, so he can feed himself without waking you - did this with my 4 year old - check that he is a) managing and b)not leaving the half drunk bottle in the bed to soak it for a few times and then leave him to it. Just don't engage with him at all. If this does not work, then try the opposite and just give him a quick cuddle and settle him back without anything.

If you are giving him a drink before bed time, then is it his bladder that is waking him

Thanks everyone for your responses. I really appreciate it, I think that watering down may be a better option for him as this is a 4 year habit that helps him get to sleep I think it has stemmed from having severe reflux so drinking milk to soothe his throat as a baby. Because back then he could drink SO much milk in a night he was very poorly with it 🙁

In regards to SEN I do question some of his traits and behaviours sometimes but I'm unsure whether it's of a typical 4 year old boy

Do you think going to the GP could help?

No harm in seeing the gp.
For me the milk itself is not the problem. My 2 had milk before bed for years. It’s the bottles and perhaps still having the milk to sleep with rather than as food.

Poor sleep in 4 year olds is not unusual, and while wearing, is not normally anything to worry about, but I am sure the doctor will be happy to take a look.

Is there anything that might be disturbing him:

• does he need the toilet when he wakes? If he is in the habit of going then, he may have developed poor bladder control.
• Is he comfortable in bed? (My brother had a new bed and could not settle - my parents put me into his bed for the night to diagnose, and it was the hardest bed, and it rustled)
• Are there any pipes in his room that might gurgle, or trees outside that rustle? Or rattly window?
• Is he disturbed by too much or too little light?

We moved house onto a main road so sometimes I think the cars could wake him up, but he has told me the new house is creaky so I think it may have set off nightmares/terrors as he doesn't specifically wake up saying I can hear noise etc. He's always half asleep and a bit out of it crying which makes me feel like they are terrors. He still wears a pull up to bed and is always wet in the morning regardless of whether he drinks or not in the night so I think he's not quite ready to be dry at night IYSWIM

Is there an opportunity to move him (or both of them)to another room just for a couple of nights to see if that helps?
Can you afford a new soundproof window?
Is your home older? then talk about the creaks being OK for an "old lady" house, so his subconscious is not frightened. Can you jump on the creaky floorboard or stairs to make a game of it. Can you fix any of them?
I guess, earphones and muffs are unlikely to be safe for a 4-year old, but you could ask your doctor. My sound sensitive grandson has a hooded sleep suit (you can get any type now from Spiderman to ManU) and a massive baby shark soft toy - sometimes the non-medical solutions work.
I wonder if it is the disruption of the move that has just extended his lack of sleep pattern and it may settle down.

Your stress may not help either - can your other half do the night runs to allow you a full night's sleep at least once per week?
I know this also sounds silly, but can you move the room around so his bed faces a different way, or just make his bed upside down. Weirdly some people are really sensitive to a change of direction.

Just to say it doesn’t sound like night terrors at all. DD had them and she would be screaming for us but we would be holding her unable to wake her up. It was truly terrifying. It’s common for anyone child or adult to have nightmares and talk in their sleep.

I also think try and not have screen time so close to bed as it can be overstimulating the brain… says me on my phone in bed…

I imagine the TV isn't helping at all. I believe the advice is to avoid screens for two hours before bed because the blue light disrupts their sleep. Could you transition them to audio books instead?

It's a habit and he Goes to sleep with a bottle of milk so hasn't learnt to go to sleep without milk when wakes up in the night

I would give the milk in a beaker before bedtime

Milk in bottles /teats overnight is bad for their teeth due to the sugar

So milk. Awake. Bed

He really shouldn’t be having milk in a bottle or milk in general before bed it’s very bad for teeth. I’d be strong and go cold turkey from now on. I also agree with pps, no tv before bed.

You just need to break the habit.

I was at breaking point with DC1 aged 3 back In Dec. They where waking 4-8 times a night for there bottle and some comfort.

I honestly couldn't take it anymore. DC2 was only a few months old but sleeping better.

Watering down bottles didn't work nor did offering alternatives. I felt like I was just prolonging it all so made a decision that DC1 had to go cold turkey. No more bottles at bed time or during the night. It took 6 days but they are now sleeping through.

I have awful guilt that I did them a disservice, by letting it carry on rather than just staying strong and stopping it years ago.